Looking ahead, Planning Location (real estate, farming, lake, acre)

[Tahoe24]

Hello, Brand new to the web site. Browsed around a couple days and thought I would ask for some well put input as I see other people getting.

I'm 21 living at lake Tahoe california and love it for now. But looking ahead I want to live in a rural area and wanted to see if what I want exists or something close to it where I can compromise.

I have my own business that runs from home and never meet with customer so I can go anywhere but mainly looking at MT, WY, CO. I want acreage where I can do what I want when I want and not see my neighbors. Pee off my back porch with no worries. I could live in boonies as far as Im concerned but need internet (satellite internet will probably be the best option for what I am looking for, which isnt a problem) I want to be able to have large garden and sustain myself. I would love mountains and snow if possible, a little river is something I would really enjoy but dont have to have. I dont mind driving couple hours to an airport or to market. Would like to make maybe a trip every couple months and stock up and just live on my own with my necessities until I feel need to go back. Don't Need large social if any social, I am very independent. Chickens and little personal livestock to provide for myself. Not a big fan of restrictions. Also far enough away from police/sheriff where you don't call them for little things, hence the independence I am looking for.

I know this is a bit of a wide range. If you guys could narrow it down or had questions for me to help you, that would be great. Looking ahead and trying to find the right location/ cites. {ie not Northern Montana. but a particular town or area around a town would be great!}

Thanks for help in advance, I have already learned a lot from everyone on these threads.

[Lily0fthevalley]

Just some advice - when you're planning on having a place with a garden that "sustains" you, make sure to check into the local climate and soil. Vegetable gardens don't thrive in all places, especially in the states you're asking about. And when you're thinking about having chickens or other livestock do a LOT of reading about how to care for them properly.

Read Annie Proulx's "Birdcloud". I think it's a great lesson for those who idealize living alone in the beauty of the West.

[Tahoe24]

Thanks, I certainly have looked into that and will continue too gain my knowledge.

[Tahoe24]

Does anyone have any suggestions. Would be very helpful. Thanks

[FreedomThroughAnarchism]

Originally Posted by Tahoe24

But looking ahead I want to live in a rural area and wanted to see if what I want exists or something close to it where I can compromise.

I have my own business that runs from home and never meet with customer so I can go anywhere but mainly looking at MT, WY, CO.

I want acreage where I can do what I want when I want and not see my neighbors. Pee off my back porch with no worries.

I could live in boonies as far as Im concerned but need internet (satellite internet will probably be the best option for what I am looking for, which isnt a problem) I want to be able to have large garden and sustain myself. I would love mountains and snow if possible, a little river is something I would really enjoy but dont have to have.

I dont mind driving couple hours to an airport or to market. Would like to make maybe a trip every couple months and stock up and just live on my own with my necessities until I feel need to go back. Don't Need large social if any social, I am very independent. Chickens and little personal livestock to provide for myself.

Not a big fan of restrictions. Also far enough away from police/sheriff where you don't call them for little things, hence the independence I am looking for.

Requesting specific towns is a little tricky. Some people on city-data have no problem throwing towns out there as possibilities, as so many threads will show, but it's still a task which is difficult for many (myself included). There are just so many towns in any given state, and they are all so unique in their own special little way, that's it not that likely that the town suggested would ideally match what the person was looking for (unless the persons request was highly specific to such a degree that literally only a few towns fit the criteria).

When searching for "that special place," it's generally better to start narrowing it down by region of given state (that's usually the easy part for many states), and then narrowing it down towards the county level, and then the town level. That's where it gets a little more difficult because it's hard to get into your minds eye, to know exactly what your vision is.


If it's any consolation to you, there are quite a number of people on city-data who are of the same mindset. Lot's of threads about this topic. Might want to pop into the preparedness forum also, if you've never skimmed through it before. Lots of old threads in there on just such a topic.


One thing about Colorado. Land there tends to be a little pricier, though there are some very nice rural deals to be found, particularly in the southern end of the state (I've seen nice mountainous 40 and 50 acre plots in new "retreat"-type subdivisions go for $25k). It's a little too "southwest-like" down that portion of the state. Considering that you like Montana, I'm not sure if you would like that... but that tends to be where very cheap land can be found.

There are a few counties in Colorado that effectively have no zoning and building code enforcement, if that is criteria you are looking for. I have a list of these counties I got off of an alternative building forum not long ago... will post it later. Wyoming also is listed as having quite a few localities that are very pro-homesteading friendly, and won't bog you down in the red tape if you want to build your own cabin.


Will try to offer some more specific suggestions of localities in Montana later. If you want to throw out some more information about yourself/interests, that might help narrow it down a bit.


You would probably like Yaak, MT, if you like a sleepy little town with a nice river. Land is kind of locked up a bit there though, unfortunately. F-ing government is hoarding it all, squeezing the people out.

I almost feel like I am giving away a secret for which I feel slightly guilty of by posting this.... ... but nonetheless: (watch video - see if it interests you) Yaak, Montana (documentary, 2009) - YouTube

[harry chickpea]

Hello, Brand new to the web site. Browsed around a couple days and thought I would ask for some well put input as I see other people getting.

I'm 21 living at lake Tahoe california and love it for now. But looking ahead I want to live in a rural area and wanted to see if what I want exists or something close to it where I can compromise.

I have my own business that runs from home and never meet with customer so I can go anywhere but mainly looking at MT, WY, CO.

Have my own business as well.

I want acreage where I can do what I want when I want and not see my neighbors.

Got it.

Pee off my back porch with no worries.

I do it. Not a big deal. The weeds grow better there and it keeps some critters away.

I could live in boonies as far as Im concerned but need internet (satellite internet will probably be the best option for what I am looking for, which isnt a problem)

Got it, you'll find the usage restrictions border on crippling and the average speed about 6 to 8 times that of a good dial-up.

I want to be able to have large garden and sustain myself.

You can do it, but it is NOT economical or a good return on the time invested. One gardens for the knowledge of what one is eating, for the exercise, and for the love of gardening. Weeds grow best on the hottest day of the year. Pests like food the best the day before you go to harvest it.

I would love mountains and snow if possible,

Hills, some snow, got it.

a little river is something I would really enjoy but dont have to have.

Creek. Got it, along with full riparian rights. You generally won't find that in the west.

I dont mind driving couple hours to an airport or to market.

30 minutes to market. What is an "airport?"

Would like to make maybe a trip every couple months and stock up and just live on my own with my necessities until I feel need to go back. Don't Need large social if any social, I am very independent.

Ditto.

Chickens and little personal livestock to provide for myself.

Livestock and chickens are not like plants. EVERY day, without fail, they have to be cared for. No vacations. No going anywhere for a day or two.

Not a big fan of restrictions. Also far enough away from police/sheriff where you don't call them for little things, hence the independence I am looking for.

No restrictions here. No zoning. No building inspection on private buildings.

I know this is a bit of a wide range. If you guys could narrow it down or had questions for me to help you, that would be great. Looking ahead and trying to find the right location/ cites. {ie not Northern Montana. but a particular town or area around a town would be great!}

Seriously, you don't understand the ramifications of doing what you are suggesting. A lot of that is because what you are fed by the back-to-the-land and organic magazines. Don't get me wrong, it can be an interesting and educational life. Just don't come into it expecting it to be easy or taking little time and money.

Thanks for help in advance, I have already learned a lot from everyone on these threads.

[Lariat]

Have you considered Idaho? Many areas fit your bill, but you only want MT, CO, WY.

[HappyTexan]

For internet check out Verizon wireless broadband.
It's DSL equivalent. I've had it for 4 months now since I moved and love it.
I have the 5GB plan and have not run over yet. You can buy more data.

I have my usb stick plugged into a cradlepoint router (supports wireless broadband) and so I have wireless throughout the house.

Love it. Verizon has a coverage map. I'm 3G though but not complaining considering my alternatives are dial-up or satellite broadband..neither of which are that great.

[Tahoe24]

Harry Chickpea... Thanks for the reply that was nice to know there are others out there. Where do you live? Do you just by mass amounts of food and livestock packaged, when talking about the chickens and gardens? Did you build your own home, if so what were some changes you would make to improve it.. Going to watch the documentary as soon as I have some down time.


Lariat: Have considered Idaho but havnt looked into it deeply. Take a look today at there mountains and geography.

[harry chickpea]

Location: Somewhere in northern Alabama

Tried chickens. Even got some culls for free from one of the local broiler houses. The cost of feed made them more expensive than what I could buy at the store. Never underestimate the power of agribusiness to find the most cost efficient method of raising food.

Had a big garden for a couple of years. We still have some stuff in a freezer from it. I kept track of costs and time spent on the third year. I was just losing a little at first, then the motor on the tiller seized, the Mexican bean beetles took a liking to the greens, the whistlepig to the cucumbers, the cabbage worms to the broccoli, and it started to get hot: 95+ degree hot, and the weeds were enjoying the lack of the tiller. When I can buy two or more cans of green beans - already canned - for less than a buck, why grow green beans?

There are some things where it can cost less to grow your own. Pecan trees and other fruit and nut trees can work. Under certain conditions, gardens can work. Certainly if you buy three tomato starts at a buck a start, and then watch the price of fresh tomatoes, you can make your money back in the first half-dozen you pick. Tomatoes are artificially high cost in stores due to some strange ways they get to market. On other stuff, watch. Just as your corn is coming in, the price of corn in the stores will drop to 10 for a buck. It is all a game. If you are observant and canny, you can win. Example - around here come late June, blueberries are in the stores at a dollar a dry pint. I can't grow 'em that cheap. We buy four flats and clean and freeze them. Price of blueberries in the store now? FOUR dollars a dry pint.

We moved out of south Florida at the very tail end of the housing boom. Ours was literally the last house in the neighborhood that sold. I knew it couldn't last, so we took the money and ran. When I was much younger, I did a bunch of building on my own. Redid a friend's house, ripped out walls, redesigned a roof, finished basements, built seriously sturdy sheds. Lotsa work, lotsa expense even back then. I'll say flat out if you buy your materials from a big box store, you'll spend twice to three times what you would if you found an old sawyer somewhere and asked advice.

The same that holds true for livestock and gardens holds true for housing. We bought a manufactured house new that is twice the house and twice as large as the stick-builts around here. It works for us and what we wanted to accomplish. For someone of your age, I'd suggest a repossessed single-wide that you can use as a base and play around with. You'll have eliminated 90% of the depreciation by buying a repo, not have spent a lot for housing, and have all the basic mechanicals covered. The real estate market will take years to recover. Unless you are in one of the few unique hot-spots, don't plan on any housing investment appreciating for five to ten years. If you ever want to retire, that means keeping your money out of something that will grow property tax and insurance costs while requiring constant upkeep.

You are getting the BTDT speech. Don't be enticed by the bright shining objects being peddled in the "Back to the Beautiful Bountiful Country" magazines. Also - before committing yourself, do yourself a favor - go out in farming country, find a little diner or store that serves food, and show up for breakfast and talk with a few of the old locals. You'll get an edumacation.