Is Sacramento getting better? (Roseville, Folsom: middle-class, sales, foreclosure)

[cb73]

I don't go out shopping too much. Today I took off to get a haircut and some postcards.

The haircut place had shut down. I went to 8 stores looking for postcards--3 had closed recently, the rest all said they'd cut back and no longer sold postcards.

Then I went to Country Club Plaza Mall. On the whole left side, all the stores were closed. On the right side, maybe 6 stores were open. I probably saw less than 10 people the whole time I was there.

I assume if you go into the outlying "new" areas, maybe things have improved? I'm sure if you go to the "nice" areas, things are humming right along.

But for the "regular" parts of Sacramento--where people who make maybe $40,000 or less live--Sacramento just looks horrible. Empty storefronts, no upkeep to stores that are still open, and it seems like 100 thrift stores have popped up in the last few years. My neighborhood grocery store, that had been in business for at least 50 years, shut down last month.

Is there hope for the "regular" part of Sacramento? Or are we destined to go downhill and become the poor part of town.

[NinaN]

We are starting to see new businesses open, but we are also seeing old businesses shut down (due in part to the stupidity of the commercial property managers that won't negotiate lower rent for high-cost commercial space that's just not justifiable anymore). We also still have quite a bit of empty retail space in every commercial corner.

OTOH, the Palladio in Folsom is finally starting to get some shops and restaurants opened. We'll see.

[wburg]

Country Club Plaza isn't in the city of Sacramento. Downtown it seems like theere is a new place opening every few days--some places close, sure, but others open in their place. I agree with NinaN that a lot of commercial property owners are not willing to charge reasonable rents with the result of closing existing businesses who can't afford higher rent--but even then the space doesn't stay vacant for long.

I don't think the outer suburbs are all that much better--a lot of the outer suburbs never got fully built before the bust hit and others are losing residents to foreclosure.

I'm a little more amazed to learn that anyone still sends postcards. I can't remember the last time I sent anyone a postcard.

[caligirlz]

I was out doing errands in Folsom today. There were cars everywhere and the strip malls were packed. However, once I actually got inside the stores, there wasn't that many people and there was only one person in front of me at the checkout. So...maybe people are just out shopping, but not buying, except for necessities. Not sure.

As for the Palladio, I look forward to more stores opening, because right now there just isn't that much selection for shopping. We have to movie theater, a few restaurants, a few high end boutiques & Whole Foods.

Further down the road and into Sacramento....I have the same experience, lots of cars on the road, lots of cars in the parking lots, but very few people actually buying anything in the stores...I've noticed this at Sunrise Mall, Town & Country, and Country Club. Although, ever since Gottshalks closed, Country Club has been deader than usual. It was always a dead mall without much selection of stores inside the mall between Macy's and Gottschalks.

People do seem to be buying in Roseville though. I always see lots of shopping bags in people's hands over there.

[cb73]

Originally Posted by wburg

I'm a little more amazed to learn that anyone still sends postcards. I can't remember the last time I sent anyone a postcard.

It's a summer postcard exchange for a group I'm in. 51 people in 17 different countries. We do it at Christmas too.

And yes, I agree, Roseville does look busier. I'm trying to support my area--Arden/Arcade and Carmichael by shopping there, rather than driving to Roseville to leave my sales tax money.

[wburg]

Indeed--it's always nice to leave most of your sales tax money within walking distance of your house.

[Malloric]

Originally Posted by wburg

Indeed--it's always nice to leave most of your sales tax money within walking distance of your house.

Don't tell the Democrats in Sacramento that, they'd be upset with you. They keep pushing that local sales ocurring in the entire metro area all belong to Sacramento. Realistically, all they can grab is the county. Now that they've run down the city limits, they're looking at running as much of the economic activity out of the county entirely.

I don't see much positive for "regular" Sacramentans. If you're living a footloose and fancy-free lifestyle, Sacramento's has been and will continue to be pretty good. You've got cheap rents around Midtown. Good local music scene, bars, lots of moderately priced restaurants, thrift shops are great places for cheap clothes, if you've got the time and inclination to sort through them and aren't into wearing what advertising tells you is this year's trendy fashion. That's not "regular Sacramentans" to me though.

Sacramento's priority is building urban amenities on K Street, which I like to call Welfare Street since just about everything on it only exists because of corporate welfare. Who cares if you've got high crime, terrible schools, can't fund your parks (ranked #2, decades investment at risk because of Sacramento's misguided short-term priorities)? We've got Ed Hardy Pizza Rock and a Hyatt. The other 90% of the city... well, no one goes there anyway, right? Sacramento's policies mean the middle-class have largely left for the suburbs and the jobs have followed them there. The previously plan was to import paid for cameo citizens to repopulate the downtown area with a mixture of low-income non-families and drug addicts. I'm not sure what the end game was there, but now that the State is broke and took away the Redevelopment free money pot it'll be much harder to accomplish that.

[KC6ZLV]

Originally Posted by Malloric

Don't tell the Democrats in Sacramento that, they'd be upset with you. They keep pushing that local sales ocurring in the entire metro area all belong to Sacramento. Realistically, all they can grab is the county. Now that they've run down the city limits, they're looking at running as much of the economic activity out of the county entirely.

I don't see much positive for "regular" Sacramentans. If you're living a footloose and fancy-free lifestyle, Sacramento's has been and will continue to be pretty good. You've got cheap rents around Midtown. Good local music scene, bars, lots of moderately priced restaurants, thrift shops are great places for cheap clothes, if you've got the time and inclination to sort through them and aren't into wearing what advertising tells you is this year's trendy fashion. That's not "regular Sacramentans" to me though.

Sacramento's priority is building urban amenities on K Street, which I like to call Welfare Street since just about everything on it only exists because of corporate welfare. Who cares if you've got high crime, terrible schools, can't fund your parks (ranked #2, decades investment at risk because of Sacramento's misguided short-term priorities)? We've got Ed Hardy Pizza Rock and a Hyatt. The other 90% of the city... well, no one goes there anyway, right? Sacramento's policies mean the middle-class have largely left for the suburbs and the jobs have followed them there. The previously plan was to import paid for cameo citizens to repopulate the downtown area with a mixture of low-income non-families and drug addicts. I'm not sure what the end game was there, but now that the State is broke and took away the Redevelopment free money pot it'll be much harder to accomplish that.

The issue of a metropolitan sales tax had nothing to do with political affiliation. The idea came out of the growth of the higher-paying jobs in Placer and El Dorado counties that stimulated the growth in housing and retail in those areas and instead of encouraging those higher-paying jobs to locate in the developed areas of Sacramento County they preferred to complain about sales tax revenue instead of understanding why it was skyrocketing in Placer County at the time.

Most of the Sacramento areas issues come from this. The local politicians just don't seem to have much motivation in economic development other than construction. And of course, right now we are having problems due to the national economic problems as well as the issues the State has towards business in general.

[ryuns]

Overall, I'd vote for stagnant. This economy is just bad. State and local policies are probably not doing anyone any favors on encouraging investment or job growth, but let's call a spade a spade. The bubble was built on debt and it's taking a LONG time to pare that back. Myriad problems--trying to pay down debt when the economy is crap is harder. People whose houses are underwater are less likely to move to find the right job, they can't refinance to take advantage of low rates and have more to spend, the state's problems mean that public sector employees get the shaft which inordinately hurts local spending, etc etc.

Meanwhile, Sacramento city suffers in a feedback loop where everyone who has the money decides to take off and find a nice gated community for themselves and their tax dollars and their well-educated kids and caring parents (which certainly has more to do with making a good school than tax dollars). And we the city fund public transit all the way to the edge of the city limits because no other municipalities want to foot the bill (or want to keep "those people" out of their neighborhood, if some cases).

But it's still sort of subjective. Personally, I see Sacramento becoming more of the place that *I* want to live. That's all pretty selfish, as I enjoy a lot of the sorts of trends that are big amongst the yuppies--improving transit, better bike facilities, better local coffee, better local beers, awesome mid-priced restaurants. I'm fine with that.

[sacramento916]

I agree with Ryuns. The strange this is that even as the economy has stagnated, Sacramento has really improved as far as being a cool city to live in, with the emergence of unique local restaurants, bars, etc in the center city.