U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Covid-19 Information Page
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > California > Sacramento
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 11-13-2019, 09:28 PM
 
923 posts, read 342,969 times
Reputation: 2680

Advertisements

Having to commute through downtown SAC is such a challenge during the dark months. We've got normal traffic, light-rail, pedestrians, busses galore, homeless, crazy unpredictable jesters strung out on drugs who are apt to jump out in front of cars without warning, work-trucks running stop signs, angry self-entitled cyclists, all inside a 1950's infrastructure that forces us to take our lives into our own hands when we try to cross an intersection without a stop sign for the cross-streets, and soon it's going to get darker at 4PM and the weather will add more features to the daily commute.

I think the bicyclists are becoming more and more aggressive just as they did in Berkeley ten years ago. Today in Berkeley I understand they're now ticketing the cyclist. But the cyclists here haven't yet received the proverbial memo, as they are becoming dangerously confrontational to drivers of cars. Today for example, I had a cyclists who was all over the place on the narrow edge of a through street. I was concerned so I tapped the horn. I almost hit him because he crossed that thick line meant to define the bicyclist border.

When he caught up with me he came right up to my car, banged my passenger window with his fists so I rolled the window down to see what the issue was. He said was that you honking at me? I said yes, I almost hit you because you were riding erratically. I didn't want you to be hurt. He said a few choice words and rode off with a big one-finger salute.

This is what I experienced in Berkeley a few years ago when I lived in that area. Bicyclists became beligerant to the point I tried to avoid Berkeley altogether after hours. I finally started trying to travel to other areas to shop like El Cerrito or even Emeryville because of the cyclists.

My question to you is, have you ever experienced this confrontational attitude and has it increased in SAC over the last couple of years? Or is it a symptom of bigger things?

Depending on response, if any, this may become a political discussion. If so, moderator, please feel free to move it to a more appropriate category.

I'd love to hear your stories about cyclists experiences on either side of the situation.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 11-13-2019, 10:03 PM
 
61 posts, read 193,854 times
Reputation: 57
Out of curiosity have you looked at the bike lane in area you where driving? While bikes tend to stay on the shoulder as a courtesy, often times those shoulders are dangerous, with scattered debris/yard wast/potholes/transition from asphalt to concrete. I have no idea where this was, maybe the cyclist was an egotistical maniac with a death wish.

But is it also possible, that he was a bike commuter avoiding some minor obstacle that would be nothing to your car but could be catastrophic to a bicycle? Is it possible that he was equally as flummoxed that you were not providing a suitable 3 foot buffer and waiting for him to return to the bike lane while he was trying to navigate these obstacles to avoid a crash? I really don’t know, but I find that car drivers often do not consider how little space is really provided to bicycle us, how poorly maintained those little corners of the road, and that cyclist are entitled to the entire traffic lane if necessary, and add a minimum at 3 foot buffer from all cars. What is a minor annoyance to a car driver can be terrifying to a cyclist that is being buzzed by a car while trying to avoid a rather large branch/pothole/broken bottle/etc. Everyone makes mistakes, but a little caution around a cyclist can literally save a life, and ultimately cost you nothing as far as time or effort on your commute.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-14-2019, 09:36 AM
 
241 posts, read 224,654 times
Reputation: 302
Here is what I experience every day in downtown Sacramento:

1. Bicyclists and scooter users, sometimes three and four abreast, weaving in and out of pedestrians on the sidewalk at full speed with a bike lane available just a few feet away and without the required audible warning.

2. Bicyclists and scooter users crossing a street in the crosswalk without dismounting and walking across as is required by law.

3. Bicyclists going the wrong way down a one-way street.

4. Bicyclists on the wrong side of the road, both on one-way and two-way streets.

5. Bicyclists blasting through stop signs and red lights instead of stopping as required by law.

6. Bicyclists ignoring the 3-foot buffer rule when they are moving faster than the vehicle traffic. (One was so close, he hit my side-view mirror, leaving a lovely scratch. I was surprised he was able to stay upright. He was and just kept right on going.)

7. Bicyclists weaving through vehicle traffic.

8. Bicyclists passing other bicyclists without looking to see if there is a car coming.

9. Bicyclists riding on the outside of the parked cars when there is a parking-protected bike lane.

10. Bicyclists riding at night with no reflecters, no lights, dark clothing, AND committing all of the above violations.

I have contacted the city numerous times and have been told that they "can't" give tickets for violations. When the complaint is involving a rented bike or scooter, I have been told to contact the company and the company will issue a ticket. The companies won't do anything unless you can give the name of the person who was riding and the number of the vehicle - two things that are a little hard to get as they blast past you.

Yes, it is getting worse - especially from those who are using the rented vehicles. While I have seen a few who stay to the right and ride with caution as Lillp described, most of those I encounter are on the other side of the spectrum. The city does need to do more maintenance of the roads but bicyclists need to obey the laws and ride as if their life depended on it - because it does.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-14-2019, 10:17 AM
 
470 posts, read 636,709 times
Reputation: 1028
As a former serious recreational cyclist, I saw and continue to see horribly unsafe behavior from both cyclists and motorists. One of the reasons I stopped cycling was nearly being killed a half dozen times over the years from inattentive, oblivious, red light running, cell phone using motorists.

That said, the attitudes displayed by cyclists, especially when they are in packs, shows to the rest of the world how self-righteous, snobbish, and dangerous they can be. Cyclists think they have the right to share the road, which they technically do, however when they are dead because of their own self-destructive mannerisms, they're not going to be around to have the luxury of someone saying to them "I told you so."

The power lies with the motorists, and the sooner the cyclists respect that, and motorists understand that, the roads will be safer. And that my friend, is Pie in the Sky wishing.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-14-2019, 02:50 PM
 
Location: Sacramento
615 posts, read 573,157 times
Reputation: 734
I had a close call with a couple of cyclists on the way home from work last night around 6:00 p.m. I was driving down Freeport Boulevard near the new Raley's that's under construction. I noticed the traffic in front of me had slowed down abruptly and weaved into the left lane. Turns out that cars were weaving to avoid two bicyclists who were riding without any type of reflectors or lights on their bikes. I realize that portion of Freeport doesn't have any sidewalks or shoulders where the construction is taking place, but cyclists could at least ride with reflective gear and lights so motorists can see them.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-14-2019, 10:46 PM
 
1,678 posts, read 1,467,984 times
Reputation: 1486
Quote:
Originally Posted by settled00 View Post
My question to you is, have you ever experienced this confrontational attitude and has it increased in SAC over the last couple of years? Or is it a symptom of bigger things?

Depending on response, if any, this may become a political discussion. If so, moderator, please feel free to move it to a more appropriate category.

I'd love to hear your stories about cyclists experiences on either side of the situation.
I think there are a couple of different things going on. First there are distracted drivers. You have people driving cars and talking on cellphones doing dumb sh*t while they drive. You also have cyclists wearing earbuds bike salmoning the bike lane who are also idiots. So anyone who wants to make the argument that the other group has a lot of idiots in it, well I agree with you.

With cycling there is also an infrastructure problem. The infrastructure is set up and maintained for cars and bikes are an afterthought. So the loops that activate streetlights might not respond if a cyclist rolls over it. There tends to be a fair amount of debris in the bike lane, especially this time of year from leaves, wet leaves and stuff like broken class or potholes in the bike lane that don't get fixed, but if you hit them could throw you off your bike. So in addition to cyclists acting badly, I also think sometimes bad infrastructure forces cyclists to make choices that make them seem like idiots. If you are at a light and the signal loop ignores you, you may decide to run the light because the light just isn't going to change. So throwing some additional maintenance money into addressing some of these problems will probably fix some of what appears to be problematic cycling.

Lastly confrontation attitudes among cyclists. Possibly near downtown, but in the rest of the region no. Basically Berkeley and possibly downtown are really only the places in Sac that I think have really confrontational a-holes. For the most part, I think most people in Sacramento are generally pretty reasonable most of the time. Most of the people cycling here are doing it for recreational reasons than to advance some greater narrative in the culture war. So you are not going to get this huge group of cyclists attacking cars. There is just not enough of them and most of the people who cycle in this area also drive so its not some weird subculture thing the way it is in Berkeley.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-15-2019, 08:06 AM
 
936 posts, read 922,251 times
Reputation: 438
As a cyclist who lives and bikes downtown, it is the drivers who constantly run stop signs and lights and fail to pay attention while yakking on their phones that really need policing! Now regarding bikes, the rental bikers and scooters are bad. They don't pay attention either. I hate those Lime rent bike/scooter company! Makes it a pain as well with the stupid bikes and scooters littered all over the place.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-15-2019, 09:41 AM
 
241 posts, read 224,654 times
Reputation: 302
Quote:
Originally Posted by shelato View Post
If you are at a light and the signal loop ignores you, you may decide to run the light because the light just isn't going to change.
No. If the light will not change for a bicycle, the bicyclist needs to become a pedestrian and walk across the street using the crossing light. Yes, it takes more time but that is the law and it infinitely safer for both motorsts and the bicyclist.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-15-2019, 11:08 AM
 
1,678 posts, read 1,467,984 times
Reputation: 1486
Quote:
Originally Posted by MyNewsLogin View Post
No. If the light will not change for a bicycle, the bicyclist needs to become a pedestrian and walk across the street using the crossing light. Yes, it takes more time but that is the law and it infinitely safer for both motorsts and the bicyclist.
Do you have a citation to the California vehicle code here? Because when in the road and the light just isn't changing I am not thinking any of your options are all that safe.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-15-2019, 11:38 AM
 
241 posts, read 224,654 times
Reputation: 302
Quote:
Originally Posted by shelato View Post
Do you have a citation to the California vehicle code here? Because when in the road and the light just isn't changing I am not thinking any of your options are all that safe.
California Vehicle Code 21200. (a) (1) A person riding a bicycle or operating a pedicab upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle by this division, including, but not limited to, provisions concerning driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or drugs, and by Division 10 (commencing with Section 20000), Section 27400, Division 16.7 (commencing with Section 39000), Division 17 (commencing with Section 40000.1), and Division 18 (commencing with Section 42000), except those provisions which by their very nature can have no application.

If you are on your bike, you have to follow the laws as a vehicle - which includes not running red lights, not running stop signs, traveling in the direction of traffic, etc.

If you are not on your bike, you have to follow the laws as a pedestrian. Crosswalks are for pedestrians, not vehicles.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Settings
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2020 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > California > Sacramento
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2020, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top