Has anyone moved to Sacramento and regretted it? (San Jose: to buy, gated)

[ndfmnlf]

Originally Posted by nmnita

Asia yes, not all from Latin America speak good English and I am not talking about those who are coming over illegally from Mexico. I know of some from further south who do not speak our language. For those who do speak more than one language that is a plus. As for your comments about them having an advantage over others, how many years or generations do you think those families will speak both languages? Don't you think there was a time when our families spoke more than one language..??

I think the point here you are over-looking, first generation families do well especially the Asians in some, but not all cases, but this does change and those coming from Mexico especially illegals are creating a totally different set of problems for California. They want USA rights but don't want to give up their country. You can't have it both ways. I am not talking about holding on to your culture, I am talking about not accepting our culture..

Can you define "our culture"?

[Curmudgeon]

Originally Posted by ndfmnlf

I doubt you speak those languages.

No doubt you're right.

My father was half French and he lived in Paris and the French West Indies. He spoke fluent French as did my grandmere. We spoke quite a bit of French at home and I studied French in high school and college.

We were a military family. We moved to Tsingtao Cina in 1947, when I was just beginning to learn to speak and stayed until we were evacuated in 1949. I heard more Mandarin than English and had a Chinese amah so that's the language I picked up.

We moved to Japan when I was eight, living in Hayama, Yokosuka and Tokyo and stayed until I was almost 12. Not only did we have Japanese maids but I was the only American boy in Hayama, all my friends there were Japanese and I studing Japanese in school in Tokyo (required) so I had to learn to be conversant.

In the military in my own right I served in Korea from 1967 until 1969. In one position I employed 60 Koreans and in another I commanded a 90 man special operations/security force which included 30 soldier from the ROK Army. I also took college language courses in Korean.

But again, you're probably right. I'm just the liar you called me.

So, do you really work on being self-righteous, superior and insulting or were you merely born this way? Inquiring minds want to know!

[Ludachris]

Originally Posted by ndfmnlf

I doubt you speak those languages.

What part of his posting history would suggest he's lying about that? You insult the guy and then call him a liar because you were wrong about your assumption of him?

This was not meant to spark a racial or ethnic debate. The issue of assimilation (specifically language) was brought up. Some enjoy diversity and others don't. Many feel that diversity can flourish even with assimilation (at least I do). Please don't ruin this thread by insulting people and calling them liars. You should be able to make your points without doing so.

[Ludachris]

Originally Posted by nmnita

...and those coming from Mexico especially illegals are creating a totally different set of problems for California. They want USA rights but don't want to give up their country. You can't have it both ways. I am not talking about holding on to your culture, I am talking about not accepting our culture...

Can you give some examples of this so we can understand exactly what you mean when you say "Mexicans creating a different set of problems" and them "not accepting our culture" - outside the realm of illegal immigration. I've heard this thought floated around on occasion but haven't been clear on what's meant.

[ndfmnlf]

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

No doubt you're right.

My father was half French and he lived in Paris and the French West Indies. He spoke fluent French as did my grandmere. We spoke quite a bit of French at home and I studied French in high school and college.

We were a military family. We moved to Tsingtao Cina in 1947, when I was just beginning to learn to speak and stayed until we were evacuated in 1949. I heard more Mandarin than English and had a Chinese amah so that's the language I picked up.

We moved to Japan when I was eight, living in Hayama, Yokosuka and Tokyo and stayed until I was almost 12. Not only did we have Japanese maids but I was the only American boy in Hayama, all my friends there were Japanese and I studing Japanese in school in Tokyo (required) so I had to learn to be conversant.

In the military in my own right I served in Korea from 1967 until 1969. In one position I employed 60 Koreans and in another I commanded a 90 man special operations/security force which included 30 soldier from the ROK Army. I also took college language courses in Korean.

But again, you're probably right. I'm just the liar you called me.

So, do you really work on being self-righteous, superior and insulting or were you merely born this way? Inquiring minds want to know!

None of your narrative above proves you speak any of the languages you claim to speak.

[Ludachris]

Originally Posted by ndfmnlf

None of your narrative above proves you speak any of the languages you claim to speak.

How would he prove it? And why should he not be taken at his word? If you've spent much time reading his posts you'd have no reason to think he's lying. Why should anyone believe anything you (or anyone else) post? Do you feel you deserve proof because you posted an assumption about him that could easily be wrong? Since you insulted him I think you should be the one providing proof that he doesn't speak multiple languages.

[ndfmnlf]

[

QUOTE]What part of his posting history would suggest he's lying about that? You insult the guy and then call him a liar because you were wrong about your assumption of him?

[/quote]

You're wrong. Saying that immigrants who speak multiple languages besides English have an advantage over someone who speaks only English is not an insult. It's a statement of fact.



[quote]

This was not meant to spark a racial or ethnic debate. The issue of assimilation (specifically language) was brought up. Some enjoy diversity and others don't. Many feel that diversity can flourish even with assimilation (at least I do). Please don't ruin this thread by insulting people and calling them liars. You should be able to make your points without doing so.[QUOTE

]

Since the reason given by Curmudgeon for regretting his life in Sacramento is that he has become a "minority" living in a sea of non-white people, then this thread has become an ethnic/racial debate.

[ndfmnlf]

Originally Posted by Ludachris

How would he prove it? And why should he not be taken at his word? If you've spent much time reading his posts you'd have no reason to think he's lying. Why should anyone believe anything you (or anyone else) post? Do you feel you deserve proof because you posted an assumption about him that could easily be wrong? Since you insulted him I think you should be the one providing proof that he doesn't speak multiple languages.

Dude, I don't need to provide proof of anything. The person who claims he speaks multiple languages has the burden of proof. And since this particluar person has the temerity to claim that immigrants are not assimiliating into American culture (eg not speaking English), then he has the further burden to prove that as well. So far, I have only read mere assertions. Where are the facts? Is it really true that immigrants and their children are not attempting to learn English? What is the ratio of non-English speaking immigrants to the total population of immigrants? That's the kind of data that makes for a credible discussion, not mere assertions or innuendos.

[Curmudgeon]

Originally Posted by Ludachris

How would he prove it? And why should he not be taken at his word? If you've spent much time reading his posts you'd have no reason to think he's lying. Why should anyone believe anything you (or anyone else) post? Do you feel you deserve proof because you posted an assumption about him that could easily be wrong? Since you insulted him I think you should be the one providing proof that he doesn't speak multiple languages.

Interestingly enough, I didn't claim to speak those languages. I stated that I was conversant in them which, at the times mentioned and for sometime thereafter, I was. Most unfortunately, with the exception of some words and phrases, the ability to count and some excellent insults, use-it-or-lose-it prevails.

What the clearly unpleasant and witless poster fails to comprehend is that the issue was not, nor was it intended to be, my grasp of other languages. It was the fact that I learned them in order to help me assimilate into the culture of the countries in which I lived. It's others' lack of that effort I find disturbing and all too prevalent; especially after they've lived here for decades.

[ndfmnlf]

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

Interestingly enough, I didn't claim to speak those languages. I stated that I was conversant in them which, at the times mentioned and for sometime thereafter, I was. Most unfortunately, with the exception of some words and phrases, the ability to count and some excellent insults, use-it-or-lose-it prevails.

What the clearly unpleasant and witless poster fails to comprehend is that the issue was not, nor was it intended to be, my grasp of other languages. It was the fac t that I learned them in order to help me assimilate into the culture of the countries in which I lived. It's others' lack of that effort I find disturbing and all too prevalent; especially after they've lived here for decades.

Quit being so self righteous. Do you really believe you are the only one who has made an effort to assimilate into a foreign culture? What makes you think immigrants are not attempting to learn English? Where are your facts? Where are these "immigrants who've lived here for decades and don't speak English"? How many are we talking about?