Victoria Courts - Victoria Commons (San Antonio, Howe: neighborhoods, school, college)

[HisLilSecret]

Originally Posted by rd2007

sounds like a lovely place. good thing it's gone

So does every OTHER housing project...but people gotta live somewhere. Unfortunately, the people who don't know how to live within the confines of the law or just don't know how to get along in a community, screw it up for everybody else.

[heimerswt]

Originally Posted by dvlpr

1. There is no "private profit". SAHA owned the property before, and they own it now. What they did do was take one of the most notorious projects in SA and get rid of it (including, of course, some of the criminals who resided there).

2. There is no "injustice". Victoria Courts was one of the most horrific housing projects anywhere in the city, and the people who lived there had a horrific negative impact on the surrounding neighborhood. Most of the residents of the surrounding neighborhoods, by the way, are working-class people who manage to pay their own rent.

3. Mixed-income projects like Refugio Place have been demonstrated to be successful in changing the behavior of public housing residents, creating more sustainable affordable-housing projects that are compatible with neighborhoods.

4. You're right that the city wanted to make sure tourists (and residents) who were down there felt safe. That's what the city is SUPPOSED to do. And now that VC is gone, the area is much safer.

5. Are you seriously complaining the residents who pay market-rate rent receive privileges not extended to recipients of public housing? Guess what? They deserve more privileges and amenities, because they pay more. Here's another fact you may find "unjust": people who buy more expensive houses live in nicer homes. What a travesty.

6. These people were not put "out of sight and out of mind". Most are still in public housing, and many were actually given the opportunity to live in the new Refugio Place apartments. I am a supporter of SAHA and public housing agencies, and the mission of affordable housing. But the ignorance, ingratitude, and entitlement of people like you sometimes makes me think twice...

[skeet09]

I like the idea of mixed communities you mentioned in #3 dvlpr; I think its great to have people from different backgrounds living in the same neighborhood, it gives a chance for everyone to learn from one another.

[HisLilSecret]

Originally Posted by dvlpr

3. Mixed-income projects like Refugio Place have been demonstrated to be successful in changing the behavior of public housing residents, creating more sustainable affordable-housing projects that are compatible with neighborhoods.

Having lived in different apartment complexes where public housing residents have also resided, I have not found this to be true.

[dvlpr]

Originally Posted by HisLilSecret

Having lived in different apartment complexes where public housing residents have also resided, I have not found this to be true.

Well, it's certainly not a cure-all for bad behavior. But it is a dramatic improvement over concentrating public housing residents in dormitory-like projects.

Also, the most successful projects of this kind involve several different housing types, not just apartments. So, when public housing renters live in Rufugio Place, they're also adjacent to new townhomes, and the existing single-family houses in Lavaca. In other words, RP is part of (and connected to) a larger neighborhood. This presents a greater opportunity for public housing renters to see positive examples of interaction, property maintenance, etc. And it makes them less likely to engage in destructive and criminal behavior.

Great quote: "Crime doesn't follow poverty; it follows concentrations of poverty".

But, like I said, it's not a cure-all.

[Chaka]

Originally Posted by dvlpr

Well, it's certainly not a cure-all for bad behavior. But it is a dramatic improvement over concentrating public housing residents in dormitory-like projects.

Also, the most successful projects of this kind involve several different housing types, not just apartments. So, when public housing renters live in Rufugio Place, they're also adjacent to new townhomes, and the existing single-family houses in Lavaca. In other words, RP is part of (and connected to) a larger neighborhood. This presents a greater opportunity for public housing renters to see positive examples of interaction, property maintenance, etc. And it makes them less likely to engage in destructive and criminal behavior.

Great quote: "Crime doesn't follow poverty; it follows concentrations of poverty".

But, like I said, it's not a cure-all.

As a resident of this neighborhood, who moved in when the final stages of Victoria Courts were still here, I agree fully.

Like many of my neighbors, esp. those of us who came when the transition was in its infancy (and many before, when the Courts were in full swing), we like living in a mixed income community. You can be poor and still respect the place you live.

An aside, it the years just after the Courts came down, there was very little crime in this nieghborhood. We all joked that the criminals knew there was nothing to steal . In the past year or so, crime (like house break ins) have increased somewhat. Still not bad, and still very safe, but as properties improve, they become more appealing to criminals.

[ashbeeigh]

Originally Posted by perticusrex

Probably.

In reality, I'm sure SAHA moved them all over the city (kind of like butter). The city has public housing all over the place. How many threads are there of homeowners whining that section 8 people have moved in to their neighborhood only to bring down property values and just generally ruined their lives?

[sapphire]

Originally Posted by ashbeeigh

In reality, I'm sure SAHA moved them all over the city (kind of like butter). The city has public housing all over the place. How many threads are there of homeowners whining that section 8 people have moved in to their neighborhood only to bring down property values and just generally ruined their lives?

Yes, we're all just collectively whining and making things up. Puh-leeze. Why do you think they were kicked out, errrr, "relocated" from downtown?

[r.r. garza]

My grandmother, mother, and my siblings and I grew up in the Victoria Courts. Really a strange place for me as a child. But at the time there was no other choice, or way out. We were dirt poor except for the cinder block courts. Had to accept Relief as it was called then. Really bad feeling growing up that way.
However, somehow, we made it out. I wound up at San Antonio College, so did my sister. I continued on to Texas A&M. I wound up working for major brokerage firms, and now have my own business. My thought is if we had not had that assistance to survive, to somehow want to get out and find a better life, could we have done it without that bare minimum assistance?

[need4speed2012]

People can do whatever they set their minds to, however in today's world many people just expect everything to be given to them instead or working for you.