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Oh nice, sponsored from the epi.org, greatly funded by Unions and, and written by a Teacher. Yes, objective analysis at its finest.
So I assume that means you cant refute the information in the study? So far only thing you have is a graph that paints a very broad picture? Care to refute any information in there? Care to show where it's biased?
FYI, your graph is for 2001-2005, bit dated no?
Quote:
Originally Posted by newjitty
Of all the tables sourced there are only 2 from the BLS, surprisingly neither showing actual dollar numbers.
The other tables are done buy IPUMS-CPS.
Who is IPUMS-CPS?
"IPUMS-CPS is an integrated set of data from 49 years (1962-2010) of the March Current Population Survey (CPS). The CPS is a monthly U.S. household survey conducted jointly by the U.S. Census Bureau and the Bureau of Labor Statistics."
They do show public employees receive a much higher percentage for health plans and pensions of which they contribute little to and make for great tax deductions.
Never disagreed with you here. But you don't read. So you missed it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by newjitty
It even links a Table to a 1999 source. Ahh, cherry picking is fun.
And a fine cherry picking job you did. So still no reading of the study huh?
Quote:
Originally Posted by newjitty
Do you miss me that much? You tease, and there you were saying you blocked me all along, when you've been following me all along and keeping up to date with my posts. Another lie?
It's kind of sad that I'm such a huge part of your life, but I'm flattered.
Oh gotta love it when adults act like children! Cant argue so you become nasty and sarcastic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by newjitty
It seems you don't want to answer the question actually affecting the OP..
Using the 2009 source from the Bureau of Economic Analysis, do you see that State and Local Government workers make more than Private workers in comparable occupations?
Yes or no works, unless you want to keep dancing at my whim.
Lets keep dancing around, you like to use one graph, I got 14 pages of data. Can you provide a breakdown of how the graph works? Maybe then I can prove it wrong. You on the other hand can just keep calling what I have biased, without proving anything.
So I'm gonna assume since you ignored the question a few times your company got bailout money. Ever think about doing one big global post on city data saying thanks to everyone?
"IPUMS-CPS is an integrated set of data from 49 years (1962-2010) of the March Current Population Survey (CPS).
Still doesn't change the fact that it's directed by a University employee.
You still haven't addressed why the only 2 tables from the BLS in that study, surprisingly don't have actual dollar numbers, and were marked "unpublished."
Could you find a an actual finished source not marked "unpublished" by a government Bureau showing actual dollar amounts?
Instead you provide an analysis with "unpublished" data sourced from IPUMS, who's director is a professor from the University of Minnesota.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeym81
Oh gotta love it when adults act like children!
Like below?
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeym81
We are using the ridiculous amount of vacation that the state gives her.
But in all seriousness, why do you follow me into other city forums and read all my posts when you said you blocked me? Don't you find that kind of activity a little creepy? Seriously.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeym81
So I'm gonna assume since you ignored the question a few times your company got bailout money.
Again, your reading comprehension is severely lacking.. I've responded several posts back that our firm didn't receive any bailouts as we don't make loans but instead, financially plan - as in let our clients know how much taxes will rise next year to fund your wife's salary et al.
Do you need it in bar graph form to comprehend?
Again, can you find an actual finished source by a government Bureau not marked "unpublished" as in the analysis you keep quoting?
It would help if that study weren't run by a professor of a University, like IPUMS is, and showed actual dollar amounts like I've shown you from the BEA.
Still doesn't change the fact that it's directed by a University employee.
You still haven't addressed why the only 2 tables from the BLS in that study, surprisingly don't have actual dollar numbers, and were marked "unpublished."
Could you find a an actual finished source not marked "unpublished" by a government Bureau showing actual dollar amounts?
Instead you provide an analysis with "unpublished" data sourced from IPUMS, who's director is a professor from the University of Minnesota.
This is funny, you know table 3, the one you say is unpublished? That table comes from BLS, the source you've been using all along! The link is right there!
So does this mean your BLS graph is no good, since your source is alos from a professor?
When you feel like reading the article come back, I'll be happy to debate it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by newjitty
But in all seriousness, why do you follow me into other city forums and read all my posts when you said you blocked me? Don't you find that kind of activity a little creepy? Seriously.
Didnt follow you, but you can think what you want,doesnt bother me.
And I did have you on ignore. Anytime a thread degrades to the point our last thread does I do. Otherwise it'll keep going since I dont shutup. I usually block for a few weeks then stop ignoring.
Last edited by mikeym81; 10-13-2010 at 10:25 PM..
Reason: .
This is funny, you know table 3, the one you say is unpublished? That table comes from BLS, the source you've been using all along! The link is right there!
"Private industry employers spent an average of $27.42 per hour worked for total employee compensation in December 2009."
"Total compensation costs for state and local government workers averaged $39.60 per hour worked in December 2009."
Look, they have a color coded chart for you too.
Was there a reason why your analysis left this part out?Cherry picking much?
Funny how Table 3 in the analysis you provided doesn't contain any BLS dollar amounts and specifically strengthens my point that state and local gov't workers receive a higher percentage of health benefits and pensions, despite contributing less to it, further utilizing these benefits as tax deductions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeym81
Oh, and FYI BLS is ran by a Dr. Keith Hall. A former professor at Universities of Arkansas and Missouri.
Dr. Keith Hall, Commissioner (http://www.bls.gov/bls/senior_staff/hall.htm - broken link)
So does this mean your BLS graph is no good, since your source is alos from a professor?
..digging your grave further
Keith Hall, could be a former fluffer for all I care but he's the current Commissioner of the BLS and a former professor, as you've noted.
The only Table in your analysis using actual dollar amounts is from a IPUMS, directed by a current professor of a University (ie a biased, non-Government source)
You do know the difference between current and former, do you?
You do also know your analysis is in part by EPI, a union funded think tank?
You do know union funded think tanks are NOT part of the US Government, unlike the BEA graph I've posted again below?
Again, reading comprehension.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeym81
When you feel like reading the article come back, I'll be happy to debate it.
"Private industry employers spent an average of $27.42 per hour worked for total employee compensation in December 2009."
"Total compensation costs for state and local government workers averaged $39.60 per hour worked in December 2009."
Look they even have a nice color coded chart showing wages and salaries BY THEMSELVES are higher for state and local government vs private industry.
This is from your link, which part exactly aren't you comprehending?
Or are you pretending not to understand so that taxpayers will continue funding your wife's salary unquestioned?
You've displayed HORRID reading comprehension, and I suggest you seek professional assistance about it and sincerely hope you overcome your obvious shortcomings.
"Private industry employers spent an average of $27.42 per hour worked for total employee compensation in December 2009."
"Total compensation costs for state and local government workers averaged $39.60 per hour worked in December 2009."
Look, they have a color coded chart for you too.
Was there a reason why your analysis left this part out?Cherry picking much?
Funny how Table 3 in the analysis you provided doesn't contain any BLS dollar amounts and specifically strengthens my point that state and local gov't workers receive a higher percentage of health benefits and pensions, despite contributing less to it, further utilizing these benefits as tax deductions.
..digging your grave further
Keith Hall, could be a former fluffer for all I care but he's the current Commissioner of the BLS and a former professor, as you've noted.
The only Table in your analysis using actual dollar amounts is from a IPUMS, directed by a current professor of a University (ie a biased, non-Government source)
You do know the difference between current and former, do you?
You do also know your analysis is in part by EPI, a union funded think tank?
You do know union funded think tanks are NOT part of the US Government, unlike the BEA graph I've posted again below?
"Private industry employers spent an average of $27.42 per hour worked for total employee compensation in December 2009."
"Total compensation costs for state and local government workers averaged $39.60 per hour worked in December 2009."
Look they even have a nice color coded chart showing wages and salaries BY THEMSELVES are higher for state and local government vs private industry.
This is from your link, which part exactly aren't you comprehending?
Or are you pretending not to understand so that taxpayers will continue funding your wife's salary unquestioned?
You've displayed HORRID reading comprehension, and I suggest you seek professional assistance about it and sincerely hope you overcome your obvious shortcomings.
Did I really did my own grave?
From the same link:
"Cmparing private and public sector data
Compensation cost levels in state and local government should not be directly compared with levels in private
industry. Differences between these sectors stem from factors such as variation in work activities and occupational
structures. Manufacturing and sales, for example, make up a large part of private industry work activities but are
rare in state and local government. Professional and administrative support occupations (including teachers) account
for two-thirds of the state and local government workforce, compared with one-half of private industry"
Hence why someone went and made a 14 page study to further investigate the issue.
So just wondering, what would you consider a fair salary for someone with a doctorate and 2 years of extra schooling to become a specialist in ID?
Generally librarians are required to obtain a masters degree and there is only one university within this state that offers this degree (San Jose State Univ). I think the pay quoted in this thread is outrageously high but I have no issues with 70-100K annually.
ummmm ... Berkeley, USC, UCLA and several other California universities offer the masters degree in library and information science ...
Be that as it may, nobody has answered Aloha's question ... people are getting all bunched up over a retired librarian collected an 11K per year pension???? Really?????
Yeah, there's no comparison with the librarians, I guess unless you're looking at college/research libraries.
I work in a technical field that I *can* make direct comparisons to, though.
I actually agree with yuou about contracting out many city positions.
But heck, I'd be happy to work as contractor for the city rather than a city employee given how much they pay the contractors that *do* work for them. Since I have no one to support but myself that would actually work out pretty well even if I was paying for my own healthcare, etc
As do I and I have a good friend that has the (nearly) exact same job working for the City. While the pay is comparable his retirement is far and above anything I could ever coup from a private company. He can retire in his 50's with an extremely generous tax payer funded pension. It has only been in the last few years that they've chipped away at any of his benefits either. Benefits that are no way substainable.
What really torqued off City employees was the DB that allowed clarity to what they make if you know their name. Just type in their name and it shows pay. We are the employer, we are entitled to know what we pay them. IMO we should be allowed to shift pay for the same reason.
But you are right, organized labor has prevented any real reform in contract labor. Hopefully Sanders can be the leadership that gets that turned around.
ummmm ... Berkeley, USC, UCLA and several other California universities offer the masters degree in library and information science ...
Be that as it may, nobody has answered Aloha's question ... people are getting all bunched up over a retired librarian collected an 11K per year pension???? Really?????
ummmmmm seems like someone needs to go to university..
The figures are ANNUAL, as in $227,000+ PER YEAR pension paid by taxpayers.
Guess I picked the wrong profession in the wrong state.
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