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Thread summary:

San Diego: politics, university, Prop D, marriage equality.

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Old 11-04-2008, 08:11 AM
 
Location: San Diego native.
470 posts, read 1,702,913 times
Reputation: 118

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I'm straight, and married. Every person I know who will vote yes on 8 believes gay people are immoral and abnormal. I vehemently disagree. I may not understand the attraction between same sex partners, but that does not entitle me to exercise the extreme selfishness of demanding that people love like I do in order to marry as I can.

I do believe people who vote yes on 8 ARE BIGOTS. They know it too but it's not socially acceptable to admit it. Because bottom line, the bigots don't care that the children and partners of gay couples are disadvantaged because they cannot marry, or their currently legal marriage license will be revoked.

There are over 1,000 rights available to legally married couples. Even if Prop. 8 does not pass, there is more work to be done to align federal rights with state's rights.

A bigot is a person who is intolerant of opinions, lifestyles, or identities differing from his or her own, and bigotry is the corresponding state of mind. Bigot is often used as a pejorative term against a person who is obstinately devoted to prejudices even when these views are challenged or proven to be false or not universally applicable or acceptable.

(Wikipedia definition - handy)

Last edited by Suzer; 11-04-2008 at 08:29 AM..

 
Old 11-04-2008, 08:16 AM
 
Location: San Diego native.
470 posts, read 1,702,913 times
Reputation: 118
For those of you support Prop. 8, I would really be interested in hearing your point of view on homosexuality. Publicly, and without restraint and revision.
 
Old 11-04-2008, 09:47 AM
 
Location: San Diego
5,026 posts, read 15,246,232 times
Reputation: 4887
I just don't get why people get to vote on whether someone gets to marry the love of their life. That shouldn't even be an issue. I was in Hillcrest on Saturday night and stopped at the No on 8 Headquarters to get my stickers. Some great volunteers working there. Get out there today and vote NO on 8!!
 
Old 11-04-2008, 11:15 AM
 
Location: Silver Spring, Maryland / But still having San Diego / Eastlake withdrawal damn it !!!
340 posts, read 1,407,794 times
Reputation: 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by sav858 View Post
I just want to start off by saying I am not defending anything MisterMark has said with regards to Prop 8 to you or in general. If you're gay this is going to be an emotional issue and I understand how some people who may not be so extreme or partisan normally would get so with this issue.

Both Mayor Jerry Sanders and VP Dick Cheney have reversed their opposition to gay marriage because of their lesbian daughters. I always think it is a good thing to put yourself in someone else's shoes to at least gain perspective on an issue. If this goes against your fundamental religious beliefs then so be it, I cannot and will not argue against people's deeply held religious beliefs. With that said, I just want to ask you one simple question: If your child was gay would you support allowing them to get married or not?? YES or NO? I've asked this question on the CA forum and only one person responded and instead of actually answering the question tried to twist it around on me and never actually answered it at all and refused to answer it after I asked it again. This is a simple yes or no answer, feel free to explain your answer too whether it be yes or no. I am just trying to understand where opposing views are coming from. Some Yes on 8 people are straight up bigots and haters and I don't even bother with them b/c its pointless. But people like yourself, who may have different political opinions than me, I do not consider bigots and am just trying to see where they are coming from so at the very least I can agree to disagree. So I ask for you to answer honestly, if your child was gay would you support them being allowed to get married or not? YES or NO?

Hi Sav,

Like you I always like to hear different views , not necessarily because they will change my mind or thoughts totally , but sometimes there can be an argument that does resonate one way or the others from my original option. I think that's one reason I loved the San Diego area and Eastlake area where we lived for its diversity. Politically, culturally and for the most part I found the whole area to be very laid back whatever political ilk you are, which I can't always say about the East coast back here in the DC area.

But to your question and I've taken alot of thought of how I would handle that. I'm 41 years young/old(got a late start) and have two daughters that are 4 and 5 months old.They are the joys of my life. It would be easy for me to say at this point that I would not give my blessing to them if they were to be gay and wanted to enter into a committed same sex marriage.

The fact of the matter is although I personally wouldn't "perfer" that scenario and I don't plan to be a in your face parent who determines there children life for them. So I would go against my personal beliefs and give my blessing and approval.

But I would also like to say that if one of my daughters came to me and told me they wanted to marry a certain man that they knew I really wasn't crazy about or didn't think was right for them. Yet I knew she was head over heels for this guy and it wouldn't really matter what anyone said , again I would give my blessing and hope for the best.

There of course would be alot of soul searching if it ever comes to that, but I'm convinced that is what I would probably do.

Now if the next question from someone would be : Well then would you support "same sex marriage to become law"? My answer would still be no and this is why.

Although Im Catholic raised , I'm really only a twice a year Catholic praciticing at least. I have my own personal faith and beliefs that are really not always inline with the church , but I don't try to change them to please me.

I believe marriage is not taken seriously these days by any gender. That marriage should be taken more seriously between a man and women and be given the place in society it once had. It seems that couples these days so easily give up a married at the drop of a hat when the going gets a little tough. Thats so wrong especially when children are involved.

Anywat my 5 month little girl is crying and needs to be fed, but SAV I hope I answered your question. I guess the ultimate answer was yes I would give up my principles to make my daughters/sons happy. But I still wouldn't personally want the law changed either way.

Hopefully we can agree to disagree.

One last thing, if same sex marriage passes today or 5 years from now. I don't think it will be that end of the world either.
 
Old 11-04-2008, 11:34 AM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
18,967 posts, read 32,455,531 times
Reputation: 13615
Bunky,

Thank you for your honest response and I see where you're coming from. That's good that you've actually thought about this before, most people don't even want to bother thinking about that situation. So it seems like your opposition to gay marriage isn't that rigid in the sense you aren't 100% against it but overall would rather not have the definition changed, at the moment at least. Personally I think their is a little doubt there and if the situation actually arose you might support gay marriage for your daughter, but that is just what I think and its completely hypothetical of course. I do agree that marriage is not taken that seriously today, although I don't think gay marriage will change anything with regards to that overall. Anyways, thanks for the perspective.

Last edited by sav858; 11-04-2008 at 11:46 AM..
 
Old 11-04-2008, 11:42 AM
 
Location: San Diego
5,026 posts, read 15,246,232 times
Reputation: 4887
The divorce rate in this country is over 50%. Since the only recognized marriages right now(for the most part) are heterosexual ones, we can safely assume heterosexuals are failing at this whole marriage thing. Maybe we can learn a thing or two about long, loving commitments from the homosexuals. How many of you that voted yes on 8 are on your 2nd or 3rd marriage? Divorce affects your children more than seeing two happy people together, regardless of sex.
 
Old 11-04-2008, 11:53 AM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
18,967 posts, read 32,455,531 times
Reputation: 13615
I understand how some people feel that marriage is between a man and a woman. But others feel it's between 2 consenting adults regardless of gender. Everyone is entitled to their beliefs but the govt shouldn't be taking sides like this.

There is NO law on gay marriage at all currently. The recent court ruling just stated you can't ban same sex couples from getting married. If you don't want to believe gay people are married then fine, that is your prerogative and you don't have to recognize their marriage. But I think it's unfair to push those beliefs onto others who do not agree with that. Live and let live.

Just realize this is enacting more government control over people's personal lives. Prop 8 is MORE govt, not less like they claim. Do some of you that support Prop 8 fundamentally believe the govt has the right to tell you what to do with your personal lives?
 
Old 11-04-2008, 02:12 PM
 
26,680 posts, read 28,581,632 times
Reputation: 7943
Quote:
Originally Posted by bunky3301 View Post
Although Im Catholic raised , I'm really only a twice a year Catholic praciticing at least. I have my own personal faith and beliefs that are really not always inline with the church , but I don't try to change them to please me.
Did you know that the Catholic Church is against birth control and even against having an orgasm outside of marriage? Should those positions be written into our laws too?
 
Old 11-04-2008, 03:22 PM
 
Location: Silver Spring, Maryland / But still having San Diego / Eastlake withdrawal damn it !!!
340 posts, read 1,407,794 times
Reputation: 179
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale View Post
Did you know that the Catholic Church is against birth control and even against having an orgasm outside of marriage? Should those positions be written into our laws too?
Feel free to write that law if you wish, but I wouldn't vote for it sir. If you read my quote instead of just seeing "red" when you saw the word "Catholic" you wouldn't have written your post. It always take the enjoyment out of a good debate when posters use knee jerk reactions.
 
Old 11-04-2008, 10:57 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
858 posts, read 2,229,765 times
Reputation: 368
Sorry because it's not related to San Diego, but congrats to Mr. President Obama!
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