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The sad part is oaklands comeback means shedding its identity as a city and reinventing itself as a suburb of sf.
Oaklands got a lot of things wrong with it but atleast in some respects its cool. You can go to a bar and you can drink with some hardnosed dock workers from the port, as opposed to some doof hipster named sky with blue hair who pays 5 bucks for a pabst, in sf.
You can go to a ball game and can take the wife and kids and get food and still spend less than 100 bucks.
Who the hell wants to see the fruitvale become the mission? At least at fruitvale I can get a burrito with out walking through 1000 trendy turds who all dress in skinny jeans and look like trash even though their parents pay their rent.
Unlike Man francisco and Bland Jose, Oakland actually has some old school funk and soul (though the people with it are leaving)
Get what I am saying?
Brooklyn used to be cool BECAUSE it was brooklyn. Because of the types of places, and tpyes of people found there. Now brooklyn is cool, because it is a subway ride away from manhattan.
Id hate to see Oakland turn out that way.
I don't get your post. How does getting a beer with hard nosed dock workers make one city better than the other ? What's wrong with having trendy people with Mission ? Calling other cities "Man Francisco" and "Bland Jose" will not do anything to Oakland. If you want to make a point of how good Oakland is you have do it on its own merit and not pissing on other places. That won't go too far.
I don't get your post. How does getting a beer with hard nosed dock workers make one city better than the other ? What's wrong with having trendy people with Mission ? Calling other cities "Man Francisco" and "Bland Jose" will not do anything to Oakland. If you want to make a point of how good Oakland is you have do it on its own merit and not pissing on other places. That won't go too far.
THe problem with the trendy people in the Mission is that they came in, and changed the Mission into the neighborhood they wanted (aka gentrification). No one has a problem with Trendy people visiting and adapting, but pushing out the old character for something else isn't right either. Especially when the "new" isn't inclusive of the "old."
Well I moved to Oakland for the following reasons:
1. I wanted something urban/walkable
2. Berkeley has all all of the urban problems and none of the urban conveniences (crappy overpriced apartments, lots of traffic, no freeway access, really dirty, lots of homeless people)
3. SF is very expensive for crappy apartments. You have 3 choices if you don't want to pay $2000: you can freeze in the fog, live somewhere sketchy, or live in a weird neighborhood with only bus transit access options
In my book Oakland has the following essential amenities:
1. Sunny weather
2. Reasonable access to transit
3. Diversity, meaning no one thinks it is crazy if a group of people includes a white person, and asian person and a black person at the same table
4. Good food for eating out and buying groceries to make yourself
5. Central location to my most frequent Bay haunts (SF, Berkeley, Alameda, Albany, Walnut Creek)
6. Friendly people
7. Basic neighborhood amenities close by
8. Walkability
9. Interesting architecture
Stuff I dislike:
1. Schools! Ugh (but I think the entire state is failing so this is a big flaw of CA)
2. Negative perception and mainstream media coverage (I'd love some balanced coverage of Oakland)
3. Downtown needs more life! (I want to move over there, but it still feels ghost town-y in parts, especially on the weekend)
4. Crappy city management. Sheesh, they are inspring me to work in government or city planning
I can't think og a location in the Bay that offers what I am looking for at this point, but I wish that the city of Oakland could learn how to present a polished image to the outside world. Oakland has all of the building blocks to be a world renowned city, unfortunately I am not sure the current leadership can get us there. Looking at things like the "MeetDowntownOakland" website, the proposals submitted to Lawrence Livermore labs for their office space RFP, the entire A's stadium debacle and Mayor Quan's media presence leave a lot to be desired.
Oakland, California's diamond in the rough, is gonna make a comeback. It's just a matter of time.
In a lot of ways, I actually hope it doesn't. I don't want it to become more like SF or Berkeley, and after living here for almost five years, I've noticed that it's changing in some ways I'm not thrilled about. While I like the fact that areas like Uptown and Tesmescal have undergone a lot of really nice transformations, I don't like the influx of hipster douchebags that crowd the old school bars and restaurants I tend to frequent. The only thing I really want is for Oakland to become is safer and have better schools. I'm cool with Oakland being an underrated and more affordable alternative to SF. Oakland is charming because of its grit, and the mix of people that live here seem to get that. I love Oakland for the city that it is now, warts and all, and I'll be sad if it changes into something I no longer recognize.
But as we know, Oakland doesn't always "sing to people's hearts" the way SF, LA, or SD does. Oakland kind of caught two bad breaks at once. First, they are kind of tucked away from SF. Then they got a bad reputation through the abundance of crime statistics in the last decade. Combine those things and you got a place that is not desired by most people unless they have a reason to be there.
I've always thought of Oakland as an area that would be part of SF if it wasn't for the Bay in between them. I see it as similar to places like Brooklyn in NYC or the outer parts of the North Side in Chicago, as a quieter, more spread out, more residential counterpart to the denser and more citified and more expensive SF, which is like Manhattan in NYC or the Near North Side in Chicago.
From what I've read, Oakland started out as very much its own city with a lot of manufacturing and car dealerships and so on, but in recent decades as businesses moved out it stopped being as much of a hub for employment and is now mostly a bedroom community for people working in other areas like SF or the Walnut Creek/Pleasant Hill area.
As for gentrification, I'm mixed on it. As a white person who doesn't make much money, I find it annoying how it raises prices for everyone and brings in a lot of boring yuppies and empty nesters who clog up the restaurants and bars. In just the last few years SF has gotten worse in this regard in places like the Mission. It's hard for me to go back to the Mission and not get annoyed by all the yuppies clogging up all the new plasticky restaurants that are replacing the old pupuserias and dive bars, but on the other hand I'd find it hard to go back to the way it was when I first moved to the Mission in 2004 and it was wall to wall drug dealers, junkies, winos, gang members, crazy people, crazy homeless people, etc...a lot of those people are still there but noticeably less, and there's more yuppie-style places on or east of Mission than there used to be.
Gentrification does reduce crime a lot, and means buildings are in better shape and not falling apart. But I think SF is just out of hand these days. Oakland feels a lot more comfortable to me, the gentrification is a lot more limited in nature compared to in SF and most areas are still a bit scruffy compared with SF, even places like Piedmont Avenue or the Grand Lake area--everything feels more modest and middle class, and the people too, whereas in SF everyone seems either really wealthy or really poor.
Even in the depths of this really horrible recession I've been really impressed with how vibrant and "up and coming" Oakland feels, especially in the areas around downtown and Lake Merritt--lots of new buildings and restaurants. There's still a lot of grubby areas and a lot of crime but I think Oakland will really turn out well in the next several years.
In a lot of ways, I actually hope it doesn't. I don't want it to become more like SF or Berkeley, and after living here for almost five years, I've noticed that it's changing in some ways I'm not thrilled about. While I like the fact that areas like Uptown and Tesmescal have undergone a lot of really nice transformations, I don't like the influx of hipster douchebags that crowd the old school bars and restaurants I tend to frequent. The only thing I really want is for Oakland to become is safer and have better schools. I'm cool with Oakland being an underrated and more affordable alternative to SF. Oakland is charming because of its grit, and the mix of people that live here seem to get that. I love Oakland for the city that it is now, warts and all, and I'll be sad if it changes into something I no longer recognize.
LoL @ some one from North Carolina who has been in Oakland less than five years talking about "influxes" of people crowding "old school" establishments one frequents. The changes Oakland has been enduring started well before you arrived wide eyed to the state for the first time. No matter how hard you try, you will never be a native. Let it go.
LoL @ some one from North Carolina who has been in Oakland less than five years talking about "influxes" of people crowding "old school" establishments one frequents. The changes Oakland has been enduring started well before you arrived wide eyed to the state for the first time. No matter how hard you try, you will never be a native. Let it go.
Creepy that you remember and later reference this stuff.
Regardless, he lives in Oakland and you never have. And regardless of the idea that he didn't witness all of Oaklands history unfold before him in real-time, he still makes a valid point and has a rational viewpoint on the topic.
So, what are you arguing about anyway? You just wanted to start more grudges on this website?
Creepy that you remember and later reference this stuff.
Regardless, he lives in Oakland and you never have. And regardless of the idea that he didn't witness all of Oaklands history unfold before him in real-time, he still makes a valid point and has a rational viewpoint on the topic.
So, what are you arguing about anyway? You just wanted to start more grudges on this website?
/side issue.
Who cares where anyone currently lives. you live out in a cow pasture in freakin' fairfield dude. You might as well be in stockton if thats the case.
What valid points did he make? All the changes in uptown and temsecal happened well before he was in oakland . That stuff was going on when I lived in berkeley 10 years ago.
Theres really no point in whining about the "influx" of people when one is essentialy a part of that influx. I just don't get people who havent lived in california for so much as half a decade trying to act as is if they've observed some sort of noticable change.
Who cares where anyone currently lives. you live out in a cow pasture in freakin' fairfield dude. You might as well be in stockton if thats the case.
What valid points did he make? All the changes in uptown and temsecal happened well before he was in oakland . That stuff was going on when I lived in berkeley 10 years ago.
Theres really no point in whining about the "influx" of people when one is essentialy a part of that influx. I just don't get people who havent lived in california for so much as half a decade trying to act as is if they've observed some sort of noticable change.
Hey Captain Hypocrisy, you're sounding an awful lot like a "provincial" Northern Californian, as you love to refer to us. Apparently not respecting an outsider's perspective is only wrong when its us defending ourselves from idiots on the attack. And speaking of "cow pastures," YOU LIVE IN SUCKRAMENTO LMFAO!!! You boost a 100 square mile cow pasture that makes Fairfield look like Manhattan!
Have you ever come into the SF forum with the intention of ACTUALLY having any kind of realistic, rational discussion? B/c all I (and most people here) have seen from you comes in the form of hating, bashing, and flame-baiting. What is your purpose here? And why have you posted in the SF forum 400% more than the Sac forum when you neither live here nor are from here?
What motivates you to hate on the Bay Area and waste so much energy on something so lame and pointless? I mean other than the liberal politics that you claim to not be diametrically opposed to b/c you are an "independent" and don't participate in "group think" lol (which means you actually thought Meg Whitman would have been a great call for us ALL ON YOUR OWN LMFAO! - way to "think for yourself" and not buy into meaningless bi-partisan rhetoric! ) Did the Bay beat you up and take your lunch money while dumping your sister and insulting your mom? Or is it really just about the aforementioned? Either way, why are you here??
Let me guess, you'll sidestep these questions and cop out by calling me "provincial" for wondering such things, even as you simultaneously behave provincially yourself toward someone else who actually has made the Bay their home and has reason to be posting here other than to spread negativity. Wow dude, your life sounds AWESOME!!!
What valid points did he make? All the changes in uptown and temsecal happened well before he was in oakland . That stuff was going on when I lived in berkeley 10 years ago.
Theres really no point in whining about the "influx" of people when one is essentialy a part of that influx. I just don't get people who havent lived in california for so much as half a decade trying to act as is if they've observed some sort of noticable change.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCal Dude
LoL @ some one from North Carolina who has been in Oakland less than five years talking about "influxes" of people crowding "old school" establishments one frequents. The changes Oakland has been enduring started well before you arrived wide eyed to the state for the first time. No matter how hard you try, you will never be a native. Let it go.
As much as it pains me to agree with you at times, haha, you gotta point. The Bay Area seems to attract a special breed of "know it all" transplants that think they know the place better than long time residents and natives.
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) Did the Bay beat you up and take your lunch money while dumping your sister and insulting your mom? Or is it really just about the aforementioned? Either way, why are you here??
