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Old 12-10-2012, 10:46 AM
 
Location: Chicago
207 posts, read 656,350 times
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Title says it all. If so, is it anything like the one in Los Angeles and the surrounding area
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Old 12-10-2012, 10:49 AM
 
35,102 posts, read 47,959,985 times
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Why not just ask about "Gangs" and not specify one particular group. Do you seriously think Blacks are the ONLY one's in a gang?
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Old 12-10-2012, 10:56 AM
 
Location: Chicago
207 posts, read 656,350 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSD610 View Post
Why not just ask about "Gangs" and not specify one particular group. Do you seriously think Blacks are the ONLY one's in a gang?
no, I'm asking this because on these forums I'm only hearing that it's latino gangs causing the violence
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Old 12-10-2012, 11:17 AM
 
Location: Lafayette, CA
2,518 posts, read 3,835,177 times
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I definitely think there are plenty of black gangs in Oakland. Heavily involved in drug trade.

Of course, some people here think it's only 2-3 people in "turfs". Whatever that means.
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Old 12-10-2012, 11:30 AM
 
Location: Springfield, Ohio
14,206 posts, read 13,098,952 times
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What do you mean "still"? There never was a black gang problem in Oakland, only crews surrounding the drug trade. The LA dynamic never made it up north.
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Old 12-10-2012, 12:46 PM
 
Location: The Bay
6,915 posts, read 13,953,885 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DocGoldstein View Post
I definitely think there are plenty of black gangs in Oakland. Heavily involved in drug trade.

Of course, some people here think it's only 2-3 people in "turfs". Whatever that means.
You have a habit of twisting the words of those you disagree with. Here's what I actually said:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nineties Flava View Post
No, not at all. Gang activity is about expanding the reach and drug territory of a gang as far as possible and pushing other gangs out. There are only three significant gangs in Oakland and they are all latino; everything else is not a gang and what's more they do not function like gangs. Some of the outcomes are the same - in both cases many die over drug money and revenge - but the actual experience of living on the ground in Oakland as a black male is nowhere near the same as what the experience of a latino male living in Oakland is. Gangs try to make names for themselves by killing as many rival gang members as possible and the violence can often have nothing to do with money or drug territory... Turfs are concerned first and foremost about money. If you aren't negatively affecting their income, they don't have a problem with you nor do they care. Outside of that, most of the violence is personal disputes over girls and etc... Sometimes the media erroneously jumps to conclusions about "erupting turf wars" when really it's between at most 2 or 3 people.
What I actually said was that the killings are generally over personal or business disputes between 2-3 people, not that most of the groups themselves are 2-3 people.
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Old 12-10-2012, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Lafayette, CA
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That's how almost ALL disputes are. The Castellamarese War was a dispute between Masseria , and ONE guy from Sicily. It ended up with dozens of people dead. If that was your point, you really didn't have much of a point with the 2-3 people disputes. That's like 99% of disputes.

Just admit that you're trying to mince words with the term "gangs" and "crews", which by even your own definition is the exact same thing.

The fact is Oakland has a huge gang problem.
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Old 12-10-2012, 01:19 PM
 
Location: The Bay
6,915 posts, read 13,953,885 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DocGoldstein View Post
That's how almost ALL disputes are. The Castellamarese War was a dispute between Masseria , and ONE guy from Sicily. It ended up with dozens of people dead. If that was your point, you really didn't have much of a point with the 2-3 people disputes. That's like 99% of disputes.

Just admit that you're trying to mince words with the term "gangs" and "crews", which by even your own definition is the exact same thing.

The fact is Oakland has a huge gang problem.

False once again. The difference between targeted crime somewhere like Chicago (gang city) and Oakland (turf city) is that in Chicago, you can get killed in a gang neighborhood for not being recognized and possibly being a rival gang member; they don't even necessarily know you. I on the other hand can walk through any Oakland neighborhood and me not being from there isn't an issue; I get respect because I show it. If I was in one of the local groups this wouldn't be the case, but for the truly uninvolved Oakland is a much safer place to wander around as a black male than Chicago or Los Angeles or any other gang city.
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Old 12-10-2012, 01:28 PM
 
Location: Lafayette, CA
2,518 posts, read 3,835,177 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nineties Flava View Post
you can get killed in a gang neighborhood for not being recognized and possibly being a rival gang member;
So you walk past Nortenos gang members hanging out in the street without getting hassled or getting beat up?
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Old 12-10-2012, 01:37 PM
 
586 posts, read 1,326,868 times
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In terms of Black folks, the Bay Area is not aligned with true gang culture. In fact, the Black populations in most big cities aren't aligned with gang culture on the level of Chicago or L.A. DC, New Orleans and Philadelphia all don't historically have a large presence of large name brand gangs. In Chicago and L.A., there is endless recruitment, rules and hierarchy involved in the gangs. The "turfs" in the Bay Area are mostly a loose association of childhood friends who grew up together. However, in San Francisco in the 80's and 90's, the back and forth violence between rivaling neighborhoods could be accurately described as gang violence. Different neighborhoods wore different clothing identifiers (i.e. Lakeview wore UNLV apparel and Sunnydale wore San Diego Padres apparel). However, the difference between San Francisco turf crews and L.A./Chicago gangs is that there was no getting jumped in or recruitment involved. You were born in a neighborhood, you are from there. But in all honesty, the turf gangs are not all that different from Chicago/L.A. gangs. It is kids from one poor ghetto neighborhood killing kids from another poor ghetto neighborhood across town over a dumb petty beef from sometimes decades ago that no one remembers the origins. Sadly, a huge amount of youth violence killings between different neighborhoods has nothing to do with drugs or money, but has to do with vengeance for the death of fallen friends and beef over words. And you could definitely get killed in SF being a young Black kid wearing an SD hat or UNLV jersey in the wrong part of town; especially in the late 80's and early 90's. Is that really different than getting killed over a color? No.

But I do agree with Nineties that cities that are less gang oriented have much less random acts of violence based on arbitrary things like clothing identifiers. Although different Black neighborhoods in the Bay have their clothing identifiers of often obscure sports teams, it is nothing on the level of L.A. where, historically, you can be killed over as much as wearing red or blue as a young Black male or Chicago where damn near every major sports logo is tied to a major gang:

http://www.complex.com/sports/2010/0...hats-in-sports

Black turf crews in the Bay Area have always been more oriented towards getting money by selling drugs than anything else.

Last edited by LunaticVillage; 12-10-2012 at 01:57 PM..
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