Is anyone really happy (Freedom: health insurance, credit card, water heater)

[SunDevil1212]

Originally Posted by clongirl

...and I'm pretty sure that you'll find displays of wealth in every single nice neighborhood in every single state (and in most countries, too). Wealth is not something that only happens in the Bay Area.

You find wealth in every state in the country, sure, but nothing even close to the sheer volume of it that exists within Bay Area. Not even close. The wealth here is not confined to a few exclusive neighborhoods - it exists almost within the majority of San Francisco, all the way down the peninsula, the Oakland and Berkeley Hills, almost the entire county of Marin....then the estates of wine country....it goes on and on and on. I walk around and think "what do all these people DO? Not everyone can be a CEO, right??"

Median home prices in San Francisco are 10X the median home price in the U.S. 10X! (source: Home price jump is more rebound than bubble)

If you are not used to this, it can indeed be shocking. And, if you are making the median SF salary and still scraping by to pay your $2500 rent on your 1-bedroom apartment, it can be frustrating and discouraging. The people that I know who became "unhappy" and left SF left for one reason only - cost of living.

I will clarify my original comment by saying that the amount of wealth doesn't bother me personally. If anything, it produces a sense of awe (as sliverbox alludes to) and motivates me to further my career. I am paying the high cost of living here because I want to live in what I consider to be the most beautiful and one of the most vibrant cities in the country for a few years before I settle down with a family. And its worth every penny to me, at the moment anyway.

[Mouldy Old Schmo]

Jimmy Soul - If You Want To Be Happy - YouTube

[sliverbox]

It sounds to me as though you may have grown up in the bay area and regard this as normal. To those of us coming from most other parts of the world the incredible degree of wealth in the bay area and the degree to which it is flaunted is shocking. Most metropolitan areas have nothing that is equivalent to Pac Heights or Marin. It took me several years to get used to it after having spent most of my life in the south and the northwest. In my daily commute, it is quite typical to look around and see several luxury cars around me. Where I grew up, seeing a Mercedes pass by was cause for someone to turn their head and say "Damn! Mercedes!",

I had the same experience. I too grew up in the South and BMW's were very rare creatures. Out here seems like everyone and their mother drives some sort of bimmer or something along those lines.

My interpretation is that most of the big businesses are still crammed on the coasts. I lived in the Northeast for awhile and there too was a LOT of extremely wealthy people. The difference was that many came from "old money", as in their family had made a fortune at some point and they resided in a number of huge, almost cartoony-looking richie-rich looking houses.

Out here there's more new wealth. It also seems to me that the increases in wealthy people is tied to the patterns of booms and busts here. Where I grew up you would buy a ordinary house for a modest amount of money, made a modest wage, and the area economy would slowly but reliably grow at a sluggish 2-4% annually. As such there was a sort of reliance on stability. Here the economy is like a rip-blade pattern. Dramatic spikes in booms and busts in all aspects. The housing market, economy, and so forth all boom and bust every 5-7 years. As a result there is very much a " Better get in now before its too late!" sort of mentality. Its like the Fast Forward button is permanently on.

And this final observation isn't necessarily specific to this region. But I think a lot of people equate happiness with societal expectations and pressure:

If you get married you "have" to buy a house.
If you buy a house, you "Have" to have kids
If you have kids, you "Have" to buy a super-safe SUV
If you buy the super-safe SUV you have to take them to the BEST schools
If you take them to the BEST schools, you have to show the other parents what a good parent you are by getting the kids the best clothes and so on.

The list goes on and on and on. But ultimately people base a lot of their decision on a set of invisible rules they think must be followed. Otherwise something must surely be wrong.

[bigdumbgod]

Originally Posted by silverkris

Actually, I think the bling factor or ostentatious show of wealth is more pronounced in the Los Angeles/Orange County region than in the SF Bay Area.

Yes, it's a South OC behavior exported to SF. It's still more pronounced down there, but SF is making due "progress" on that unfortunate front.

[peninsular]

Originally Posted by SunDevil1212

...
Median home prices in San Francisco are 10X the median home price in the U.S. 10X! (source: Home price jump is more rebound than bubble)
...

You actually misread that part. The median price in SF is not 10x of the median US, it's 10x of the household income.

Historically, median home prices in San Francisco are eight times the median household incomes, Burns says. They're now 10 times larger.

The number you were interested in is "only" 4x. US median house price (2012) 221K, while the same in SF (Apr 2013) is 925K (source).

This, of course, is not apples-to-apples comparison for multiple reasons. Sources of numbers are different. Also the per-sq-ft picture is different, since square footage in SF is significantly smaller than a US average. That number is probably closer to 6x or higher.

[SunDevil1212]

Originally Posted by peninsular

You actually misread that part. The median price in SF is not 10x of the median US, it's 10x of the household income.

The number you were interested in is "only" 4x. US median house price (2012) 221K, while the same in SF (Apr 2013) is 925K (source).

This, of course, is not apples-to-apples comparison for multiple reasons. Sources of numbers are different. Also the per-sq-ft picture is different, since square footage in SF is significantly smaller than a US average. That number is probably closer to 6x or higher.

Noted, thanks for pointing out the error.

[FelixTheCat]

Originally Posted by roadwarrior101

Here are my personal observations as someone who's lived in both the city and in the Silicon Valley:

-Happiness - Yes, there are people in the city that are genuinely happy. They tend to be of the younger age and have large social circles. Keep in mind that these people most likely met most of their friends either at school or at work (at a company where there are a lot of younger, like minded people).
-Meeting new friends - If you do not fall into the above categories, I think its exceptionally difficult to develop a large social network. I've lived in both San Diego and Phoenix and found that in both places, people were much more willing to take on a new friendship when you hit it off with them at a party or some other social event. Here, I find that I often hit it off with someone, trade numbers/emails and when I try to follow up to get together, no response. My wife and I talked about whether its just us or a symptom of the Bay Area. I will say that after reading these posts, it seems to be commonplace. I've never had difficulty meeting friends in other cities. People here in general just seem so cliquish and/or incredibly busy constantly working.
-Elitism - True, it is a very educated, diverse population. However, there is an air of elitism here. People seem to want to cling to judge you as to whether you went to Stanford or the Ivy's. If you did not, you're apparently not of the same social/intellectual stature. True, people are less image conscious here, but they're superficial in other ways.
-Laid back - I don't buy what other folks say. Yes, it is very liberal here. However, if you are moderate to conservative, you'll feel out of place. Also, if you're part of a big clique, you'll find everyone you meet to be friendly, but if you're trying to break into a new circle, you'll probably find people to be very closed minded
-Cost of living - Completely ridiculous. Yes, there are more job opportunities here, but it feels that as my career grows (and rather rapidly for that matter), the dream home seems further and further out of reach.

Things I do like about the bay area:

-Climate - More so since I moved down to the Silicon Valley. Yes, SF is much milder than you'd find in other parts of the country, but in the summer, it can be downright cold. Maybe other folks will think its ridiculous to complain about 60 degrees, but I sorely missed a warm summer and had to leave the city, partially due to that reason. If you're away from the city, the climate is pretty tough to beat, but I'm not sure if that's enough to keep me here long-term.
-Restaurants - I love the food/wine scene here. However, I will say that other cities are catching up, so I'm not sure if I'm going to miss this terribly if I were to relocate
-Weekend getaways - Probably my favorite thing about the Bay Area. People here tend to live for the weekend and lots of places to go near by, such as Napa/Sonoma, Monterey, Tahoe or Yosemite. I think that would be what I would miss the most in leaving the Bay Area. Then again, with the money I'd save living elsewhere, I could fly places on weekends

Bottom line, SF is a great place to live if you're young, single, educated and have a large social network. However, you'll find that over time, as your friends marry and have kids, they'll move away and what was exciting to you at one time, loses much of its luster. You'll find that your financial needs increase dramatically, to the point where you question whether its worth it. The Bay Area is an amazing place, but I'm not sure if its a great place to live in all points in your life.

i agree with this. you better not be a slacker if wanting to enjoy living in the bay area. to get the most of it you need to be fairly ambitious. i agree with the friends thing too. it's possible to make new friends, but maintenance of new friendships is difficult. it would be best to look for new friends who live very close to you and have overlapping interest. i would pass on trying to be part of a group of friends though, but that might just be me.

[FelixTheCat]

Originally Posted by bigdumbgod

Yes, it's a South OC behavior exported to SF. It's still more pronounced down there, but SF is making due "progress" on that unfortunate front.

i don't understand people who complain about other people showing off their wealth. i don't care about social status or driving a fancy car. but if other people care about that, then so what? don't pay any attention to them. the bay area is geographically large, diverse and has a large population. associate with whoever you want and don't worry about what other people do. i'm not speaking specifically to you, but to people who are bothered by such people. i even have friends who are like that to some degree and they don't care that i don't care about social status, which i find interesting. i think they are just insecure and want to use their fancy stuff to be accepted.

[bentobox34]

Originally Posted by WF76

The few wealthy people I know outside of the bay area are very aware that they are of a privileged class. The wealthy people I know in the bay area do not appear to have any understanding of their privilege, perhaps because many neighborhoods in SF are homogenously upper class.

Part of the reason they don't understand their privilege may be because people who would be defined as "wealthy" anywhere else in the country are often still struggling financially here.

[bentobox34]

Originally Posted by SunDevil1212

Here's the litmus test: Do you see someone in a $20M house and think "that filthy greedy pig!", or do you think "good for them, I hope to be successful like that someday"?

I honestly think it's the second answer that is the quicker path to Bay Area bitterness. If you hope you will buy a $20m house someday you are in for disappointment, because far more than 99% of us, even here in the Bay Area, will never be buying that house no matter what.

When I see someone like that I think, "They chose one path, I chose another." I am in a middle class career path that has a salary ceiling in the bottom half of the six figures, and that's quite enough for me.