I'm not feeling San Francisco. (Los Angeles: tenants, public school, restaurant)

[dalparadise]

Originally Posted by roadwarrior101

Completely agree with you on this. We spent 4 years in the city as DINKs and thoroughly enjoyed our time there. We didn't have to rely on cars very much, went out to nice dinners all the time, had tons of nightlife, etc. We also couldn't imagine why others would choose to live in the suburbs and deal with terrible commutes every day.

But, then we had kids. I just don't think SF is very kid friendly at all. When you have kids, you learn that you need to do a lot of runs to Target, Costco, Babies R Us, Safeway, etc. These aren't very convenient when you live in the city and want to do these runs quickly. You also want more space for the kids to run around in a yard and be in a safe area. Then there are the schools. In general, the school quality in SF isn't great.

Unless you're a multi-millionnaire, who can send your kids to the best private schools and can afford full time nanny support, living in SF becomes more of a hassle than its worth. You're just not going to be able to have the time to go out to the nice restaurants and enjoy the amenities of SF on a regular basis.

I don't love my commute, but all things considered, it was my best option to stay in the Bay Area. Folks that can't understand this type of lifestyle generally do not have kids.

I agree with you that SF is not kid-friendly. That is not a good thing. I also understand your desire for space and convenience and that the sacrifice that comes with it is a commute. To its detriment as a growing entity unto itself, where families can put down roots, SF definitely favors singles and DINKs. I am among the latter who enjoys the City very much. If I had kids, I'd be a willing commuter.

[sav858]

Originally Posted by ssmaster

Dal paradise -Compared to other expensive western cities like London ,Paris and New York Public transportation in San Francisco sucks.
People living in Sunset ,Richmond district Lake Street are urbanites and their public transportation options are limited.
While walking is convenient for you it is not for people with infants and small children

+1

I agree, it's not that SF public transit is bad overall, especially when compared to the rest of the US, but it's just not as good as other large, urban cities. They tend to have much better intra-city rail systems; Muni Metro is pretty slow overall and act's more like a streetcar over the majority of its system than a Metro or modern light rail system. The bus system has excellent coverage but overall it's pretty slow. It can take you just as long to get to the Financial District from the Outer Sunset/Richmond districts as it can from some distant suburb using public transit.

[bmw335xi]

Originally Posted by ssmaster

Dal paradise -Compared to other expensive western cities like London ,Paris and New York Public transportation in San Francisco sucks.
People living in Sunset ,Richmond district Lake Street are urbanites and their public transportation options are limited.
While walking is convenient for you it is not for people with infants and small children

I agree with you and the others.

San Francisco's public transportation is pretty good compared to most cities in America. However, when you consider the high cost of living and compare it to other world cities, it is one of the worst. My GF is from Hong Kong and uses it to commute to school and work and she is always complaining about how inefficient it is, how the time estimates aren't predictable etc, which weren't issues in Hong Kong. I have friends from Seoul, Tokyo, London as well who say the same thing.

My issue with public transportation here vs other major cities around the world is the cleanliness. I feel like I need to take off all my clothes when I get home before sitting on my couch after riding BART or MUNI.

[dalparadise]

Originally Posted by bmw335xi

I agree with you and the others.

San Francisco's public transportation is pretty good compared to most cities in America. However, when you consider the high cost of living and compare it to other world cities, it is one of the worst. My GF is from Hong Kong and uses it to commute to school and work and she is always complaining about how inefficient it is, how the time estimates aren't predictable etc, which weren't issues in Hong Kong. I have friends from Seoul, Tokyo, London as well who say the same thing.

My issue with public transportation here vs other major cities around the world is the cleanliness. I feel like I need to take off all my clothes when I get home before sitting on my couch after riding BART or MUNI.

So again, both of those systems are well into the process of extending lines, building new and upgrading older stations and replacing 100% of their rolling stock. Both systems. Pretty huge undertaking and indicative officials a transit-forward mindset, however long it took them to get there.

As for the schedules, I personally have found the train and bus schedules to be very reliable. But, as noted, I typically utilize a very small section of the systems. My BART experience when I was living in the East Bay, was extremely reliable in terms of schedule.

[likealady]

Originally Posted by bmw335xi

My issue with public transportation here vs other major cities around the world is the cleanliness. I feel like I need to take off all my clothes when I get home before sitting on my couch after riding BART or MUNI.

And I DO take off all my clothes before doing anything after commuting via BART/MUNI. Just the other night someone had vomited all over the seats in one of the BART trains.

[phantompilot]

SF has its issues, like any city, but it also has some beauty, unique history, architecture and landscapes, and interesting places to visit or tour.

I don't like BART, its disgusting. The public transit situation in SF is a disgrace in general.
The homeless are a repulsive nuisance.
So many of the residents are left-wing, that the city's politics are highly dysfunctional and its operational ability is impaired. I find this to be objectionable primarily because it results in things like the aforementioned quality-of-life issues, and the city still runs largely on tourism. I can't find much sympathy for the residents - because they choose to live there and are the ones responsible for its sorry state.

From a nostalgic viewpoint, SF was much better until around 1980. It just kinda went downhill fairly consistently after that.

[Matadora]

Originally Posted by likealady

And I DO take off all my clothes before doing anything after commuting via BART/MUNI. Just the other night someone had vomited all over the seats in one of the BART trains.

YUCK!

Let's not forget to mention that when it's packed tight like a can of sardines the risk of an airborne spread diseases is very high. I avoid SF public transportation like the plague for all the reasons mentioned so far.

[Matadora]

Originally Posted by phantompilot

SF has its issues, like any city, but it also has some beauty, unique history, architecture and landscapes, and interesting places to visit or tour.

I don't like BART, its disgusting. The public transit situation in SF is a disgrace in general.
The homeless are a repulsive nuisance.
So many of the residents are left-wing, that the city's politics are highly dysfunctional and its operational ability is impaired. I find this to be objectionable primarily because it results in things like the aforementioned quality-of-life issues, and the city still runs largely on tourism. I can't find much sympathy for the residents - because they choose to live there and are the ones responsible for its sorry state.

From a nostalgic viewpoint, SF was much better until around 1980. It just kinda went downhill fairly consistently after that.

Excellent post and yes SF started going downhill in the 80's

[sav858]

Now that the cloth seats are gone and almost all of carpets have been replaced I don't think BART is that dirty at all any more.

[dalparadise]

Well, I agree that the Reagan era brought services down and stressed public infrastructure for cities across the country, not just in San Francisco.