Will Chevron leave the Bay Area for Houston? (Temecula, Malibu: 2013, how much)

[shooting4life]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

That's what got us into this mess. People need to think within the bounds of our natural limitations.

7 billion people racing toward 10 billion. Phbbbbt! And not hardly an active brain cell in the bunch willing to recognize you can't expand infinitely in a finite space with finite resources.

But we are far far from hitting that boundry. With modern technology (especially in food production and water purification), earth can support multiple times the population we have now.

[Ruth4Truth]

Originally Posted by shooting4life

No one has died from Fukushima and that plants was also of an older design. Modern plants are much safer.

It's not about people dying, it's about disasters happening that trash the environment and cause health issues.

Modern plants are no safer than the earthquake faults they may, or may not, be built on. You completely missed that point.

[shooting4life]

Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth

It's not about people dying, it's about disasters happening that trash the environment and cause health issues.

Modern plants are no safer than the earthquake faults they may, or may not, be built on. You completely missed that point.

You can build earthquake resistant structures. Or should we just move everyone out of california since we are on fault lines?

If we had an earthquake large enough to cause a large radiation leak in a modern nuclear power plant, we would be having much larger issues to deal with. The injuries from the radiation would be small compared to the death rate from the earthquake. More people died from stress worrying about Fukushima, than radiation from Fukushima.

No need to fear monger.

However, you keep ignoring the actual, real, deaths related to fossil fuel nation wide that happen every day in the mining, refining or pollution related. Your argument is basically driving a car is safer than flying a plane because one time a plane crashed in Russia and some people died and this other plane in Japan had an emergency landing that was scary but everyone walked away fine.

[Ruth4Truth]

Originally Posted by shooting4life

You can build earthquake resistant structures. Or should we just move everyone out of california since we are on fault lines?

If we had an earthquake large enough to cause a large radiation leak in a modern nuclear power plant, we would be having much larger issues to deal with. The injuries from the radiation would be small compared to the death rate from the earthquake. More people died from stress worrying about Fukushima, than radiation from Fukushima.

Again, it's not so much about people dying. Thyroid disease is high among Chernobyl survivors. We don't know what health issues Fukushima survivors are facing, if anything has manifested yet. We don't know what the toll will be on marine life from Fukushima, to people who feed on the marine life.

My "argument", if such it be, is simply that there are risks with any type of energy development. One has to study all the options and their ramifications, and pick the least of the evils. Aside from conservation, of course. My "argument" has nothing to do with this imaginary stance you've projected onto me. I wasn't making an argument, merely pointing out some realities. You apparently overlooked my pointing out an inconvenient truth relating to solar energy development.

[bigdumbgod]

Germany getting it right:

Phys.Org Mobile: After nuclear phase-out, Germany debates scrapping coal

So often ahead of us in evolution (we have legions who don't even believe in that or science) and engineering. Supermegaultrapower doesn't always know best.

[Ruth4Truth]

Originally Posted by bigdumbgod

Germany getting it right:

Phys.Org Mobile: After nuclear phase-out, Germany debates scrapping coal

So often ahead of us in evolution (we have legions who don't even believe in that or science) and engineering. Supermegaultrapower doesn't always know best.

Fabulous! And yes, they're way ahead of us.

[roadwarrior101]

Originally Posted by LoriBee62

I'm not losing sleep over the future fate of California business. Some may leave, others will come in. Use San Francisco as your example. The city has had so many lives, major industries coming and going, yet it's still standing. The buildings are still full of companies employing lots of people. They might be different companies than the ones that were here in the 50's, but you can't live anywhere and expect things to remain the same for 100 years without change.

Exactly. If California is so business unfriendly, then why is the Bay Area booming so much? In my experience, SF and the Valley are a better incubator for startups and fast growth companies than anywhere else in the country. Its a combination of a critical mass of talent, along with unparalleled access to capital. The higher labor costs and effective tax rates are something that the companies just deal with.

As companies become more mature, many of them will look to spread out, away from the Bay Area, in order to save on Labor costs. Many of them will stay here (at least with their HQ), since the talent availability is still key. Many will just maintain status quo here and grow elsewhere. A few will relocate entirely. Those companies get all the media attention, but the net-net is that the economy is growing more here than just about anywhere else.

One just has to go walk around SF to see all the building booms, or drive on one of the freeways to see how bad the traffic has gotten, or look at how real estate and rental prices have skyrocketed over the past several years. Contrary to popular belief, the sky is not falling in the Bay Area.

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by roadwarrior101

Exactly. Contrary to popular belief, the sky is not falling in the Bay Area.

Oh no? Then what was that just hit the cabin top on my boat!?

*opens hatch then comes back inside*

Never mind. Just seagull poop. As you were.

[shooting4life]

Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth

Fabulous! And yes, they're way ahead of us.

So if France way behind us then?
Why The French Like Nuclear Energy | Nuclear Reaction | FRONTLINE | PBS

Oh, and Germany is just going to import nuclear power across an imaginary line drawn on a picture.
Greenwashing after the Phase-Out: German 'Energy Revolution' Depends on Nuclear Imports - SPIEGEL ONLINE

[NickB1967]

Originally Posted by shooting4life

The U.S. is littered with pipelines transporting oil/gas, what is one more?

And it is a much safer way to move product than tank cars, tanker ships or especially tank trucks.

But the eco-Luddites don't want safety. They want us to freeze in the dark or bake in the blazing sun, depending upon the season.