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Old 07-04-2015, 03:46 PM
 
335 posts, read 329,650 times
Reputation: 476

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Quote:
Originally Posted by HereOnMars View Post
I thought Homeland Security kept those kinds of records but maybe they don't. California's illegals aren't all criminals but we have a few and not just localized in SF. Just last year, two officers in the Sacramento area were shot and killed by an illegal that had been deported twice before coming back. Wasn't there another incident recently in NY where the same thing happened? Previously deported only to return and raise more hell. As someone mentioned, the borders are the problem and until they are secured, this is going to continue to happen. City leaders and legislators aren't going to do anything about it because they don't live in the areas where crime occurs so they are removed from it.

The shooting at the Embarcadero was upsetting as I used to enjoy going there. And since it was a random act (at least that's what I read), I won't be going there anymore. Frankly, it's risky to partake in anything over there any more. Between beatings at the baseball games and shootings at the wharf, it seems that crime is indeed getting out of control.
What I am getting at is while there's no denying these selected crimes occurred, there is no special dispensation given to illegals. The same crimes are committed by citizens with the same legal results or non results.

If a citizen driving without a license hits your car s/he is not treated differently than if the accident was caused by an illegal without a license. And now that illegals can obtain licenses those licenses would be taken away same as happens to legals.

The point isn't to apologize or justify or approve. The point is claiming that somehow illegals are being treated with specific deference or preference because of their status is simply not true. The crimes and their resolution or nonresolution are the same regardless of legal resident status. SF is not any particular "haven" for illegal criminals.

 
Old 07-04-2015, 03:53 PM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
42,850 posts, read 26,259,081 times
Reputation: 34057
Quote:
Originally Posted by HereOnMars View Post
SF is a sanctuary city and an ordinance saying so. You can find it here.

City and County of San Francisco : Sanctuary Ordinance

Details of said ordinance are here

City and County of San Francisco : San Francisco Administrative Code Chapter 12H: Immigration Status

oops..did you forget to read THIS part?

SEC. 12H.2-1. CHAPTER PROVISIONS INAPPLICABLE TO PERSONS CONVICTED OF CERTAIN CRIMES.
Nothing in this Chapter shall prohibit, or be construed as prohibiting, a law enforcement officer from identifying and reporting any person pursuant to State or federal law or regulation who is in custody after being booked for the alleged commission of a felony and is suspected of violating the civil provisions of the immigration laws. In addition, nothing in this Chapter shall preclude any City and County department, agency, commission, officer or employee from (a) reporting information to the INS regarding an individual who has been booked at any county jail facility, and who has previously been convicted of a felony committed in violation of the laws of the State of California, which is still considered a felony under State law; (b) cooperating with an INS request for information regarding an individual who has been convicted of a felony committed in violation of the laws of the State of California, which is still considered a felony under state law; or (c) reporting information as required by federal or state statute, regulation or court decision, regarding an individual who has been convicted of a felony committed in violation of the laws of the State of California, which is still considered a felony under state law. For purposes of this Section, an individual has been "convicted" of a felony when: (a) there has been a conviction by a court of competent jurisdiction; and (b) all direct appeal rights have been exhausted or waived; or (c) the appeal period has lapsed.
 
Old 07-04-2015, 03:55 PM
 
335 posts, read 329,650 times
Reputation: 476
I am not defending sanctuary city policy. I am deflating hyperbole.
 
Old 07-04-2015, 05:28 PM
 
28,115 posts, read 63,659,938 times
Reputation: 23268
If a person has been deported and returns... how can that person not be here illegally and why would any city go out of it's way and declare itself a sanctuary city?

San Francisco Expands Sanctuary to Young Illegal Alien Felons | VDARE - premier news outlet for patriotic immigration reform

San Francisco D.A.'s program trained illegal immigrants for jobs they couldn't legally hold - latimes
 
Old 07-04-2015, 05:31 PM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
42,850 posts, read 26,259,081 times
Reputation: 34057
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
If a person has been deported and returns... how can that person not be here illegally and why would any city go out of it's way and declare itself a sanctuary city?

San Francisco Expands Sanctuary to Young Illegal Alien Felons | VDARE - premier news outlet for patriotic immigration reform

San Francisco D.A.'s program trained illegal immigrants for jobs they couldn't legally hold - latimes
I don't live in SF, so clearly I don't have a dog in this fight and won't try to justify their policy. My only point in even posting on this topic was to illustrate that claims that people wanted for a felony are covered by a 'sanctuary' law is just silly
 
Old 07-04-2015, 05:36 PM
 
335 posts, read 329,650 times
Reputation: 476
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
If a person has been deported and returns... how can that person not be here illegally and why would any city go out of it's way and declare itself a sanctuary city?

San Francisco Expands Sanctuary to Young Illegal Alien Felons | VDARE - premier news outlet for patriotic immigration reform

San Francisco D.A.'s program trained illegal immigrants for jobs they couldn't legally hold - latimes
That person would be here illegally. And I don't know why cities declare themselves sanctuary cities. I'm assuming there are some interesting arguments or it wouldn't happen. But I don't study the issue, or much care. Or care at all really.

I entered this thread only because I read a wild hyperbolic comment that doesn't compute. San Francisco isn't a "haven" for illegal criminals. It doesnt treat illegal criminals with any preference over legal criminals. To whatever extent SF is weak in dealing with illegal criminals it also lacks in aggressive treatment of citizen criminals in comparative crimes. That's all.
 
Old 07-04-2015, 05:37 PM
 
335 posts, read 329,650 times
Reputation: 476
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
I don't live in SF, so clearly I don't have a dog in this fight and won't try to justify their policy. My only point in even posting on this topic was to illustrate that claims that people wanted for a felony are covered by a 'sanctuary' law is just silly
Yes.
 
Old 07-04-2015, 07:16 PM
 
24,404 posts, read 26,946,756 times
Reputation: 19972
I'm 100% against ILLEGAL immigration because of safety reasons and it's just outright unfair to people trying to legally move to the US. I have a lot of international friends who are trying to move to the US. One of them has been here over 5 years working full time and has been trying to get his wife and son approved to move here. He has spent thousands in fees etc, it's not fair when you let illegals basically skip the line for free. This is just one example. I went to college with a very bright guy from India. When we graduated he wasn't allowed to stay in the US, so we educate people then send them back to their country to compete against meanwhile we don't do anything about the uneducated people flooding into the country illegally.
 
Old 07-04-2015, 08:05 PM
 
Location: Houston
940 posts, read 1,902,144 times
Reputation: 1490
Quote:
Originally Posted by phantompilot View Post
We need a militarized border like Israel has, their border is extremely secure. It has a double fence system that is continuously controlled with shoot on sight policies and guards in towers every quarter mile or so.
We need immigration policy equivalent to the one Mexico has in the south with Guatemala, including militarization, just like they have. What's so hard about that? Why can't we do it? Because the prez doesn't inform the world of that disparity and stick it in Mexico's face. It doesn't fit the leftist world view and Geraldo wouldn't like it.

Every murder by an illegal is one that didn't have to happen, but for policy. And excuse the anti-PC stance but when I see a pretty white woman blown away like this, I can't help but wonder if her race and appearance is why she was singled out. And if there is a a racial nexus there then we have one more indication that the nation is in real trouble.

I happen to live in another sanctuary city, Houston. Here you have to speak Spanish to get a job in a car parts store, a hardware store, a nursery, a salvage yard, government clerical, and many retail positions and many teaching positions. And at the many residential construction sites around town. Explain to me why that is fair. And these jobs mostly do not pay a premium for Spanish fluency or bilingual ability. The job market is fairly twisted now especially at the unskilled and semiskilled levels.
 
Old 07-04-2015, 08:06 PM
 
335 posts, read 329,650 times
Reputation: 476
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmw335xi View Post
I'm 100% against ILLEGAL immigration because of safety reasons and it's just outright unfair to people trying to legally move to the US. I have a lot of international friends who are trying to move to the US. One of them has been here over 5 years working full time and has been trying to get his wife and son approved to move here. He has spent thousands in fees etc, it's not fair when you let illegals basically skip the line for free. This is just one example. I went to college with a very bright guy from India. When we graduated he wasn't allowed to stay in the US, so we educate people then send them back to their country to compete against meanwhile we don't do anything about the uneducated people flooding into the country illegally.
This is a puzzling set of connected dots you have drawn. The end product isn't a clear picture of anything.

Are your friends looking for field work or construction site cleanup or drywalling labor jobs? Those are the kinds of work illegals are taking not programming or engineering or law or economics or insurance adjusting, medicine, police, fire, public administration, social work, teaching ... Do you think there are slots in line for those professions that are being closed because illegals pick lettuce?
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