Most dirty city - SF?

[City Boy]

Originally Posted by krudmonk

No, you don't need to go on to prove that you're insane. So what, are there about ten "real" cities on Earth?

Yes i'm insane. An Insane person that realizes Downtown Toledo Ohio is not a place I'd call vibrant.

[krudmonk]

Originally Posted by City Boy

Yes i'm insane. An Insane person that realizes Downtown Toledo Ohio is not a place I'd call vibrant.

Wow, you're pretty much have an argument with yourself at this point.

[City Boy]

Originally Posted by krudmonk

Wow, you're pretty much have an argument with yourself at this point.

Good, the "REAL" crazy thing is you all know what I'm talking about but you try to turn a blind eye to be PC and not offend anybody. "Real" city is arbitrary but I'm not talking about real in the sense of reality or worth a damn. I'm speaking about Downtowns/financial districts, not entire cities. But you knew that and you're trying to play Mr. sarcasm. I wonder why so many people flock to downtown SF vs. Downtown Sacramento or Oakland? How about Manhattan instead of Downtown Albany or Buffalo? I'm done.

[krudmonk]

Even though none of this pertains fo SF being dirty or not...

- Where do you keep getting this "PC" theory?
- Is "PC" your new buzz word?
- Oakland and Sacramento are not analogous to Albany.
- San Francisco is not analogous to New York.
- This conversation was not about "vibrant," but "real." You said some downtowns looked like suburbs, which is completely wrong.
- How did Toledo come into this?
- Tourists don't make a place "real." In fact, they make it less so.
- Downtowns have more people than their respective suburbs. Therefore, people actually do "flock" to them. Compare downtown Oakland to Montclair.

[Alisande]

Originally Posted by Taboo2

What did you think SF was- a ride as Disney? It is a town with an incredibly huge homeless population beacuse of the temperate climate and charitable folks. There aren't enough trash cans. That would help ya know? Oakland is nasty BTW. ALWAYS NASTY.

You forgot to mention the 400.00 a month they give to the homeless which attracts them to the city in flocks. I've never seen as many aggressive beggars in my life. I'd like to see the city follow New York and run them out on a rail.

[Alisande]

Originally Posted by City Boy

The abundance of shopping, Large Crowds, Congestion and Alot of Tourism should tell you. But I see you're still trying to be PC about the situation. You're telling me downtown Sacramento is the same?

Downtown Sac has just as many homeless. They just seem to leave you alone.

[geoengr]

Originally Posted by City Boy

Are you kidding me? You must have never been to Newark New Jersey, New York , Baltimore, Hartford, etc etc. SF is one of the cleanest "big" cities in America.

I have been to Minneapolis and Denver. On my trips there, I swear I could count the pieces of garbage on 2 hands. If by clean you mean piles of garbage and homeless people eliminating on the sidewalks, I guess you are right...

There may be dirtier, but it sure ain't the cleanest.

[kraigk1]

I've traveled and have lived in many cities, and hands down, San Francisco is the dirtiest city I have ever seen in its class.

I've been here about a year, and I keep waiting for something to change my mind, but I think it comes down to these things:

- SF almost recruites homeless people with a huge stipend they give them

- SF is tolerant to a horrible fault: There is a theory that came from New York City. That theory was that your population takes cues from the little things that you let go unpunished. When NYC cracked down on the smallest crimes, the overall crime rate dropped. SF is a city that lets you desecrate just about anything without punishment. Graffiti, urinating in corners, stealing grocery carts, everything goes.

- Culture that rewards rebelliousness to a fault. Guess who's most rebellious

- And one thing I want to add. I live in Bernal Heights, and there's this huge abandoned warehouse just teeming with really shady people. Finally, Home Depot wanted to come in and clean it up. Of course, everyone whined and whined for 2 years, and Home Depot finally said screw it. It could have cleaned up the entire block and attracted more business. But because of a few whiny activist few that tied it up, we lost out.

In the end, I feel like people should really be ashamed of this city. It is so beautiful inspite of this, it's amazing if you think about what it can be. There is so much money, so much culture. It's really a shame.

There's no reason Chicago should be so much cleaner.

[kraigk1]

Originally Posted by City Boy

Actually Europe and Aus are Cleaner than the US Canada Also. Vancouver and Toronto are spotless.

Most of Vancouver is spotless, but there are a few blocks of really, really bad craziness. Tenderloin X 2. But the big difference is that their tenderloin isnt almost smack dab in the middle of everything.