Please help! My bad tenants. (San Francisco: leases, lawyers, house)

[Upstate67]

Originally Posted by sflandlord

Thanks Ruth4Truth!

Upper tenants use their parents as co singers when they moved in, I thought young college students wouldn't be bad tenants, but I was wrong.

[bmw335xi]

Originally Posted by sflandlord

I really do not know what to do that's why I am posting this here, I hope people can help out. I do not mind to pay to lawyer, but even I pay thousands of $ to lawyers, this may not get solved.

Welcome to San Francisco, that's why I sold my place instead of renting it out. I know so many people with horror stories about renting their place out. One of my friends has been fighting her tenant and he has been living there rent free for 6 months, meanwhile she is still paying lawyer fees. I'm sure there are some homeless people willing to do the deed for a couple grand. Just kidding, but seriously I feel for you. Your best hope is that the upper tenants get ran over coming home one day.

[sflandlord]

Thanks so much for your replies. I feel little comfort. I did called a co signer this morning. She is the mother of a tenants. She told me how bad my house is, how worse the other tenant is, but her daughter is the best girl in the worlds, all her daughter did were all right, but she doesn't care about what her daughter did because her daughter is adult now. I have nothing else to say, what kind of mother what kind of daughter...

Many of you saying to pay money for bad tenants to move out, I guess most tenants lawyers will say the same thing because how they make money. And that's why so many tenants believe they can make money from landlord. It's not right! renter and landlord are equal, now the law in SF make it not fair. The most law helps bad tenants immediately.

[sflandlord]

There is no kitchen downstairs, it's new built recently. If I have to pay, I will pay to the downstairs older lady to leave. I am happy to pay to her.

[sflandlord]

Originally Posted by shooting4life

Contact an eviction attorney. Cheapest and fastest would be to bribe them to move out.

Originally Posted by beb0p

Ok, here's what I could gather from the information you provided, some of which are not explicit and I had to guess.

- Your rental is a single family house with one electric meter, gas meter, water meter, etc.

- The house has a legal in-law unit in ground floor, it shares water/electricity/gas with the upper floor unit.

- Even though the in-law unit is legal, there may still be things inside that is illegal - like a kitchen. I don't know if that is the case, but it's important to know if everything about your in-law unit is 100% legal.


At any rate, the lawyers are correct - if you remove the downstairs tenant and then give the entire house to the upper level tenants, it effectively means they are renting the entire single family home (instead of just a portion of it) which makes them exempt from rent control. In this case, you can raise the rent to any level you want (say $10,000 a month) and force them to move out.

But this plan requires that you convince the old lady to move out of the unit, not something that is easy to do under normal circumstance. If you have any illegal structure in the in-law unit (like a kitchen), you have to remove it before giving it to the students because they can get you in trouble with a single complaint to the city.


Since the students have their parents as co-signers, my first action would be to contact the parents and let them know their kids are having too good of a time. Tell the parents that cops were called and to have a talk with their boys. You never know, it could help.

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Do you just happen to know if tenants have right to not take the entire house? or some lawyer said, they could, some said they couldn't. Some lawyer said there's only 50% of chance to win a case like this move out upper tenants, let them to have the whole house.

[charolastra00]

I'm confused about the set up of the house, and would seriously question if the downstairs unit was actually a legal apartment. The combined utilities is a huge red flag for me, and are illegal where I live.

Does your lease say anything about guests?

[JanND]

Originally Posted by sflandlord

Thanks Ruth4Truth!

Upper tenants use their parents as co singers when they moved in, I thought young college students wouldn't be bad tenants, but I was wrong.

Their lease ends half years ago, and the policies came 2 times at 2 a m and 3 am in last two months. Even though, is it good for nuisances?
Two bedrooms for four, but they always have guests here and they admiditted because they think it's ok to bring anyone here. When the older lady lives in the house, they all under rent control, but some layers said when the downstairs tenant move out, the upper will not under rent control, but it depends on SF rent board. However, rent board and all SF government will help tenants only...
I do not want the older lady moves out, she didn't do anything wrong.
I just do not understand that the bad people can always get aways?

Give those loud, disruptive upper tenants 30 day notice to move. If their lease is up.....I don't think you have to have any reason. But, You listed several things that seem to be against most normal leases....Police called multiple times, too many people living there and not on the lease, tormenting your other renter.

Get copies of those police reports...those might support you evicting them. Have the lady write out a letter about what they have been doing, and have her take it to a notary and sign it in front of the notary. .....or at least have her report these people to the police when they torment her.....keep copies of all reports.

She should call and report these creeps to someone that works with elderly in your area.....They might be able to file some sort of charges against these thugs. If she is a senior, she is a protected class.

IOA Services | In Home Health Care, Social Programs & Counseling for Seniors

Here is a link that explains why you can evict them....
http://www.courts.ca.gov/selfhelp-eviction.htm

[Ruth4Truth]

Originally Posted by beb0p

Ok, here's what I could gather from the information you provided, some of which are not explicit and I had to guess.

- Your rental is a single family house with one electric meter, gas meter, water meter, etc.

- The house has a legal in-law unit in ground floor, it shares water/electricity/gas with the upper floor unit.

- Even though the in-law unit is legal, there may still be things inside that is illegal - like a kitchen. I don't know if that is the case, but it's important to know if everything about your in-law unit is 100% legal.
.

Why would a kitchen be illegal in an in-law unit? Is that an SF-specific thing? Because legal in-law units in other cities include a kitchen; they are fully-equipped apartments.

Once you resolve this mess, OP, in the future: require applicants to your rental to provide letters of recommendation from prior landlords, and proof of income. Research their proof of income (call the employer to confirm they are employed. If they're retired, require a bank statement). One way to avoid some of the headache of managing a property is to hire a property manager. They will do all the verification of the documents provided, and they are well-informed of the laws, so they can do your evicting for you. They charge a small percentage of the rent monthly, and they charge extra fees to find new tenants and to do all the verification of employment. The most expensive thing is when there is turnover in the unit and they have to find a new tenant, but if you keep the rent stable, there won't be turnover.

It can be worth the expense to be able to wash your hands of these problems, and have someone else handle them.

[beb0p]

Originally Posted by sflandlord

Do you just happen to know if tenants have right to not take the entire house? or some lawyer said, they could, some said they couldn't. Some lawyer said there's only 50% of chance to win a case like this move out upper tenants, let them to have the whole house.

You can reference this news story:

Why it’s Legal for a Bernal Heights Landlord to Quadruple This Woman’s Rent

Unfortunately, nothing is guaranteed. Even if you successfully get the tenants out they can still come back to sue you (no guarantee they will win of course).

Other methods include using OMI, relative move-in, etc (provided you/your relative really will live in the unit afterwards).

Yes, the cleanest way is to buy them out. The best possible way is to catch them violating the lease agreement and kick them out legally (like chronic late rent payment, etc).

.

[beb0p]

Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth

Why would a kitchen be illegal in an in-law unit? Is that an SF-specific thing? Because legal in-law units in other cities include a kitchen; they are fully-equipped apartments.

Because a single family home can only have one kitchen (categorized as a room with a burning stove). You can have a counter with a sink and fridge in the in-law, but you can't have a stove.

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