For techies - when in Rome... (lower-class, fit in, daycare)

[NoMoreSnowForMe]

I recently volunteered at a local library's ESL conversation club. I befriended a group of young women in this club, who are highly educated women from several countries, including India, Brazil, China and Russia.

I have encountered situations where some of these women have been very critical of American customs. Sometimes, they are just simple things.

For instance, I recently was criticized by a couple of these women for the way I was eating an orange. I grew up in the SF Bay Area with neighbors who grew their own oranges. So, I am no stranger to eating oranges.

But, they thought it was crazy to bother to peel an orange rather than cut it up. I told them that I preferred to peel an orange and then eat the segments, unless the orange was too difficult to peel. That way, I could just eat the segments with my hands without the mess of juice, etc., when you eat a slice cut with a knife.

For some reason, they thought it was less civilized to peel the orange and then eat the segments, rather than eat a cut slice. To me, that was much messier.

This is just a very simple example, even though I have encountered many other situations where new immigrants have been critical of how we do things here as Americans - in our own country.

I love the immigrants I have met. But, I would just like to suggest that if you are an immigrant to America - or any other country - you might want to try to fit in instead of be critical. I know it's really hard to be far from your home country. But, if you are here, you will be much happier if you try to fit in.

As far as what I expect from this forum - I guess anyone who is having a hard time fitting in or anyone who has had an experience where someone has been unwilling to fit in - would be welcome to respond.

Again, I welcome immigrants to Silicon Valley. But, I'd like to suggest that you might be happier if you sincerely try to fit in.

[clongirl]

Hmmm. Our so called president eats pizza and KFC with a knife and fork. Some Irish friends of mine thought it was rude that some people, particularly Asian, ask guests to take their shoes off before entering their houses. They thought it was “snooty” or formal and rude.

I totally get the “when in Rome” mantra, but I was taught certain things that others may never had heard let alone taught. I used to wait tables and some people thought nothing of flossing their teeth at their table and leaving floss/toothpicks on their plates. Weird, gross, strange... and these people were Americans. When I lived in a fairly rural part of Ireland, American tourists would get pissy if the bartenders in the pubs didn’t know what a “Cosmo” or margarita was.

Being polite, however and acting humble should be the way to go whenever visiting/travelling or living in a new country. It’s all too easy to get upset ur offended nowadays over small things.

[likealady]

How someone eats an orange is a weird thing for them to be upset about. I've also had issues with my immigrant neighbors not understanding why I wouldn't want them walking in my yard to take a "shortcut" to their house. Even after mentioning privacy and how they were damaging my plants they still didn't seem to understand.

[NoMoreSnowForMe]

Originally Posted by clongirl

Being polite, however and acting humble should be the way to go whenever visiting/travelling or living in a new country.

I guess this is my point. It's easy to find a community within a new country, where you can feel superior, above the local customs compared to your customs at home. But, if you have any desire to fit in, you need to learn the customs where you are.

Part of what irritates me about this - and I'm someone who really tries hard to accept everyone - is for someone from a different country who comes to my country to improve their lives, yet, they treat me as inferior based on my supposed social class.

What's really ironic about this is that they will never be "equal" to me in this country, as a non-citizen. Yet, sometimes they behave as though they are superior to me - in my own country - because they make more money than me.

I love our immigrants. Let me make that very clear again. But, I am irritated by the immigrants who make more money than many Americans, who treat legal Americans who earn less money - as lower class citizens than them. I just find this interesting, to say the least, because as non-citizens, they will never be equal to any citizen - whether they make less money or not than them.

Being treated like I was some kind of uncouth peasant because of the way I was eating an orange, for instance, made me think about this situation.

[NoMoreSnowForMe]

Originally Posted by likealady

How someone eats an orange is a weird thing for them to be upset about. I've also had issues with my immigrant neighbors not understanding why I wouldn't want them walking in my yard to take a "shortcut" to their house. Even after mentioning privacy and how they were damaging my plants they still didn't seem to understand.

Yeah, that would really irritate me. Some things just seem so obvious. It's hard to imagine that they'd really be okay with people crossing their own property and smashing their plants. I have a hard time believing they'd really be okay with that.

Yes, it was a really weird situation regarding the oranges. I was at a casual lunch get-together, and several women from Brazil and Russia, made comments about the fact I was peeling an orange and eating the segments with my hands, while they were cutting the oranges (that I'd brought, given to me by a neighbor), and asked me, didn't I think it was harder to peel the oranges than to cut them into slices.

I said I would rather eat segments with my hands, as I found it more of a hassle to eat slices.

The attitude I got, was an attitude that it was lower-class to eat the oranges my way. It's hard to convey the attitude in writing here, but it was condescending and judgmental - which was really confusing for me, as we had all been very friendly for many months.

[RMESMH]

I'm neither a Trump supporter, nor a Republican, but.....

Originally Posted by clongirl

Hmmm. Our so called president eats pizza and KFC with a knife and fork. Some Irish friends of mine thought it was rude that some people, particularly Asian, ask guests to take their shoes off before entering their houses. They thought it was “snooty” or formal and rude.

I totally get the “when in Rome” mantra, but I was taught certain things that others may never had heard let alone taught. I used to wait tables and some people thought nothing of flossing their teeth at their table and leaving floss/toothpicks on their plates. Weird, gross, strange... and these people were Americans. When I lived in a fairly rural part of Ireland, American tourists would get pissy if the bartenders in the pubs didn’t know what a “Cosmo” or margarita was.

Being polite, however and acting humble should be the way to go whenever visiting/travelling or living in a new country. It’s all too easy to get upset ur offended nowadays over small things.

Pot meet kettle.

[WithDisp]

I wouldn't be sharing any of my oranges with that beach.

[clongirl]

Originally Posted by RMESMH

I'm neither a Trump supporter, nor a Republican, but.....



Pot meet kettle.

...and how is that? What did I express that came off as rude to you?

That DJT is not a real president, or that I suggested that people act humble when visiting or living in another country? Appears that you're just trying to start a dumb argument with me as some posters tend to do on these forums. No apologies for my post.

[twins4lynn]

Originally Posted by likealady

I've also had issues with my immigrant neighbors not understanding why I wouldn't want them walking in my yard to take a "shortcut" to their house. Even after mentioning privacy and how they were damaging my plants they still didn't seem to understand.

My mom had this problem. Her next door neighbor opened up a home daycare and all her clients would walk up my mom's driveway, cross her lawn and walk between (or over) her plants to get to the neighbors driveway. She mentioned it to her neighbor, but it didn't improve and her clients apparently didn't seem to think there was anything wrong with doing that. My mom got fed up and put up a fence between the two properties. Problem solved. The neighbor and most of her clients are immigrants (but I don't thing that has anything to do with it).

And about the orange, I think it's simply rude to comment on how people eat (as though one way is better or more proper than the other).

[tonym9428]

Some groups just don't do a good job when it comes to cultural assimilation. There's been plenty of research done on this and the groups that do worst are Indians and Chinese immigrants.
https://www.manhattan-institute.org/...rica-5858.html