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Old 04-15-2019, 08:39 AM
 
Location: San Francisco
4,837 posts, read 1,412,923 times
Reputation: 2960

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 18Montclair View Post
Spare me the bit about honest discussions. Your source is being intellectually dishonest in the first place.

1. You cant prop up the median income for ALL families as the reason that...

2. The region does not meet the required budget for 2-parent, 2-child budget requirement to be stable.

Because

3. The Median Family Income stat covers all kinds of groupings and familial combinations, many far smaller than 2 parents, 2 children.

This means it's inaccurate to apply the median family income stat specifically to 2-parent, 2-children families.

And this^ inaccuracy is what's found in your source.

4. The census bureau, does however have median family income data for married-couple families with children of their own. That figure at last count, is $154,030, for the SF Metro Area.
I don’t understand why you two continue to bicker over stats which have all been calculated - and clearly presented, leaving SF 1st in desirability and 7th place overall in Best Places to Live. It’s as if people think they can change the results.
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Old 04-15-2019, 09:10 AM
 
1,204 posts, read 596,649 times
Reputation: 1391
Quote:
Originally Posted by 18Montclair View Post
No you feel free to argue with the Census Bureau to your heart's content. Govt data trumps the 'Economic Policy Institute' which is a think tank.
ROTFLMAO!! Government data huh? That's one for the ages (definitely stand up comedy material).

For anyone that can handle an opposing viewpoint and have a rational conversation on this topic, you can easily find hundreds of hits on errors with the U.S. Census with a simple query. To think that this information is some end-all-be-all is simply a joke! And yes, as usual, you're trying to mislead.

Here's one of my favorite articles from Harvard that shows what a joke the Census can be....

https://hbr.org/2016/03/how-we-learn...-s-census-data

Scratching our heads, we saw the Census tables showed that general merchandise stores — which is where they code Wal-Mart — had only $88 million in online sales in 2013. That couldn’t be right, since Walmart.com was a multibillion-dollar operation that year.

What kind of common sense is this?

Maybe they hate Arkansas as much as the posters on this board.
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Old 04-15-2019, 09:11 AM
 
1,204 posts, read 596,649 times
Reputation: 1391
Quote:
Originally Posted by aslowdodge View Post
Do they actually? I think in 2017 California got back 99 cents for every dollar paid to the government. I think this year California actually gets back more than every dollar they send in.
Back in 2007 I think California was definitely a donor state.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeSmow View Post
That's correct Dodge.

No need to reinvent the wheel on this one. We recently had the same discussion in the Texas forum and I commented as such....



What people and the media do is try to make disingenuous claims to support their viewpoint. They either use the spin directly above ("versus other states as opposed to just the amount they receive versus pay out") or say that they give more revenue instead of talk about how much they receive. It's one of the reasons I laugh when people point to certain media sources as being so neutral or trust worthy when all they are doing is twisting information to support a certain viewpoint. Clearly the information isn't wrong, but you can certainly just make it work to support your narrative. People use statistics this way all the time.

It's really not much different than saying people in San Francisco make so much more money without pointing out that according to the Economic Policy Institute, they are the #1 most expensive metro to raise a family in the country with a basic budget of $148,439 per year for a two-parent, two-child household, and a median family income of $108,822 per year.
Roger on both of these!
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Old 04-15-2019, 09:13 AM
 
Location: San Francisco
4,837 posts, read 1,412,923 times
Reputation: 2960
Quote:
Originally Posted by JJonesIII View Post
Roger on both of these!
How does any of this change SF ranking 1st in desirability - or 7th overall?
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Old 04-15-2019, 10:44 AM
 
1,204 posts, read 596,649 times
Reputation: 1391
I should also mention that the official census is done every 10 years. The disingenuous claim that is being made is taken from the American Community SURVEY. Yeah, it's a survey.

Unlike the every-10-year census, this survey continues all year, every year. They randomly sample addresses in every state, the District of Columbia, and Puerto Rico. They randomly select about 3.5 million addresses each year to respond to the survey.

So scientific.
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Old 04-15-2019, 11:02 AM
 
Location: San Francisco
4,837 posts, read 1,412,923 times
Reputation: 2960
Quote:
Originally Posted by JJonesIII View Post
I should also mention that the official census is done every 10 years. The disingenuous claim that is being made is taken from the American Community SURVEY. Yeah, it's a survey.

Unlike the every-10-year census, this survey continues all year, every year. They randomly sample addresses in every state, the District of Columbia, and Puerto Rico. They randomly select about 3.5 million addresses each year to respond to the survey.

So scientific.
Who said anything about ‘scientific’? Haha - relax, it’s a thread about SF ranking 7th overall (and #1 in desirability) by the same criteria and statistics used to calculate (independently) every other city, including value/high COL. Do you also try to discredit the U.S News & World Report’s annual ‘Best Colleges’ list?
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Old 04-15-2019, 11:10 AM
 
Location: San Francisco
4,837 posts, read 1,412,923 times
Reputation: 2960
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeSmow View Post
Amazing someone gets it! The Census was done in 2010. I can't believe anyone waste their time with the amount of misinformation people consistently post on this board. There is nothing remotely scientific about this survey. You'd be much better off using payroll sites.
And now you should work on ‘getting’ SF ranked #1 in desirability and #7 overall in best places to live!

Btw, forums are meant for opinions based on knowledge and experiences, not for copying and pasting ‘facts’ one finds on the internet.

Last edited by CorporateCowboy; 04-15-2019 at 11:19 AM..
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Old 04-15-2019, 11:11 AM
 
Location: Formerly Pleasanton Ca, now in Marietta Ga
8,018 posts, read 5,602,345 times
Reputation: 11400
Quote:
Originally Posted by nmnita View Post
and don't forget they already lead the country in homelessness. Boy is that a great standard of living. The one positive thing I can think of about CA when we talk finances would be: get rich by selling your overpriced house to some idiot that will pay for it. Then you have enough money to pay cash for a home in a state that offers good schools, good quality of life and people enjoy low crime rates, better tax breaks and fewer illegals living off the state.
Wait for it....
“ B b b b but then they have to live somewhere else besides California. “
I’m not knocking people for choosing to live in California who can afford it and still put money aside for retirement. It’s really a nice place in some parts. But those that criticize others who move and aren’t doing all thAt great financially themselves I’m just not sure about.
All those things you listed are some of the most desired things people want and it’s not unreasonable for people to move to get them.
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Old 04-15-2019, 11:23 AM
 
Location: Piedmont, CA
34,258 posts, read 59,118,731 times
Reputation: 17667
Quote:
Originally Posted by JJonesIII View Post
I should also mention that the official census is done every 10 years. The disingenuous claim that is being made is taken from the American Community SURVEY. Yeah, it's a survey.

Unlike the every-10-year census, this survey continues all year, every year. They randomly sample addresses in every state, the District of Columbia, and Puerto Rico. They randomly select about 3.5 million addresses each year to respond to the survey.

So scientific.
This is the data used to allocate federal spending every year. The think data is toilet paper by comparison.

Next
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Old 04-15-2019, 11:26 AM
 
Location: Piedmont, CA
34,258 posts, read 59,118,731 times
Reputation: 17667
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeSmow View Post
Amazing someone gets it! The Census was done in 2010. I can't believe anyone wastes their time with the amount of misinformation people consistently post on this board. There is nothing remotely scientific about this survey. You'd be much better off using payroll sites. But we constantly hear from the same posters who couldn't have an honest conversation if their lives depended on it.
Oh please stop. LOL. You are only poisoning your own well by trying to convince us that some two bit, flimsily done, biased rag, is more accurate than the census bureau.

That sort of thing might work on Fox News, but not here.
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