San Francisco neighborhoods vs. Chicago neighborhoods (Oakland, Richmond: crime, mortgage, safe area)

[skyao]

I lived in Chicago and SF and am very dubious about people claiming certain areas of the country are more friendly than others.

One man's "west coast lifestyle" is another man's pretentiousness and one man's "Midwest Values" is another man's narrow mindedness.

Regardless, If i were moving here and I were you I would live in the mission/or inner mission where you are close to good public transit and the Peninsula in case you are working down South.

good luck.

[KilledByAnts]

Originally Posted by skyao

I lived in Chicago and SF and am very dubious about people claiming certain areas of the country are more friendly than others.

One man's "west coast lifestyle" is another man's pretentiousness and one man's "Midwest Values" is another man's narrow mindedness.

I agree. I'm not really interested in critiques of the people or lifestyles. I know that to some people Chicago is included in "flyover" country and full of rednecks, mostly to people who have never been there. I also know that a lot of people assume that California in general is nothing but nut-cases, and I know that's not true either.

[Palmer Eldritch]

San Franciscans tend to be very cold to each other on the street. Perhaps they are worried that the person next to them is dangerous. I don't know what it is. On BART they will sit on the outside seat, blocking the empty seat even on a crowded train.

[David Hammond]

Personally, I was disappointed in SF. Compared to Chicago, everything is smaller.

The Marina is 1/5 of what Lincoln Park is and offers. The Marina has one street Chestnut St. and it's like 6 blocks and that's it. Union Street is similarly much smaller than Lincoln, Halsted, Clark, Diversey, Southport, etc.

In fact, Chestnut St. is basically like one Southport stretch btw Belmont and Addison.

SOMA is smaller than the South Loop by far, many condos, but less.

Russian and Telegraph Hills are cool, but one doesn't want to walk those hills unless forced to. SF's hills are nice to look at and provide vistas to some, otherwise they are irritating and nobody says " let's walk up those 3 blocks uphill, to go to a coffee shop." Yeah maybe your first couple of weeks.

I thought the streets in SF were downright scummy, Market St. and Columbus. Ugh.

The Sunset and Richmond is like the vast Northwest side of Chicago, but with many, many more Asians.

SF doesn't have the ghetto neighborhoods like those on the South and West sides of Chicago. I mean nothing like them thankfully. You know what's it's like driving through a dangerous Chicago neighborhood? and your instincts kick in, and your hairs on the back of your neck rise? and you start looking at all the mirrors, plotting a way out from a red light? even though nothing happens? That doesn't exist in SF.

Check out Noe Valley. I'd seriously consider getting a car, basically anywhere in America, outside of Manhattan.

user376's posts on this thread made sense to me and hit home.

PS $600 a month for a 2 bd is supercheap, but you could get out of Mexico (pilesn) for not much more if you look, and to those Californians who don't know, Chicago has more Mexicans than any other city than LA. To the Hispanics, Chicago is their second city, no kidding. Pilsen is literally like being in a Mexican city, you don't even need to travel to Mexico to see what their culture is first hand (intl phone calling cards, dollar stores, etc.)

It was once White (pilsen = czech and bohemian) but today it has the requisite Benito Juarez high school and all the racist and revolutionary murals, etc. and they ironically really don't like Whites moving back to reclaim the neighborhood that Whites founded and built.

[rah]

Originally Posted by David Hammond

Personally, I was disappointed in SF. Compared to Chicago, everything is smaller.

The Marina is 1/5 of what Lincoln Park is and offers. The Marina has one street Chestnut St. and it's like 6 blocks and that's it. Union Street is similarly much smaller than Lincoln, Halsted, Clark, Diversey, Southport, etc.

In fact, Chestnut St. is basically like one Southport stretch btw Belmont and Addison.

SOMA is smaller than the South Loop by far, many condos, but less.

Russian and Telegraph Hills are cool, but one doesn't want to walk those hills unless forced to. SF's hills are nice to look at and provide vistas to some, otherwise they are irritating and nobody says " let's walk up those 3 blocks uphill, to go to a coffee shop." Yeah maybe your first couple of weeks.

I thought the streets in SF were downright scummy, Market St. and Columbus. Ugh.

The Sunset and Richmond is like the vast Northwest side of Chicago, but with many, many more Asians.

SF doesn't have the ghetto neighborhoods like those on the South and West sides of Chicago. I mean nothing like them thankfully. You know what's it's like driving through a dangerous Chicago neighborhood? and your instincts kick in, and your hairs on the back of your neck rise? and you start looking at all the mirrors, plotting a way out from a red light? even though nothing happens? That doesn't exist in SF.

Check out Noe Valley. I'd seriously consider getting a car, basically anywhere in America, outside of Manhattan.

user376's posts on this thread made sense to me and hit home.

PS $600 a month for a 2 bd is supercheap, but you could get out of Mexico (pilesn) for not much more if you look, and to those Californians who don't know, Chicago has more Mexicans than any other city than LA. To the Hispanics, Chicago is their second city, no kidding. Pilsen is literally like being in a Mexican city, you don't even need to travel to Mexico to see what their culture is first hand (intl phone calling cards, dollar stores, etc.)

It was once White (pilsen = czech and bohemian) but today it has the requisite Benito Juarez high school and all the racist and revolutionary murals, etc. and they ironically really don't like Whites moving back to reclaim the neighborhood that Whites founded and built.

Of course San Francisco will seem smaller. It has one third the population of Chicago, not to mention it's geographically much smaller. The Bay Area isn't too much smaller than the Chicago metro though. 9 million as opposed to 7 million.

As for hair raising neighborhoods...have you gone through the projects? Go through the middle of Sunnydale, Potrero Hill or Hunters Point...it's no walk in the park. Granted i can't compare to Chicago, and I've heard some pretty bad stories from some neighborhoods there.

And that stuff about the hills? I guess that's your problem. I don't mind them, and plenty other people don't mind them either. Of course they can be annoying, but they're not an actual problem to anyone I know. Just a way of life, heh. Maybe that's a product of growing up here, or living here a long time.

Also, you DON'T need a car in 90% of San Francisco. This is one of the only places in the country that can claim that. I don't have a car, and go everywhere on MUNI. You can get almost anywhere in SF by public transportation. More 24 hour service would be nice though.

[skyao]

San Franciscans tend to be very cold to each other on the street. Perhaps they are worried that the person next to them is dangerous. I don't know what it is. On BART they will sit on the outside seat, blocking the empty seat even on a crowded train.

I agree there is sometimes a passive-aggressive thing going on in SF. Sorry you experienced that.

[user376]

Originally Posted by Palmer Eldritch

San Franciscans tend to be very cold to each other on the street. Perhaps they are worried that the person next to them is dangerous. I don't know what it is. On BART they will sit on the outside seat, blocking the empty seat even on a crowded train.

Your point may or may not be valid, but your example is a poor one. That happens on every public transportation system I've rode in this country.

[Palmer Eldritch]

Originally Posted by user376

Your point may or may not be valid, but your example is a poor one. That happens on every public transportation system I've rode in this country.

Perhaps, but the people in SF tend to be more pretentious, uptight and cold toward strangers than most major US cities. If you haven't noticed that, then you haven't been around much.

[bonny56z]

Oh my gosh, in terms of crime--the very worst neighborhood of San Francisco is much safer than even Lincoln Park in Chicago, where I got mugged at gunpoint when I lived there. It is a completely different level of crime in the bay are in general, much less violent crime. If you want a general description of neighborhoods, check out sfgate.com.
I'm noticing a lot of postings where people haven't live in both. I lived in Chicago for 6 years, then moved out here for the last 8. I realize my time in Chicago is "dated", but I just visited Chicago this summer for a househunting tour to see how things have changed. The RE development has been extensive, so there is lots of inventory, but this also contributes to awful gridlock on the streets of Chicago. Also, while the SFH were about 3000 sf (about twice the size of the bay area), we realized that it's necessary to have so much space because the weather requires a very indoor lifestyle. It was unpleasantly hot & humid in July and I do remember what winters there were like! It's not like that here where I almost never wear a winter coat and only occasionally use the heater at home. It is a very different lifestyle here vs. Chicago--you should visit at different times of the year and explore the residential neighborhoods. I have to say, that even though we can get a beautiful huge home in Chicago, we think we'd rather have a tiny fixer here just for the quality of life. But it is not for everyone. There is no middle class here, and folks who make $250K+ lead a "working class" quality of life if they haven't already bought a home before the 2000-2007 bubble.
I don't like the comment about the "pretentious" folks, but unfortunately I have to agree. There are plenty of super-rich people here, as you would expect. People who inherited money or cashed out with stock options, work in private equity, whatever. But they are really the minority and they will not affect your day-to-day life. Generally on the street most folks are very friendly and laid back--this is California! As a parent of a toddler, the mom networks here are incredible and the sense of community in our neighborhoods is very strong. I did not get that feel in Chicago, although our friends with 2+ kids in Chicago say the parent networks there are great.

[sharkylittleton]

This is a great thread as I might be making the move to SF for work in June '09. For the people who have been to or lived in Chicago, is there a comparable neighborhood in SF to Wicker Park? I'm looking for a more artist based/alternative neighborhood.