IS the cost of living really that extreme?!?!

[neutrino78x]

Originally Posted by 1w0n

In SF you will typically need to show 3 times the rent in NET income

That's normal, dude. You're not supposed to spend more than 30% of your take home pay on housing.

Originally Posted by Wall Street Journal

Typically, most lenders suggest that you spend no more than 28% of your monthly income on a mortgage.

Source How Much You Should Spend on a Home - Personal Finance - WSJ.com

[neutrino78x]

Upper middle class income in Silicon Valley would be like 150k, 200k for a single person or 400k for a couple.

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by neutrino78x

It's very cosmopolitan. It has people who make minimum wage sharing bedrooms and also condos that sell for two million dollars. And it is racially diverse also. So I think that's cosmopolitan.

It's not really cosmopolitan in a broader sense. The arts scene is weak for a city of almost 1M people. And it's mostly a 1 industry town...tech...and even though there is racial diversity, the tech geek personality dominates the area. It isn't really an area of diverse professions/industries. Also, public transport, which is good in cosmopolitan cities, is lacking in SJ.

I'm not trying to knock San Jose. I live here. But lets be honest about its strengths and weaknesses, ok?

[TheCityTheBridge]

Originally Posted by mysticaltyger

It's not really cosmopolitan in a broader sense. The arts scene is weak for a city of almost 1M people. And it's mostly a 1 industry town...tech...and even though there is racial diversity, the tech geek personality dominates the area. It isn't really an area of diverse professions/industries. Also, public transport, which is good in cosmopolitan cities, is lacking in SJ.

I'm not trying to knock San Jose. I live here. But lets be honest about its strengths and weaknesses, ok?

I would not say that SJ is a tech company town. It's got a diverse economy, though tech occupies a larger proportion than most cities. Public transit is lacking, but Los Angeles has long been cosmopolitan in spite of poor transit. I think San Jose's biggest problems are a combination of sprawl and its proximity to other cities that are bigger draws for nightlife, dining, and the arts.

[xthrowawaystyle]

One of the big differences to me is that there's no area really, that allows you to be close to the city, but enjoy the benefits (and prices) of living outside it. I used to live 20 minutes outside Boston and payed 1100 for a single family apartment, a big back yard, across from the commuter rail (which I guess is like CalTrain or BART) and that included everything in the way of utilities, plus a washer/dryer. It was about 700 sq ft, and in a quiet, safe neighborhood with great schools and a farmer's market down the road. It was very small community vibe, but only 20 minutes from the city.

Now I live in Daly City for just under $2000, about 625 sq feet and while it does include utilities and a shared washer dryer, just about everything else is gone. Now, I realize that $2000 is still pretty cheap here, and including utilities and a W/D is probably a luxury. But I think that's my biggest issue with it. (should $2,000 for rent and $4.30 for gas be considered cheap?). That you can't really get away from those high prices without going really, really far outside the city.

I understand that the city itself will be expensive, and that's to be expected to a degree, but it's the fact that you can't really get away from it, even when you do live 20, 30 minutes outside the city, that gets me.

[jade408]

Originally Posted by xthrowawaystyle

One of the big differences to me is that there's no area really, that allows you to be close to the city, but enjoy the benefits (and prices) of living outside it. I used to live 20 minutes outside Boston and payed 1100 for a single family apartment, a big back yard, across from the commuter rail (which I guess is like CalTrain or BART) and that included everything in the way of utilities, plus a washer/dryer. It was about 700 sq ft, and in a quiet, safe neighborhood with great schools and a farmer's market down the road. It was very small community vibe, but only 20 minutes from the city.

Now I live in Daly City for just under $2000, about 625 sq feet and while it does include utilities and a shared washer dryer, just about everything else is gone. Now, I realize that $2000 is still pretty cheap here, and including utilities and a W/D is probably a luxury. But I think that's my biggest issue with it. (should $2,000 for rent and $4.30 for gas be considered cheap?). That you can't really get away from those high prices without going really, really far outside the city.

I understand that the city itself will be expensive, and that's to be expected to a degree, but it's the fact that you can't really get away from it, even when you do live 20, 30 minutes outside the city, that gets me.

You nailed it. Other metro areas have decent cheaper stuff close by (in commuting range). We've got at least 60 miles in any direction of stuff that still requires a far above average income to live in. Unless you are willing to sacrifice safety and live in a really dangerous neighborhood.

[sonarrat]

Originally Posted by xthrowawaystyle

One of the big differences to me is that there's no area really, that allows you to be close to the city, but enjoy the benefits (and prices) of living outside it. I used to live 20 minutes outside Boston and payed 1100 for a single family apartment, a big back yard, across from the commuter rail (which I guess is like CalTrain or BART) and that included everything in the way of utilities, plus a washer/dryer. It was about 700 sq ft, and in a quiet, safe neighborhood with great schools and a farmer's market down the road. It was very small community vibe, but only 20 minutes from the city.

Now I live in Daly City for just under $2000, about 625 sq feet and while it does include utilities and a shared washer dryer, just about everything else is gone. Now, I realize that $2000 is still pretty cheap here, and including utilities and a W/D is probably a luxury. But I think that's my biggest issue with it. (should $2,000 for rent and $4.30 for gas be considered cheap?). That you can't really get away from those high prices without going really, really far outside the city.

I understand that the city itself will be expensive, and that's to be expected to a degree, but it's the fact that you can't really get away from it, even when you do live 20, 30 minutes outside the city, that gets me.

The thing is, though, San Francisco has gotten further and further away from even the expensive peninsula and Marin County area. Your typical 1 bedroom will cost you over $3000, which is the kind of pricing I would expect in Manhattan.. and SF's job market is in no way like Manhattan's.