Please tell me the truth: Is Palo Alto a "walkable" city? Is it dog-friendly? Is it vegan-friendly? (San Jose: apartments, rent)

[318]

Hi Everybody,

I recently discovered this site, and have found it to be very useful, with helpful and kind forum members.

I am 34 and at a crossroads in my life. After ten years living in Manhattan and working in advertising & marketing, my wife and I moved to Miami for a change of pace. I grew up in Miami (my parents still live here), and my wife loved it when we would come on vacation.

I had my concerns before we moved to Miami, but we were both tired of the high stress, tall buildings, constant commotion and noise, and extremely high cost of living in Manhattan. We don't have children, but we have two small dogs that need a lot of exercise, and I feared for their lives in Manhattan. I constantly felt they would get run over by a taxi or a bicycle messenger. I was also tired of the bitter cold, especially when walking my dogs an hour a day (or more). It was painful.

Miami seemed like a very good option, with the warm weather, lower cost of living, and less stressful lifestyle. Well, we have been here one year and we are very unhappy.

We can't stand the constant driving to get *anywhere*, the rush hour traffic, the infernal summers, and the lack of culture and education among the people of Miami. We are both vegetarians (my wife is a vegan), and there are simply very few options for us. Everything here is steakhouse, Cuban food, fast food, another steakhouse. Also, we have very progressive values, and find most Miamians to be quite religious/Catholic.

I am considering going back to school for a Master's degree in Liberal Arts, (after going through a mini-crisis where I now feeling advertising is just promoting more materalism and consumerism, exactly what we don't need more of in this world!), and would love to live in Northern California. At least, I think I would. Maybe I am idealizing it.

My impression of Northern California is that the people there are educated, progressive/liberal, not as stressed out as New Yorkers, but not as unsophisticated/religous as those in Miami. And that the weather is warm, but not too hot, perhaps a bit chilly, but overall fantastic. And that there is nature all around, and that people *appreciate* nature, and don't just want to tear it down to create strip malls and housing developments.

But is this true? Or would I be setting myself up for another major disappointment?

More than anything else, is Palo Alto walkable? Of course not as much as Manhattan, but is it doable? Is it vegan-friendly? Is it relaxed? (Or is it stressful, a mini-NYC as I read somewhere).

And, crucially, how expensive is it? I know it is expensive, but is it worth it? Could we rent a three-bedroom apartment for $2000 a month? $2500 a month?

Right now in Miami we pay $2100 for a small, beautiful house, 3 bedrooms, four baths, a small pool, a huge, brand new kitchen, in a gated community in Miami. Coming for a small two-bedroom in Manhattan, I thought it would be heaven -- but we are pretty miserable! My wife hates the driving and the suburbs. We both miss the culture of New York: the ethnic restaurants, the independent movie theaters, the art galleries, etc. We feel very isolated and alienated here.

Is Palo Alto the perfect mix of the two, the culture and education and walkability of NYC, and the warm weather of the South/West Coast?

I would like to live in Palo Alto proper, be able to walk to the Stanford campus (or take the bus), and be more or less in the center of the city. Not far away. We would like to be able to take our dogs to a dog park, a regular park, and to not be scolded or kicked out of stores for bringing our dogs. We would also like health food stores (very important!), and things to do.

Space is less important. We have plenty of space in our house here and are not happy. So would rent be $2500? $3000? $3000/mo would be too much, that is for certain.

This may be the longest post in the history of this forum, thank you for reading! I really appreciate your inside information, and your help.

Sincerely,
F

[tstieber]

Palo Alto is definitely not a mini-NYC. It has the feel of a bustling college town. It is primarily suburban, but much denser than the suburbs of NY. It's a bit uppity due to the old money, but also progressive due to the university. It's absolutely beautiful. Stanford campus is a gem, with walking trails everywhere, and so many palm trees that you feel like you're on vacation all the time. The weather in Palo Alto is really among the best in the Bay Area -- about 80 in the summer, with pleasantly cool nights, and high 50s in winter, and virtually never a frost.

You could walk everywhere if you lived near downtown, but it's quite expensive. Start looking at Craigslist! Not sure of vegan-friendliness, but I'm sure the plethora of Whole Foods in the area (including downtown) helps. There must be half a dozen Whole Foods markets in the vicinity, not to mention farmers' markets.

Truly, one of my favorite cities anywhere!

[Snort]

Yes. You would like Palo Alto .....
....
..
a lot!

[humboldtrat]

Originally Posted by Snort

Yes. You would like Palo Alto .....
....
..
a lot!

Palo Alto has everything you are looking for although an expensive place to live. In Palo Alto, the people don't try to keep up with the Jones', they call and raise the Jones'. It's the perfect yuppie ghetto.

[318]

Thanks guys for reading my long post and for taking the time to reply. It seems that I have identified a place where I would love to live, and the only issue would be the cost of housing/rent, if I wanted to live near downtown. Am I right in assuming that because it is a college town, aside from rent, a lot of other goods/services are relatively affordable? Like good inexpensive restaurants (already researching Loving Hut; looks great), and other random services like haircuts, drycleaning, a dogwalker, manicures -- not for me, for my wife! : )

Thanks again!

[rarer]

Do not confuse Palo Alto with East Palo Alto ! Make sure of that. Palo Alto is cool if you have money. suburban Stay as close to El Camino or Stanford as you can. you will not find a 3 bedroom for $2500.
Be aware that East Palo Alto is very unsafe. East Palo Alto was the murder capital a few years ago. Palo Alto and Stanford is very expensive. We have not protected our borders so be aware.

[rarer]

Originally Posted by rarer

Do not confuse Palo Alto with East Palo Alto ! Make sure of that. Palo Alto is cool if you have money. suburban Stay as close to El Camino or Stanford as you can. you will not find a 3 bedroom for $2500.
Be aware that East Palo Alto is very unsafe. East Palo Alto was the murder capital a few years ago. Palo Alto and Stanford is very expensive. We have not protected our borders so be aware.

[hsw]

PA indeed has some of world's best weather and QOL balance of a leafy urban suburb nr major offices and perhaps world's leading university, esp its engineering school

Much better food/esp fresh produce (at grocery stores) than found in Manhattan, let alone FL (which is awfully similar to OH or MI or HI in nasty local food/fresh produce)

But need to realize PA and neighboring suburbs compete w/Manhattan's UES for world's greatest concentration of wealth and IQ, as many of SiliconValley's wealthiest founders and engineers (as well as Stanford engineering faculty) live in PaloAlto (and Woodside/Atherton)

Rents are ~40% cheaper than Manhattan but no college town in world has as much lucrative industry HQ'd nearby, with so many young centimillionaires/billionaires residing in the modest-appearing "college town", alongside poor Stanford grad students and profs...after all, the google co-founders were among these poor grad students ~12yrs ago...a unique place indeed

[318]

Thanks everybody! I am going to start checking out rents in PA on craigslist. I guess I should googlemap them and avoid East PA!

[zitsky]

Hi, I lived in Mountain View (next to Palo Alto) for about 10 years. I'm very familiar with the area.

I don't mean to be a naysayer but I want to give you another opinion. The answer to all your questions is yes. I do have to ask, what made you decide on Palo Alto? Have you been accepted into a masters program at Stanford? Do you plan to apply? What does someone do with a Masters of Liberal Arts? I'm not against a Masters degree, having just done one myself. I'm just curious.

Palo Alto is a nice city, but very expensive. No one considers it a college town, per se. Yes, it's next to Stanford, but it is much more expensive than a typical college town. Palo Alto is one of the most expensive cities in the area. I don't think anyone would consider services to be cheap. Sure you may find some inexpensive places, but you can expect the cost of living to be not that much less than Manhattan. Rents are expensive all over Palo Alto, as you'll see when you start looking for apartments.

There is a large wildlife preserve/park out by the San Francisco Bay that allows dogs on leash. There might also be other dog parks but I'm not sure. You would certainly have no problem walking the dogs year round. It is a very walkable city. Getting to Stanford would require you to ride a bike or drive, depending on what part of town you were in. The campus is quite large.

Depending on what you want to do though, you can find yourself driving a lot, to go up to San Francisco or to Berkeley. Traffic in the Bay Area is considered bad, but that depends on what time of day you drive. There are enough services within 10-15 minutes that you could possibly spend all your time in Palo Alto. While I lived in the area, I only went up to San Francisco once a month. The whole area from San Francisco to San Jose has turned into one big metropolis, but each city has the feel of a small town.

As for culture, it's true that the area is liberal, but it's also very competitive and very focused on money. Some people are really turned off by that. It's especially bad in Palo Alto. You'll find that many people work in the technology industry, either as venture capital investors, or at some startup company somewhere. There are plenty of people outside of that scene, but the startup/tech/VC culture is very prominent.

I would really like to hear more about why you decided on Palo Alto...