Tech Industry Rushes to Grab New H1-B Worker Visas (San Jose: lease, lawyer)

[dogandcat]

Originally Posted by Perma Bear

Yes it does, it'll make hiring citizens a better deal.

The real problem is not how to pay less to your workers, but where to find enough qualified workers. $50,000 for a business company making software is just nothing, too small amount of money compare to how much value experienced software engineer can bring to the company... So, the real problem is that there are not enough qualified workers in the US to satisfy the market requirements.

[Perma Bear]

Originally Posted by dogandcat

The real problem is not how to pay less to your workers, but where to find enough qualified workers. $50,000 for a business company making software is just nothing, too small amount of money compare to how much value experienced software engineer can bring to the company... So, the real problem is that there are not enough qualified workers in the US to satisfy the market requirements.

They could easily train people, programming is no more difficult than learning a language.

[abqcd]

Originally Posted by Perma Bear

They could easily train people, programming is no more difficult than learning a language.

Programmers have a hugely inflated self-view of the difficulty of their field. There is a difference between programmers and real computer scientists. 99% of developers are just glue-code API wizards that build UIs and pipe data from library to library.

Yeah, seriously. If money is no object, why do companies refuse to hire employees that need even 4 weeks of ramp up time? Instead, they insist that you have 5 years of experience programming some particular API in a particular language.

Of course it's about costs. There is no shortage of qualified talent at the right price. But given the cost of living in SV now, a mid-career engineer needs about $250K/yr just to live a lifestyle that is considered middle class in the rest of the US.

[aramax666]

H1Bs are hard working , educated, and smart. And here to stay.

( Household income by ethnic minority):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...usehold_income


250/yr is a very inflated. That number is about right IF that engineer is in a single income setting and has a family to support. And even in that setting, one can buy a house, and save tremendous quantities of money on that income, WHILE, living an excellent quality of life.



On one hand, I sympathize with the protectionist attitudes towards native born workers. On the other, I don't think that many americans can really compete academically with Indian/Chinese people. And some industries more or less will hire from that pool.

There is , for better or worse, an intense focus on academic excellence in these societies, honed , pressured , coerced at an early age. On top of that, there are 100s of millions of these people.

The children of the now "settled immigrants" are moving to the world of finance, and other lucrative fields.

The Indian minority in America is the richest minority. They also have the lowest crime rate. Hard-working, and with a solid ethical basis.

Whats not to like?

[dogandcat]

Originally Posted by Perma Bear

They could easily train people, programming is no more difficult than learning a language.

10 years of experience is not possible to "train" for several months. Programming (monkey code) and engineering/architecture is to different things. Monkey code is usually outsourced (India, Romania, Russia etc), but not real needs. The US do not have enough engineers, and this is the reality of 21th century.

[SageCats]

It's not about talent. It's about saving money. Also, some jobs are being shipped overseas, altogether. Our division just hired someone in our office in India to replace someone who recently retired here in the US. I'm guessing that the guy in India must be making 1/10th of what the retiree made.

[SageCats]

Originally Posted by aramax666

H1Bs are hard working , educated, and smart. And here to stay.

( Household income by ethnic minority):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...usehold_income


250/yr is a very inflated. That number is about right IF that engineer is in a single income setting and has a family to support. And even in that setting, one can buy a house, and save tremendous quantities of money on that income, WHILE, living an excellent quality of life.



On one hand, I sympathize with the protectionist attitudes towards native born workers. On the other, I don't think that many americans can really compete academically with Indian/Chinese people. And some industries more or less will hire from that pool.

There is , for better or worse, an intense focus on academic excellence in these societies, honed , pressured , coerced at an early age. On top of that, there are 100s of millions of these people.

The children of the now "settled immigrants" are moving to the world of finance, and other lucrative fields.

The Indian minority in America is the richest minority. They also have the lowest crime rate. Hard-working, and with a solid ethical basis.

Whats not to like?

Yeah, I agree with you here. They are very smart and talented and contribute a lot to our society in very positive ways.

[Heidi60]

If anyone opens their eyes to look at what has happened in the Silicon Valley you can see how the anti-American anything they bring here is not enhancing American culture. Working with them usually means having to go around their lack of teamwork and their culture bias as well as reworking their projects (the obma care roll out is a great example of that) The upside is that some do leave. obama has a quicky few month training program to get his friends into high tech companies but that does not represent the American who have worked and earned their right to work in good paying jobs. With colleges and universities having a foreign bias to get more government funds, the talented and hard working Americans are having a harder time being admitted. Follow the food chain to get to the truth. Americans have long been world leaders in all the sciences so why would be dependent on anyone else to do our jobs?

[aramax666]

Are you for real?

Yes, inter cultural work experience is always challenging. If you think you are working with uncooperative immigrants/ colleagues. The question you should ask yourself is

"How come I am not working with the bright and energetic immigrants making waves elsewhere in the bay area ?" Am I in the right kind of organization?"


America has always had a healthy and massive contribution to the science from foreign born immigrants. What you mean, perhaps, is that those immigrants were white.

I assure you there are plenty of great companies hiring exceptional immigrants from all over the world.
America will continue to be a great nation for that reason.

Here is a thought. If you think Stanford is selective, you should try getting into some elite chinese/Indian engineering programs. The selection process is so gruelling, that the selection criterion assures a great stream of engineers, some of them come to the US to make it their home.

What a great country this is, to allow us such good opportunities. And I personally will always be indebted to this great country.

Originally Posted by Heidi60

If anyone opens their eyes to look at what has happened in the Silicon Valley you can see how the anti-American anything they bring here is not enhancing American culture. Working with them usually means having to go around their lack of teamwork and their culture bias as well as reworking their projects (the obma care roll out is a great example of that) The upside is that some do leave. obama has a quicky few month training program to get his friends into high tech companies but that does not represent the American who have worked and earned their right to work in good paying jobs. With colleges and universities having a foreign bias to get more government funds, the talented and hard working Americans are having a harder time being admitted. Follow the food chain to get to the truth. Americans have long been world leaders in all the sciences so why would be dependent on anyone else to do our jobs?

[neutrino78x]

Stanford is EASILY on par with IIT in India. IIT graduates more engineers because it is a multi-campus system and the population of India is much higher. There is no great shortage of engineers in the USA, but the population of India and China is much higher, so they can have the same percentage of people joining the engineering profession and the result is a much greater number of people. 10% of 1 billion is higher than 10% of 300 million.

I welcome Indians to the USA and I think Indian women are hot. I'm not sure H1-B is the right way to do it, however. It is not right for companies to have any kind of cost advantage in hiring foreign workers. If they hire them it should be at exactly the same salary.