Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
This right here is why it rarely pays to try to argue about politics. Facts hardly every make a difference. I've tried it many a time, and if Conservatives want to blame the Dem's, they'll come up with as many excuses as it takes to throw out all those silly facts people keep throwing at them. Fun times.
There is some NPR show (Intelligence Squared: U.S.?) that takes a consequential subject, and then two experts debate for an hour. Live audience opinions are collected at the beginning of the show and at the end, and it's astounding how often opinions are changed.
And I've always been fond of the Scripps Howard newspaper motto (presented under a lighthouse with a projected beam of light): "Give light and the people will find their own way."
So I'm not taking the time to present these arguments about man-made environmental change in order to convince the likes of Beaches. Disseminating information about man-made climate change, the actors, and the consequences is especially vital as the topic is extremely poorly covered by our news media and rarely debated in our political contests (what about in Florida, is man-made climate change a well argued topic in political debates?). It's almost as if nobody cared, or wanted to know the truth, about the ongoing inundation of Florida and other coastal areas around the world. How many Americans have ever heard of ocean acidification, even though its consequences may be as severe as global warming in terms of destroying human food sources.
Candidate Trump until very late in his campaign proposed abolishing the federal EPA, then later just gutting it, and I don't remember Hillary Clinton ever raising this issue in the Presidential debates.
Siesta Key is no different than any other beach in the area.
Red tide did not go away. The impact that most people notice is the smell. Wind can dictate what people smell. Winds from the east and things are not that bad. Winds from the west and things smell bad. People think that red tide is gone after a few days of east wind. Not so.
For the last 5 months, there has been an area from about fort meyers to sarasota where the red tide has been really bad. It is still there today and has not gone away.
From shore to about 12 miles offshore there have been billions of dead fish and other massive causalities.
If you look at the water, there is no life to be seen.
There are no shorebirds. There are no pelicans. There are no cormorants. There are no dolphins. There are no snowy egrets. This has been this way for the last 3-4 months through today. There are no crows flying around garbage cans. Nobody is shore fishing and nobody is swimming.
Boat traffic is minimal. Very few people boat inshore and just a few offshore that can get out 20+ miles out. There are no jet skis. No parasailing. Usually very few boats can be seen on the water.
The public boat ramps are empty. You don't see parked trucks with empty trailers. A few large ones from the offshore guys but that is it.
I see the beach every day. I live near the beach. The parking lots at the beaches are empty except for a handful of cars. By handful I mean 3-5.
The intercoastal waterway looks like black coffee over this period and void of live marine life.
This is certainly the last place in Florida that I would want to vacation at.
Florida and its businesses can use your dollars. Maybe you should think about the east coast if you want to get away. It is a beautiful coast with nice water and as you stay away from Stuart and anywhere else the St Lucie River discharges Lake O water, you'll be fine. You can eat at waterfront restaurants, walk the beach, go in the water and have a good time. The Keys is also in good shape now and can use your money.
Sorry to interrupt the political back and forth about red tide but just wanted to give an update. We decided to come down here this week after talking with some other folks that live here and I have to say that it is beautiful. There is virtually no sign of red tide where we are staying. A little hot for my taste but the beach is clean, the water is clear, there is no smell unless you get out into the water about 20 feet or so, and no respiratory issues. Plenty of birds and other sea life that we have seen. Plenty of people walking the beach every day. And the best part is that it is not crowded because so many people have been scared away.
I am sure that there are still issues in many parts of the Gulf but for right now, Siesta is beautiful and I am so glad we came. I can only hope that it continues to get better for the rest of the shoreline on the Gulf.
Sorry to interrupt the political back and forth about red tide but just wanted to give an update. We decided to come down here this week after talking with some other folks that live here and I have to say that it is beautiful. There is virtually no sign of red tide where we are staying. A little hot for my taste but the beach is clean, the water is clear, there is no smell unless you get out into the water about 20 feet or so, and no respiratory issues. Plenty of birds and other sea life that we have seen. Plenty of people walking the beach every day. And the best part is that it is not crowded because so many people have been scared away.
I am sure that there are still issues in many parts of the Gulf but for right now, Siesta is beautiful and I am so glad we came. I can only hope that it continues to get better for the rest of the shoreline on the Gulf.
Good to hear a semi-positive report!
It's an interesting sign when we somewhat accept that all is well unless you go 20 feet into the paradise....of the water, but still. If you can be there...that's good.
This is especially important because the wind is showing as being onshore.
On the other hand, the water is still very very warm, which IMHO (guesswork) is not as good as having it cool off. A couple nice tropical storms coming through might help mix it all up.
You are correct - the area has amazing natural beauty. That's the reason, I think, why so many of us seem passionate about it...whether we live there or not.
We didn't have a place there until a few years back...we'd come down for a week or ten days and stay on Bradenton Beach. We did rent a house twice - for a month each time.
We loved it and still do.
My spiel for people who say Florida is not pretty.....is that Florida is "water world" and unless you get into understanding and appreciating the life which surrounds and relies on the water (both fresh and salt), you haven't really "been to" Florida. This is one reason why all the dead sea life is especially troubling.
We took a 1 hour walk on Siesta Key Beach today. No stench, no trouble breathing or any physical symptoms. Very few dead fish, and those was aw were from long ago that the machinery failed to get. The water is still tea colored, but people were in the water. Lot's of birds North of where all the people go. Hopefully, it will continue to improve and the wter will turn Blue again soon.
Sorry to interrupt the political back and forth about red tide but just wanted to give an update. We decided to come down here this week after talking with some other folks that live here and I have to say that it is beautiful. There is virtually no sign of red tide where we are staying. A little hot for my taste but the beach is clean, the water is clear, there is no smell unless you get out into the water about 20 feet or so, and no respiratory issues. Plenty of birds and other sea life that we have seen. Plenty of people walking the beach every day. And the best part is that it is not crowded because so many people have been scared away.
I am sure that there are still issues in many parts of the Gulf but for right now, Siesta is beautiful and I am so glad we came. I can only hope that it continues to get better for the rest of the shoreline on the Gulf.
I don't think I would care to be in water, where 20 feet out, there was odor. Very likely when the wind changes direction things won't be quite as beautiful. There is no invisible door that keeps the bacteria and toxins away from you. You might want to monitor the beach you swim in on the Mote Aquarium web site Glad you enjoyed yourself though.
When you click the red flags on their map for beach information - things are reported to be pretty good at the area beaches. It looks like it is saying Siesta Beach water is clear, no respiratory problems and no dead fish. Venice beach is not quite as good with a few dead fish and water not clear. But overall doesn't seem too bad.
It indicates that as of Oct. 3rd our entire area on that map is still coded in red (high concentrations of red tide) or orange (medium concentrations of red tide).
Although it does say: "Over the past week in Southwest Florida, K. brevis concentrations generally decreased in areas of Manatee, Sarasota, Charlotte, Lee and Collier counties, creating patchier bloom conditions along the coast. Observations of >1,000,000 K. brevis cells per liter (“high” concentrations) occurred in Pinellas, Hillsborough, Sarasota, and Lee counties and >10 miles offshore of Hillsborough County, but at fewer sites relative to last week."
Last edited by wondermint2; 10-03-2018 at 07:24 PM..
I looked at the Mote Marine site and IMO it is giving conflicting information. On the Mote "visit beaches" web page:
Although it does say: "Over the past week in Southwest Florida, K. brevis concentrations generally decreased in areas of Manatee, Sarasota, Charlotte, Lee and Collier counties, creating patchier bloom conditions along the coast. Observations of >1,000,000 K. brevis cells per liter (“high” concentrations) occurred in Pinellas, Hillsborough, Sarasota, and Lee counties and >10 miles offshore of Hillsborough County, but at fewer sites relative to last week."
If it exists in 100X or more the threshold (which it does in many places), that's trouble. The monitoring system definitely needs work and - well, to put it bluntly, there is no economic impetus to make things vastly better.
I think what we have here is a case of my dad's favorite saying. Put the thumbscrews on someone and tighten them down 20 turns so they are in agony. Then loosen them a couple turns and they will think they are in heaven...
It's still very bad. That doesn't mean some places get a break here and there.
You have to forget about the "percentage" map because that was a recent "innovation" which I think is set up to fool people. A reduction from 100X the thresholWhd to 90X the threshold is not a true improvement. It's like saying I'm glad my car was only going 130 MPH instead of 140 when I hit that concrete pole.
The dots at least give some idea.....and, remember, any dot other than gray (nothing or <10K) means some people will experience problems. That's not good.
When this thing breaks up for good we'll know it. Fishing charters will know it and independent boaters and other orgs that aren't state related....will know it better. The ski team and the sailing squadron won't be cancelling events nor discussing the dangers.....
We took a 1 hour walk on Siesta Key Beach today. No stench, no trouble breathing or any physical symptoms. Very few dead fish, and those was aw were from long ago that the machinery failed to get. The water is still tea colored, but people were in the water. Lot's of birds North of where all the people go. Hopefully, it will continue to improve and the wter will turn Blue again soon.
Just for science sake, do you have any guesses as to why Red Tide is occurring on the East Coast - right near where the Lake O water dumps in???
Coincidence?
All the maps I've seen of Red Tide "natural areas" don't even have the East Coast as a possibility. Sure, it "can" happen anywhere, but it doesn't exist on the maps from all those scientists.
For levels to be as high as 100X or more of background it takes some real chemistry....
Do you have a "best guess"? Just throw something out there....as to why you think it might be happening. Could the wind have blown excess red tide from one coast to the other and then the Lake O dead algae fed it? If it was just "coincidence" why wouldn't it have happened far north or south of there.....more pollution in general in some places (the dumping of Lake O aside).....
Me? I'd bet Red Tide Rick is on the horn to the Army Corp telling them "fellas, please stop releasing anything...until after election day".....
:-)
( I also think he will rewarded by Floridians and given a promotion because I am a realist. Most people simply don't go to the beach).
What he ^^^ said. I hope we dont wind up with a 80+ year old Senator who has been unable to improve Florida's environment in his 45 years of lifelong politicking. If Red Tide is exasperated by man made pollution, then Bill Nelson is part of that problem, and has proved for 45 years he's not part of the solution. He takes money from big Ag too, and Rick doesn't.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
This right here is why it rarely pays to try to argue about politics. Facts hardly every make a difference. I've tried it many a time, and if Conservatives want to blame the Dem's, they'll come up with as many excuses as it takes to throw out all those silly facts people keep throwing at them. Fun times.
