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It's obvious you didn't live in FL 8-10 years ago when Florida was impacted by the economic downturn.
Yes, we were here searching FLA for real estate steals during the recession, and didn't find any that made us pull the trigger 5 years earlier than planned. We had the cash to buy, and still retain our property's in GA, but there were no compelling steals in Vero Beach, Sarasota, or the Panhandle. We didn't want any condo's at any price...been there done that!
We didn't want to do the foreclosures off the courthouse steps...too risky. Short sales hadn't taken hold yet. We didn't want any fixer uppers, and that is where the deals were, but they were not steals after repair costs were added in and we knew finding good contractors here was iffy for newbies.
Granted, Miami values fell like a rock (that is the bubble the article below refers to), but no habla espanol. Money from Central & South America (Venezuelans) dissolved the Miami bubble in a hurry.
According to this article, Florida ranks the 23rd best state at surviving a recession, but what this ranking leaves out, is the constant population growth (2nd link) that brings in huge sums of cash and retirement assets (to be spent later) into the state. I think there's only been 1 year in the past 50 that Florida did not have a net population growth, and we're talking tens of thousands of wealthy retirees every year.
Some day the growth will stop, but I don't see it near term. The %'s are falling due to total # of FLA residents that are here, but the #'s of newcomers remains the envy of nearly every other state in the U.S.
If you took away the years along the axis of this chart, could you find the great recession? Nope...they just kept coming...and all their wealth.
Florida's solid. What a great place to retire. No place else we'd rather be. Don't worry...be happy!
p.s. remember that the vast majority of foreclosures craigiri cites in the Naples area were very wealthy people's 2nd and 3rd homes. Banks made stupid loans to them, so when the market fell, they could walk away w/ minimal loss. Its not like normal states where so many people became homeless, and had to move in w/ their parents.
Last edited by beach43ofus; 12-17-2018 at 06:34 AM..
As Craigiri mentioned, Florida is still heavily reliant on retirees bringing large sums of cash down from the north. I would probably argue that most economies in Florida aren't great, just not diversified enough. Housing is definitely more volatile than other places in the country. Places like Houston, Pittsburgh, hardly saw any drop in prices in the recession.
Florida is a tourist & retiree based economy, and the services that support it. Florida has a very unique economy. People keep comparing Florida to other states that are very different economically, and they keep trying to apply the same rules and metrics to Florida. It's Apples and Oranges. It tells me that they are unhappy here.
I don't want a diversified economy here because that means manufacturing, and I don't want dirty industry here. If it's manuacturing that doesn't pollute, then okay. Warehouses in the center of the state...okay. Anything in the services sector, like Insurance...okay. Distribution, IT, all fine. I don't want it to look like, or smell like, the industrialized states that so many people are fleeing..to come here...like New Jersey, New York, Ohio, Pennsylvania, & Michigan.
Florida's geography doesn't lend itself to a lot of economic diversity either. We are on a penninsula in a corner of the country that is surrounded by water. Yes, we have ports, but then the cargo must travel by rail, or truck, a long ways to its destination. We are not centrally located, and moving a lot of stuff a long ways costs big money.
I love how Florida is unique in these ways. There are plenty of other places for career strivers to achieve financial success in diversified economy's...like Atlanta, Charlotte, Nashville, Dallas...all booming places. You are free to leave at any time.
Most people move to Florida because they like it just the way it is...beautiful, and clean. US News & World Reports ranks Florida #1 on the natural environment, and all you have to do is look around to see it. (this is where the unhappy souls bring up Red Tide) The constant inflow of people prooves we have a highly desireable place here.
If you are in the minority that wants/needs something else, as in a diversified economy, you would be so much better off to leave FLA for Greener pastures, than to remain here and hope it becomes something's it's not just to fit your needs/wants.
I think a lot of the negative posts I see here on C-D about SW Florida, and/or Florida as a whole, are from people who would be so much happier if they left Florida for a more typical economic area where there are higher paying jobs in a much wider array of fields. Remaining here and feeling negative all the time will not help you reach your objectives in life.
I don't think I'm alone in feeling the way I do about SW Florida, and the rest of the State. I'm not about to apologize to anyone about my home state being just the way it is. It's not up to me/us to change, and to try make the negative naysayers happy. It's up to you/them to make the changes in your/their own lives that will help them attain success & happiness.
The stock market, housing, & debt cooling off, or heating up, is nothing new. Its been happening for as long as I've been on Earth, and will continue to happen many generations after I'm gone. Florida's well prepared to deal w/ it due to all the wealth that is here now, and that continues to flow in. If you cannot prosper here in bad times, and are afraid and unhappy, start planning today to start anew elsewhere.
For the rest of us, we couldn't be happier here in FLA and love it just the way it is. Utopia doesn't exist, and we're totally okay w/ that. Florida's the next best thing. Most of us could be anywhere we'd like to be, but we chose here. We got ours, so go get yours. Your negative posts tell me you are afraid to go for it, and are envious of those of us who have. Moderator cut: insulting remarks removed
Last edited by nancy thereader; 12-19-2018 at 12:29 PM..
Florida is a tourist & retiree based economy, and the services that support it. Florida has a very unique economy. People keep comparing Florida to other states that are very different economically, and they keep trying to apply the same rules and metrics to Florida. It's Apples and Oranges. It tells me that they are unhappy here.
I don't want a diversified economy here because that means manufacturing, and I don't want dirty industry here. If it's manuacturing that doesn't pollute, then okay. Warehouses in the center of the state...okay. Anything in the services sector, like Insurance...okay. Distribution, IT, all fine. I don't want it to look like, or smell like, the industrialized states that so many people are fleeing..to come here...like New Jersey, New York, Ohio, Pennsylvania, & Michigan.
Florida's geography doesn't lend itself to a lot of economic diversity either. We are on a penninsula in a corner of the country that is surrounded by water. Yes, we have ports, but then the cargo must travel by rail, or truck, a long ways to its destination. We are not centrally located, and moving a lot of stuff a long ways costs big money.
I love how Florida is unique in these ways. There are plenty of other places for career strivers to achieve financial success in diversified economy's...like Atlanta, Charlotte, Nashville, Dallas...all booming places. You are free to leave at any time.
Most people move to Florida because they like it just the way it is...beautiful, and clean. US News & World Reports ranks Florida #1 on the natural environment, and all you have to do is look around to see it. (this is where the unhappy souls bring up Red Tide) The constant inflow of people prooves we have a highly desireable place here.
If you are in the minority that wants/needs something else, as in a diversified economy, you would be so much better off to leave FLA for Greener pastures, than to remain here and hope it becomes something's it's not just to fit your needs/wants.
I think a lot of the negative posts I see here on C-D about SW Florida, and/or Florida as a whole, are from people who would be so much happier if they left Florida for a more typical economic area where there are higher paying jobs in a much wider array of fields. Remaining here and feeling negative all the time will not help you reach your objectives in life.
I don't think I'm alone in feeling the way I do about SW Florida, and the rest of the State. I'm not about to apologize to anyone about my home state being just the way it is. It's not up to me/us to change, and to try make the negative naysayers happy. It's up to you/them to make the changes in your/their own lives that will help them attain success & happiness.
The stock market, housing, & debt cooling off, or heating up, is nothing new. Its been happening for as long as I've been on Earth, and will continue to happen many generations after I'm gone. Florida's well prepared to deal w/ it due to all the wealth that is here now, and that continues to flow in. If you cannot prosper here in bad times, and are afraid and unhappy, start planning today to start anew elsewhere.
For the rest of us, we couldn't be happier here in FLA and love it just the way it is. Utopia doesn't exist, and we're totally okay w/ that. Florida's the next best thing. Most of us could be anywhere we'd like to be, but we chose here. We got ours, so go get yours. Your negative posts tell me you are afraid to go for it, and are envious of those of us who have. U R weak.
I agree with a lot of this. I like Florida, but it's also important not to sugarcoat the pros and cons. A lot of people move to Florida thinking it is going to be a positive career move for them. I think it is important for people to understand what they are getting into.
Florida is definitely a beautiful state with a lot of recreational opportunities (excellent park system, etc).
Having a diversified economy does not necessarily mean manufacturing. Many of the cities that you listed as booming, are doing so with mostly corporate and IT fields, not as much manufacturing. I'd argue that we can have both, and we have an ideal tax situation for new companies. It saddens me that we will end up losing companies to other states because of a lack of educated work force.
Im in my 20's and I think this is all more pronounced for people my age who are still here. Many are languishing away in low pay industries. I wish there were more opportunities for them down here.
I understand that it is good for you and that you like it, but your experience may not reflect the experience of others who live here.
It is worth talking about the pros and cons of each area while trying to be fair to the area overall. That is what this site is all about.
In all types of economic circumstances, most (not all) people move here to retire, not to enhance their careers. I moved here 3x. 1 time for College, the 2nd time to enhance my career, and the 3rd time to semi-retire. I'm an expert at moving to Florida Two of those times, I don't even recall how the economy was doing, nor did I care. I wanted to live in Florida, so I took the risk, and made it happen....3 times!
For those who move here to enhance their careers, what "should they understand they are getting into"? If the new position doesn't work out, they may need to leave the state to find a new job...is that what you mean? Or, do you mean they'll be surrounded by old married people, and not have much of a social life? Or, both? I think both of those circumstances would be obvious to just about anyone, don't you?
Nobody is stopping companies from moving here. They are not moving here because retirement State = fewer workers. It is what it is, and if that doesn't suit you, why stay here and be unhappy, unemployed, underpaid, and/or lonely? If you are caring for an elderly relative, I get that, but otherwise, jump out of the nest and learn to fly. Don't live a life filled with fear, and regret. Just go for it...failure's fertilizer for the soul. Those who fail the most, or have faced great adversity, are by far the most successful in the end.
There's opportunity in any economic environment. Don't let "stock and housing markets cooling, debt soaring, or economy starting to slide" slow you down. Life's too short.
Of course "its (misery?) more pronounced for people my age (20's) who are still here". I fully understand that, especially if you are a career striver, and/or a single person looking for love in Florida. So why stay?
I have no issue about people talking about the cons of Florida. It becomes sad when it's all they talk about post after post after post, and they do it with hate, anger, and vitriol in their words. There are quite a few of those here. It's sad because they are unwilling to change their lives for the better, and instead want to blame others, and make others as miserable as they are. They have failed, are still failing, and will continue to fail...in life. They are living a life of fear and regret. Learn from them.
I think before any High School Graduate is handed their Diploma, they should be required to watch the movie titled "Defending Your Life" with Albert Brooks and Maryl Streep. If you have not seen it, go to the Library and check it out, or buy it online.
Yeah, I mean, I think the title of this thread is pretty "Gloom and doom". But your posts seem to be a little too frilly. I was hoping for a nuanced discussion, but I think I came to the wrong place .
I love that Sarasota is a "retiree town", but I think our area would benefit, especially in lean economic times, by having a better workforce. And I agree with your statement about career strivers not wanting to be here, but I would hope that we can be an area where both can benefit.
It isn't "misery" (your word) for people in their 20's who are staying here. I love it, many others do. But I think it is important for an area to cultivate a good workforce. Many people in Sarasota/Manatee, as well as city leaders are concerned with the level of brain drain that happens from out area .
High school graduation? Are we having the same discussion? I have seen the movie, I think we all would benefit form watching it .
which came first the workforce or the employers? Since there are so many reitirees here, and people working to service their needs, there's not many people left over. I see help wanted signs all over the place.
Tampa has a workforce, but not much South of there. I lived and worked in Tampa 25 years ago, and did just fine.
Sorry to be so frilly, but the gloom and doom Florida stinks stuff is way overdone here. I was trying to brighten things up a bit.
I wasnt insinuating you were in High School, I was saying the movie could help a lot of grads be less afraid of taking risks. The school systems seem to be making wimps of the kids....just my opinion, no Harvard study's to back it up.
I don't want a diversified economy here because that means manufacturing, and I don't want dirty industry here. If it's manuacturing that doesn't pollute, then okay. Warehouses in the center of the state...okay. Anything in the services sector, like Insurance...okay. Distribution, IT, all fine. I don't want it to look like, or smell like, the industrialized states that so many people are fleeing..to come here...like New Jersey, New York, Ohio, Pennsylvania, & Michigan.....
We got ours, so go get yours. Your negative posts tell me you are afraid to go for it, and are envious of those of us who have. U R weak.
Wow, if anything, the snippets of the above post said a whole lot. The only people that should be here are the wealthy and faceless minions to accommodate their comfort needs. And we don't want good paying manufacturing jobs here that families could use to climb the economic ladder. And if you don't see things the way I do then you're a jealous weakling. REALLY?
I've see other posts of yours that talk about how great the "white hot economy" is. (It's good but nowhere near "white hot".) And now we're starting to see a cooling off period, particularly in the stock market. (I've probably lost more money this year in the stock market than you've ever earned in a given year.) And it looks like this may be the first year the stock market has lost money in the last 10 years. But that's ok. In most cases wise investors can absorb the losses.
But it's the height of arrogance to actually say you don't want good paying jobs for working families just because you might be inconvenienced and may have to drive by a factory on your way to your country club.
If you've made it then I'm happy for you. I've made it, too. But no way should we be looking down our noses at those who struggle to get by and simply want good paying jobs to support their families. We shouldn't tell people (especially those who have lived here their whole lives) that they need to "go elsewhere" to find good jobs just because a transplant doesn't want good jobs here. If they choose to move elsewhere to find good employment then more power to them. But they don't need to be told that they need to go find those jobs because a transplant doesn't want the good jobs here.
But thanks for detailing the types of jobs that YOU would approve of and where YOU think they should be located. Sounds like a good platform to use to run for office. I actually do feel sorry for you if that's your attitude.
Take your dirty high paying jobs to Detroit or Cleveland. The vast majority of Floridians dont want them here dirtying up our state. If we wanted to live around factory filth, we would have moved to those sorry places. If you want to make a lot of money here in Florida, then start a business here serving the needs or retirees and/or tourists.
If you've lived your entire life here hoping for it to become the next Silicon Valley, or Rust Belt, then your not very bright.
Face it, Florida's a retirement and tourism based economy. You can wish for it to be something else, but in the meantime you have bills to pay, so go get a job at Taco Bell, or as a janitor at the local hospital, and stop blaming the rest of the World for your losing ways.
Or, you could just leave and move to Detroit, Cleveland, Flint, or Compton. Best of luck with that.
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