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Old 09-08-2008, 10:39 PM
 
Location: Florida
2,209 posts, read 7,303,137 times
Reputation: 632

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We heard water running today despite not doing any laundry or having any faucets open at the time. Our water bill has been much higher than normal but we've also run a spinkler system at times.

Well I also noticed that our booster pump was running continuously and called the pump installer who walked me thru a few trouble shooting actions on the phone and said " you have a leak somewhere, call a leak specialist".

So we did, called someone in the yellow pages who came by and recommended a company from Lee Cnty, ( Leak Surgeon ) and they came about an hour later to test the place for leaks. It was interesting to watch. They located a leak, under the foundation, in a bad place, under the kitchen cabinets. They told me that because the house is 23 years old ( this is old apparently in this part of the world ) and thay the water quality is so poor in SW Fla that they suggest we completely re-pipe the house and bypass the copper pipes completely at a cost of roughly $8,000.00 !

8 G's. To "repipe" our house. Because of the poor quality of water and construction. I'll be banned if I disclose here exactly how I feel.

So tomorrow morning of course I'll call our insurance company although I'm told to pretty much forget any claims on this kind of thing. Then I'll call 2 other "repipe" places and see if we can get a better price, I mean Jeeez it's only 2 bathrooms. Then we'll get back to the salt mine as we now need to make up an 8K loss on this house which we have been planning on selling as soon as we buy another one.

However, I want to mention something else here. Part of the combination which makes this so scary is that the " poor water quality" is clogging up the pipes in these houses and eventually causing leaks in the pipes. Clogging the pipes? This is what our infrastructure has become? Like a third world country?

If this water is so bad that it's clogging up the plumbing in our houses resulting in leaks, well guess what? It's clogging up the "plumbing" in our bodies as well. So even if you are smart and never smoked or woke up one day and stopped like me, here's our WATER supply gunking up our bodies?

That makes me mad
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Old 09-09-2008, 05:38 AM
 
Location: Punta Gorda and Maryland
6,103 posts, read 14,254,137 times
Reputation: 1242
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTudo View Post
We heard water running today despite not doing any laundry or having any faucets open at the time. Our water bill has been much higher than normal but we've also run a spinkler system at times.

Well I also noticed that our booster pump was running continuously and called the pump installer who walked me thru a few trouble shooting actions on the phone and said " you have a leak somewhere, call a leak specialist".

So we did, called someone in the yellow pages who came by and recommended a company from Lee Cnty, ( Leak Surgeon ) and they came about an hour later to test the place for leaks. It was interesting to watch. They located a leak, under the foundation, in a bad place, under the kitchen cabinets. They told me that because the house is 23 years old ( this is old apparently in this part of the world ) and thay the water quality is so poor in SW Fla that they suggest we completely re-pipe the house and bypass the copper pipes completely at a cost of roughly $8,000.00 !

8 G's. To "repipe" our house. Because of the poor quality of water and construction. I'll be banned if I disclose here exactly how I feel.

So tomorrow morning of course I'll call our insurance company although I'm told to pretty much forget any claims on this kind of thing. Then I'll call 2 other "repipe" places and see if we can get a better price, I mean Jeeez it's only 2 bathrooms. Then we'll get back to the salt mine as we now need to make up an 8K loss on this house which we have been planning on selling as soon as we buy another one.

However, I want to mention something else here. Part of the combination which makes this so scary is that the " poor water quality" is clogging up the pipes in these houses and eventually causing leaks in the pipes. Clogging the pipes? This is what our infrastructure has become? Like a third world country?

If this water is so bad that it's clogging up the plumbing in our houses resulting in leaks, well guess what? It's clogging up the "plumbing" in our bodies as well. So even if you are smart and never smoked or woke up one day and stopped like me, here's our WATER supply gunking up our bodies?

That makes me mad

Mr. Tudos, Sorry to hear about this problem.
This is what I'd do. I wouldn't waste time on this - get to work, get it fixed. It can erode and undermine your foundation causing more dynamic problems. You can fix this as a first step, then have time to decide what to do with the rest of the plumbing work. It may be repaired from the outside of your house. However it may not, but that may be the easiest access point. I don't know - I don't know your layout.

Copper has long been a recycled product - 20 years ago there were some batches that had a higher level of impurities because it was recycled - that allowed premature pitting and early deterioration. Some minerals and elements in the water can cause issues with you're plumbing, or it could just be a settlement issue and the stress caused the solder joint to separate. I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that your whole house plumbing needs to be replaced, or that your health is at risk because you have a leak.
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Old 09-09-2008, 06:49 AM
 
34,017 posts, read 54,014,364 times
Reputation: 20974
my daughter lives in condo on Venice Beach--it was built back in the 80s I think--they had to have all the units in both buildings refitted a couple of years ago because the water quality is fairly acidic (I think) Anyway it eats into the metal pipes used at the time and I think they retrofitted with PVC--

it took almost 4 months to do both bldgs--my daughter and her husband had to move out for almost two months while they worked on theirs--someone in their condo and on the HOA board owned another condo close to this one that he let them rent fairly inexpensively since retrofitting was done in summer (which is technically low season in Venice)...they also had to move everything out of their bathroom and kitchen...

since the cost was assessed to HOA/owners, they had to pony up quite a bit of money to cover the cost--I guess people with two or more bathrooms were assessed higher charges...but theirs cost over 4K I think she said which I thought was expensive--but they had common areas like the laundry areas and the pool and outside faucets to cover as well--so it was not just their small condo they had to pay for...

Frankly your price does not sound that inflated===it is difficult work to redo a house...
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Old 09-09-2008, 09:21 AM
 
Location: Florida
4,850 posts, read 13,422,377 times
Reputation: 2255
Just for S & G's, I would get a few more opinions in re: that issue. We have stack pipes leak where I work (bldgs were built in the early 70's)....You might be getting taken as work is slow in construction....i.e. I had an A/C company come once and tell me I needed my system blown out (1,000 sq. feet of living area in my rental) @ $1K....first I went for it as I was "intimidated" made some calls & found out it wasn't necessary and even if it was, that quote was way over priced...
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Old 09-09-2008, 10:12 AM
 
Location: Venice Florida
1,380 posts, read 5,627,451 times
Reputation: 877
4 years ago I did a re-pipe on my mother-in-laws house. I'm considered "handy" so I did all the work myself. I converted to cpvc. The total cost in materials was well under $1000. That included drywall and paint to repair the couple of places I needed to gain wall access.
The house was a 3-2 with 3 outside hose bibbs. The quotes I got from local plumbers to do the job was more in line with $3k. A good plumber and helper can repipe a typical 80's vintage home in around 2-3 days (took me 5 by myself). Even at $50 an hour for both men that's $2400.
Most of the wall access is gained inside closets or cabinets so repair to the access holes is minimal. But you need to look around your house to see, again an experianced plumber will see the access issues real quick.

As Big House stated your problem is less likely the water quality and more likely the quality of copper that was used in your house, althought well water with a high sulfur content can be acidic, and unfiltered well water will have particulates that act as sand paper in side pipes.
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Old 09-09-2008, 10:29 AM
 
Location: Florida
2,209 posts, read 7,303,137 times
Reputation: 632
I'm not "jumping to conclusions" what I said is a fact. Actually the copper is affected by the poor water quality and yes it's correct to assume that drinking this water is bad for your arteries, heart, and all things vascular. Absolutely harmful. Some of those harmful effects are from the chlorine which is super bad on your vascular system.

If you live in the Pocono Mountains you are most likely receiving mountain water which requires very little treatment. Here you are essentially getting parts of the myakka river as well as sewer water which is heavily treated with chlorine and other chemicals ALL of which are bad for your health.

I received 2 more quotes today. We've gone from $8200.00 initially to $2800.00 with a company coming up from Cape Coral and I signed the papers. They'll be here at 8AM tomorrow morning.

This is apparently a real problem not only here but nationwide although it's much much worse here because of the lack of quality water and the heavy treatments they use for it. DEFINITELY if you are a heart patient which I am, you need to be aware of this and take steps to limit your exposure .

Wish I could mention names. How do you like the differences in costs? The first one has TWO FULL PAGE ads in the yellow pages. They came back this morning and said, oh no, it's $5100.00 which is still out of line.
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Old 09-09-2008, 12:14 PM
 
Location: Punta Gorda and Maryland
6,103 posts, read 14,254,137 times
Reputation: 1242
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTudo View Post
I'm not "jumping to conclusions" what I said is a fact. Actually the copper is affected by the poor water quality and yes it's correct to assume that drinking this water is bad for your arteries, heart, and all things vascular. Absolutely harmful. Some of those harmful effects are from the chlorine which is super bad on your vascular system.

If you live in the Pocono Mountains you are most likely receiving mountain water which requires very little treatment. Here you are essentially getting parts of the myakka river as well as sewer water which is heavily treated with chlorine and other chemicals ALL of which are bad for your health.

I received 2 more quotes today. We've gone from $8200.00 initially to $2800.00 with a company coming up from Cape Coral and I signed the papers. They'll be here at 8AM tomorrow morning.

This is apparently a real problem not only here but nationwide although it's much much worse here because of the lack of quality water and the heavy treatments they use for it. DEFINITELY if you are a heart patient which I am, you need to be aware of this and take steps to limit your exposure .

Wish I could mention names. How do you like the differences in costs? The first one has TWO FULL PAGE ads in the yellow pages. They came back this morning and said, oh no, it's $5100.00 which is still out of line.
It sounded in your original post that you have a pretty substantial leak ((if you can hear it and it is causing your pump to run) under the slab in your house. If it was above the slab it would be running all over the place. Under your slab or foundation it will eventually cause a wash out condition. Until you open it up you cannot tell how much of a wash out you may have. Maybe none if it hit a gravel / sandy area to drain in, or it could be / create a small sink-hole condition if it has been leaking for some time. You really can't tell until you open it up.

Sounds like you've made the decision to replace all the plumbing. As FlaBob noted you also have to include patching the drywall, painting, and things like that.
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Old 09-10-2008, 05:37 PM
 
Location: Florida
2,209 posts, read 7,303,137 times
Reputation: 632
No water since 8AM today when the work crew came. What a day. Cats are in the walk in closet and they don't like it one bit. Both the Wife and I are HUNGRY . Can't wait till this is over. Hopefully within the hour.

Lots of holes in the walls, The paint crew will be here on Friday morning to patch all that up. But hopefully we'll have water within the hour........
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Old 09-10-2008, 06:19 PM
 
Location: Punta Gorda and Maryland
6,103 posts, read 14,254,137 times
Reputation: 1242
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTudo View Post
No water since 8AM today when the work crew came. What a day. Cats are in the walk in closet and they don't like it one bit. Both the Wife and I are HUNGRY . Can't wait till this is over. Hopefully within the hour.

Lots of holes in the walls, The paint crew will be here on Friday morning to patch all that up. But hopefully we'll have water within the hour........

In the first item of the thread you stated :
"So we did, called someone in the yellow pages who came by and recommended a company from Lee Cnty, ( Leak Surgeon ) and they came about an hour later to test the place for leaks. It was interesting to watch. They located a leak, under the foundation, in a bad place, under the kitchen cabinets. They told me that because the house is 23 years old ( this is old apparently in this part of the world ) and thay the water quality is so poor in SW Fla that they suggest we completely re-pipe the house and bypass the copper pipes completely at a cost of roughly $8,000.00 !"

Did they replace the piping under the slab? Did they dig it up, and fix that, or did they just replace your piping work above grade? I'm confused. . . If they replace the piping above the slab, but your leak is under the foundation you have a problem still - but then again, you know better. . .

Anyway, i hope things are fixed for you.
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Old 09-12-2008, 10:36 AM
 
Location: Florida
2,209 posts, read 7,303,137 times
Reputation: 632
What they did was bypass the under slab piping totally by forcing a pvc "type" pipe in between the walls up thru the attic. I was also told that all new construction is like this.

The crew to fix all the holes that were cut in the walls is here right now. Got here around 8:30AM. So far so good. Quite a job.

If you are buying a house in Fla, we now think it's worth a $250.000 bill to have a leak company com and check the house for leaks. This is a big job and there is no way a typical house inspection would uncover a leak like this. Imagine buying a house, spending thousands to tile it, new carpets in bedrooms, new paint job etc etc etc then move in and find you have a leak under the slab? Regardless of the money involved, to have to endure this and watch them chop thru your newly renovated place to fix a situation like this would be terrible.

We are looking at another house and believe me this will be part of the inspection process on whatever we get serious about.
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