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Old 11-08-2012, 05:38 PM
 
639 posts, read 694,896 times
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Hi all, new poster here.

Always looked for a place like this to discuss our city, was born and raised here 22 years ago and my parents have lived here since the late 70's.

I plan on starting my own family and living here for a long time unless something else comes up.


I'm curious as to what you guys think could be done to improve transportation. I made this thread because I recently saw and read up on the potential Abercorn "Skyover" that would start at end of Truman and end near Savannah Mall.

I think it's a great idea, although I'm not really sure how it's going to turn out. Not thrilled about it being a toll road as well.


Thinking big picture, how are we going to tackle the problem of 5-10 years from now when Richmond Hill, Berwick area, Pooler,etc will all be more populated with more economic ties to Savannah and will eventually be absorbed by the city? Right now the only way to get from Richmond Hill to Savannah is 95-16 or 17 to 204.

I was looking at google earth to see if there was potentially a route to continue Truman all the way to Savannah Mall. Obviously if the Skyover gets finished that would help eliminate some of that problem. But if not, then I was looking or a possible loop or path through Vernonburg that would go all the way around to or the Veterans-204 loop. Doesn't look feasible. Looks like an environmental nightmare as well as a potential logistical nightmare convincing people to relocate or agree on having it run through.

Derenne Ave is a hot mess during rush hour. Waters Avenue not much can be done there. Montgomery Cross Rds is a really interesting road. Lots of backtraffic there to avoid Abercorn. I think it will be much better once Truman finishes.

The biggest positive coming out of Truman's completion hopefully next year, is how it will greatly effect the economy of Southside. I can easily see Savannah Mall reviving itself with much more traffic in that area and an easier way to get there. Skyover would be huge.
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Old 11-12-2012, 02:41 PM
 
Location: Savannah GA
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I saw a thread in the Columbus forum about people speeding, and it prompted me to respond that I wish we COULD speed here in Savannah. Downtown is a special case of course and should always be preserved so that people are forced to go slow and enjoy the city, but our surrounding road network remains abysmal. I-16 and I-516 are shameful and for this I place blame squarely on the Georgia DOT. They are the ones responsible for upgrading, widening and maintaining interstate miles in the state, and outside of I-95 (which exists solely to get people THROUGH Chatham County) they've done a miserable job. If you've driven in Augusta or Columbus recently, you know how much better their interstates are than ours. Even Macon is going through a MASSIVE state-funded freeway overall right now. When is Savannah's turn?

If not for the locally funded Veterans Parkway and Truman Parkway Savannah and Chatham County would be a total gridlocked mess 24:7. I guess we should be grateful for what we got. But I don't think the burden of this "Elevated Abercorn" should fall on us via taxes or tolls. It's high time the STATE invested some road dollars in this corner of Georgia everybody is so proud and fond of.
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Old 11-12-2012, 03:36 PM
 
Location: Coastal Georgia
40,287 posts, read 49,806,394 times
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Ok, so I have lived a few places, and the DeRenne/Abercorn intersection IS a hot mess, but in the big scheme of things, it's no big deal. Relatively speaking, however, I will avoid shopping on Abercorn if I must be there at certain times. If things can be improved, it would be great, but to me, in Pooler, I'll just go up to Bluffton to shop, or Broughton St. or do without shopping as recreation.
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Old 11-12-2012, 11:16 PM
 
Location: Metro Atlanta & Savannah, GA - Corpus Christi, TX
4,524 posts, read 7,724,823 times
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Wasn't there another thread created similar to this one before?

Anyway, Newsboy makes some good points about lack of interstate upgrades in the Savannah area. Never understood what was up with that except that the state is run backwards. It runs itself into the ground financially from poor decision making.
There are certain areas in this state that are getting attention where it isn't really needed (aka widening of certain state roads that carry maybe 1-2K cars a day when there are suburban areas of growing cities (Atlanta and beyond) get ignored. I-16 and 516 are among those routes ignored including I-85 from Mall of Georgia and beyond. Frustrates the crap out of me because it will only get worse and NO action has been taken and looks as if it won't for years to come.

Because these roads are getting ignored, money, time and lives are lost. Get with it GDOT!
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Old 11-13-2012, 12:36 AM
 
639 posts, read 694,896 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newsboy View Post
I saw a thread in the Columbus forum about people speeding, and it prompted me to respond that I wish we COULD speed here in Savannah. Downtown is a special case of course and should always be preserved so that people are forced to go slow and enjoy the city, but our surrounding road network remains abysmal. I-16 and I-516 are shameful and for this I place blame squarely on the Georgia DOT. They are the ones responsible for upgrading, widening and maintaining interstate miles in the state, and outside of I-95 (which exists solely to get people THROUGH Chatham County) they've done a miserable job. If you've driven in Augusta or Columbus recently, you know how much better their interstates are than ours. Even Macon is going through a MASSIVE state-funded freeway overall right now. When is Savannah's turn?

If not for the locally funded Veterans Parkway and Truman Parkway Savannah and Chatham County would be a total gridlocked mess 24:7. I guess we should be grateful for what we got. But I don't think the burden of this "Elevated Abercorn" should fall on us via taxes or tolls. It's high time the STATE invested some road dollars in this corner of Georgia everybody is so proud and fond of.

I think Truman should be widened from Montgomery to at least Victory. It would allow people to speed more and get through traffic faster. It should be 3-lanes definitely going Southbound from Victory to Montgomery. The only cluster****'s going northbound on Truman, is the exit of death aka Victory Drive exit of Truman. After years they finally changed it from 2 left turn lanes and one right turn lane to 1 left 2 right. I wish there was a way to widen it, and that part of Victory, because that is one of the most terribly clogged up parts of town. It takes so much effort to get to McAlpin Square in rush hour. It's better to just exit Anderson and go around the backside instead of turning onto Victory and trying to make the left turn where Parkers is. Something needs to be done about that area altogether. Make it three lanes or something, or have a direct lane going into the Home Depot shopping center. The reason there needs to be a third lane there, is because so many cars need to turn left where Parkers and McAlpin Square are, that it gets pushed back from the turning lane to the regular lane. Everyone's talking about how once Truman finishes on Abercorn Ext. how many cars that's going to drop on Holland and Abercorn Ext. Well it's going to be just as worse on that Victory Dr. exit with Whole Foods opening up.

The problem with I-16 is, once you past the 95 part and go past Dean Forest-516-37th St. exits, you aren't really going anywhere, unless you wanna keep going on to Bluffton-Hilton Head/17. The major renovation in Macon (which scares me everytime I drive there because the road is so narrow you're right next to the wall) is almost a necessity. But the problem I have is, I-16 is a major commute route for those of us in town. I use it whenever I need to drive to Southbridge, obviously use it whenever I need to go to the airport or Pooler. 516 is so terrible, it really doesn't deserve to be an interstate. It along with veterans so underutilized, it's pretty sad.

Last edited by TheDarkKnight; 11-13-2012 at 01:20 AM..
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Old 11-13-2012, 01:11 AM
 
639 posts, read 694,896 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WanderingImport View Post
Wasn't there another thread created similar to this one before?
No idea. I looked at the first 2 pages of threads and didn't see anything about a broader discussion of transportation. Just saw a thread on the Abercorn Flyover proposed. I'm new here, only been posting on this thread for a week. Always wanted a forum where local people could discuss this stuff. Usually the best I get is back and forth on wsav/savannahnow/wtoc news article comments section. But it gets pretty nasty with politics and one-liners.

This forum seems more civil and thought out.
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Old 11-13-2012, 01:44 AM
 
Location: Savannah GA
13,708 posts, read 18,293,931 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDarkKnight View Post
The problem with I-16 is, once you past the 95 part and go past Dean Forest-516-37th St. exits, you aren't really going anywhere, unless you wanna keep going on to Bluffton-Hilton Head/17. The major renovation in Macon (which scares me everytime I drive there because the road is so narrow you're right next to the wall) is almost a necessity. But the problem I have is, I-16 is a major commute route for those of us in town. I use it whenever I need to drive to Southbridge, obviously use it whenever I need to go to the airport or Pooler. 516 is so terrible, it really doesn't deserve to be an interstate. It along with veterans so underutilized, it's pretty sad.
First of all, I disagree that 516 is underutilized. It handles a TON of commuter traffic -- it's the very reason why DeRenne is such a mess, remember? Veterans Parkway could handle more traffic, and indeed I've seen it very crowded during rush hour, but the problem is ... What are you going to do at the terminus with Abercorn Expressway? You can go left or right, and either direction -- whether toward Southside or Georgetown -- is gridlock 12 hours a day.

The biggest problem on ALL of the Savannah freeways is 1) condition of the pavement and 2) the approach / exit ramps. Both the 16 / 95 and 16 / 516 interchanges are the old-fashioned cloverleafs that require drivers to give / take gaps ... and the length of space to do so is dangerous. In fixing this, both 16 and 516 need to be widened to 6 lanes (3 in both direction) at a minimum with a concrete barrier down the middle. If you notice, there's already PLENTY of right of way to do this -- it wouldn't require anything close to the engineering feat their doing in Macon.

Why 16 is 6 lanes only from downtown to 516 puzzles me. The outbound RIGHT lane on 16 becomes the on ramp to 516 north at the SAME place where the ON ramp from southbound 516 merges onto 16 west -- forcing ALL the through traffic into essentially ONE LANE and causing ridiculous jams during afternoon rush hour. It is a classic example of poor highway planning that went into the design of all the interstates before we knew better.

Anybody who has ever sat on I-16 westbound in the afternoon knows SAVANNAH NEEDS WIDER EXPRESSWAYS! If the metro area is to continue to grow, and West Chatham boom like local leaders want, this must happen.

ONE FINAL NOTE: if you want to see what Savannah freeways could and SHOULD look like, drive down Louisville Road and take the I-16 on ramp from there sometime. That whole segment was redone when the rebuilt the Talmadge Bridge 20-plus years ago and sad to say remains the ONLY freeway section anywhere in Savannah that reminds me of Atlanta.
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Old 11-13-2012, 02:08 AM
 
639 posts, read 694,896 times
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Here's what I'm referring to.

I read that they're going to build a 4 way stoplight at Dixie Ave. That's going to be horrible.

Looks like Truman and Whole Foods are both slated to be done and open by end of 2013. That's going to be huge and terrible IMO. My solution would be to build an access ramp (blue) to McAlpin from the Truman entrance on Victory. This would allow those that exit Victory trying to get to McAlpin/Parkers, to avoid having to go to the turn left lane (yellow) which gets so full that it pushes back the traffic on the regular lanes heading east.

There's enough space to push the corner back into the shopping center and build a third lane all the way down to Skidaway if needed. Good Year is closed and so is the bowling alley. There's enough space there to build a third lane.

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Old 11-13-2012, 02:20 AM
 
639 posts, read 694,896 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newsboy View Post
First of all, I disagree that 516 is underutilized. It handles a TON of commuter traffic -- it's the very reason why DeRenne is such a mess, remember? Veterans Parkway could handle more traffic, and indeed I've seen it very crowded during rush hour, but the problem is ... What are you going to do at the terminus with Abercorn Expressway? You can go left or right, and either direction -- whether toward Southside or Georgetown -- is gridlock 12 hours a day.

Well IMO 516 is underutilized past the Veterans Pkwy entrance (the Amtrak exit, the 17 exit, all the way down to Garden City). Then again, I hardly drive to Garden City. If I do, I can take Bay, Dean Forest/Chatham Parkway, or hop on 516 right off 16.

The biggest problem on ALL of the Savannah freeways is 1) condition of the pavement and 2) the approach / exit ramps. Both the 16 / 95 and 16 / 516 interchanges are the old-fashioned cloverleafs that require drivers to give / take gaps ... and the length of space to do so is dangerous. In fixing this, both 16 and 516 need to be widened to 6 lanes (3 in both direction) at a minimum with a concrete barrier down the middle. If you notice, there's already PLENTY of right of way to do this -- it wouldn't require anything close to the engineering feat their doing in Macon.

I agree. Getting off 95 to get onto 16 coming from Pooler is so dangerous and terrible. At the speed you're going, and the speed incoming onto 95 from 16, it's really bad. I pretty much agree with you on the pavement thing. The roads are terrible and not that pleasant to drive on.

Why 16 is 6 lanes only from downtown to 516 puzzles me. The outbound RIGHT lane on 16 becomes the on ramp to 516 north at the SAME place where the ON ramp from southbound 516 merges onto 16 west -- forcing ALL the through traffic into essentially ONE LANE and causing ridiculous jams during afternoon rush hour. It is a classic example of poor highway planning that went into the design of all the interstates before we knew better.

Anybody who has ever sat on I-16 westbound in the afternoon knows SAVANNAH NEEDS WIDER EXPRESSWAYS! If the metro area is to continue to grow, and West Chatham boom like local leaders want, this must happen.
We can all agree on this. Not only are the roads terrible but it definitely needs widening.

ONE FINAL NOTE: if you want to see what Savannah freeways could and SHOULD look like, drive down Louisville Road and take the I-16 on ramp from there sometime. That whole segment was redone when the rebuilt the Talmadge Bridge 20-plus years ago and sad to say remains the ONLY freeway section anywhere in Savannah that reminds me of Atlanta.

[b]I'm looking on google earth/maps. Which part are you referring to that you say reminds you of Atlanta?Looking at Louisville Rd now. Are you talking about going under the bridge to get on the entrance?

In quotatiions
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Old 11-13-2012, 08:11 PM
 
639 posts, read 694,896 times
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I'm interested to see what's going to happen to Eisenhower and Waters intersection when the new Truman opens up. Will traffic lessen or stay roughly the same. Montgomery will benefit the most (easing up on traffic) from the new Truman completion, as that's the exit people take to get to Armstrong/Windsor/Savannah Mall/Middleground.

That intersection is crazy busy in the daytime, and trying to turn onto Eisenhower from the Capones/Eisenhower Cinemas side is almost suicide at that time of day.
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