GDOT finally rebuilding I-16/I-95 interchange and widening I-16 (Savannah: neighborhood, design)

[TheDarkKnight]

I've given up on the idea the backwards state of Georgia assembly would ever bring viable public transportation here. MARTA could be so much better but they refuse to expand and improve.

More lanes is just going to be a bigger nightmare. It's overdue but the elephant in the room is if savannah is to expand and grow smartly it needs to involve something like light rail.

I've used the Subway system in NYC, DC Metro, BART, MARTA, and Charlie System in Boston. I was very impressed with the Charlie and DC reaching out to the suburbs. That's something we should model. Downtown being the hub aND going out to Pooler, Port Wentworth, and even one day Statesboro. In a pipe dream, South Carolina would cowboy up and create a combined rail system with Bluffton and Savannah. Would be great for the area. But again, pipe dream.

[luke2401]

This whole project reminds me of the I-20/I-520 reconstruction and Widening on both highways that happened 7 years ago in Augusta

[Carolina Knight]

Originally Posted by WanderingImport

Traffic counts don't yet justify it. Maybe in another 50 years. Ha.

Whose traffic counts?

[SavannahLife]

Originally Posted by TheDarkKnight

I've given up on the idea the backwards state of Georgia assembly would ever bring viable public transportation here. MARTA could be so much better but they refuse to expand and improve.

More lanes is just going to be a bigger nightmare. It's overdue but the elephant in the room is if savannah is to expand and grow smartly it needs to involve something like light rail.

I've used the Subway system in NYC, DC Metro, BART, MARTA, and Charlie System in Boston. I was very impressed with the Charlie and DC reaching out to the suburbs. That's something we should model. Downtown being the hub aND going out to Pooler, Port Wentworth, and even one day Statesboro. In a pipe dream, South Carolina would cowboy up and create a combined rail system with Bluffton and Savannah. Would be great for the area. But again, pipe dream.

^^^ this x2!! The Park n Rides where people get onto the T in Boston works quite well. I like how Sav is still a nice small city. I mean, what traffic? Parking is incredibly easy, and almost no traffic compared to a big city. But I suppose the population will continue to swell.. In that case we can at least try to actually do real planning, and avoid an urban nightmare of loops and bridges and 20 lanes and all, and long commute times. But yeah like you say Dark it won't happen. Looks like the direction we are taking is using Pooler as a model for growth.

[SavannahLife]

From Seattle Should Double Down on Transit Investements | Politics | Seattle Met .. "These factors add up. While the city has grown at one of the fastest rates in the country, daily traffic volumes in Seattle have fallen. According to the Seattle DOT Traffic Report (2015), Seattle added nearly 100,000 people in the decade from 2004-2014, while average daily car traffic in the city fell by some 60,000 trips over the same period. The travel demand created by population and job growth is being absorbed by the transit system—exactly the transportation trend booming cities need and should seek to achieve. New residents are not filling roads with cars, they’re filling buses and trains because the city and region planned for it."

[Newsboy]

Originally Posted by TheDarkKnight

I've given up on the idea the backwards state of Georgia assembly would ever bring viable public transportation here. MARTA could be so much better but they refuse to expand and improve.

More lanes is just going to be a bigger nightmare. It's overdue but the elephant in the room is if savannah is to expand and grow smartly it needs to involve something like light rail.

I've used the Subway system in NYC, DC Metro, BART, MARTA, and Charlie System in Boston. I was very impressed with the Charlie and DC reaching out to the suburbs. That's something we should model. Downtown being the hub aND going out to Pooler, Port Wentworth, and even one day Statesboro. In a pipe dream, South Carolina would cowboy up and create a combined rail system with Bluffton and Savannah. Would be great for the area. But again, pipe dream.

You haven't been keeping up with the news in Atlanta ...

Atlanta voters to decide on sales tax hike for MARTA projects | Political Insider blog

The Atlanta City Council on Monday unanimously voted to schedule a referendum in November to decide whether to hike city’s sales tax by a half-penny to generate $2.5 billion over the next four decades for a MARTA expansion and other transit upgrades. The decision comes weeks after Gov. Nathan Deal signed a measure that authorized the tax hike, which would amount to the largest expansion of MARTA in the system’s history.

*Why this week is

Gov. Nathan Deal on Wednesday announced $75 million in state-funded transit projects THAT INCLUDES 26 NEW BUSES FOR CHATHAM AREA TRANSIT!

ALSO: A growing cadre of Republicans, enticed by the burst of economic development along the rail lines linking Atlanta to its northern suburbs, are embracing transit. State Sen. Brandon Beach listed a litany of companies — State Farm, Mercedes Benz, PulteGroup — that recently moved to new homes in metro Atlanta near MARTA lines.

AS FOR RAIL TRANSIT IN SAVANNAH: It's only cost effective in areas with dense urban / suburban populations and concentrated employment centers, neither of which we have. Chatham County's largest private employer is Gulfstream, and most of the people who work there LIVE in West Chatbam or Effingham, etc. Ditto for the port, logistics and trucking companies, the sugar refinery and the paper mill. Downtown is dominated by government and tourism / service jobs. The only other major intown employment sector is health care, centered at the hospitals on DeRenne. Doctors are as likely to take a train to work as a sick person to the emergency room.

[Newsboy]

Originally Posted by SavannahLife

From Seattle Should Double Down on Transit Investements | Politics | Seattle Met .. "These factors add up. While the city has grown at one of the fastest rates in the country, daily traffic volumes in Seattle have fallen. According to the Seattle DOT Traffic Report (2015), Seattle added nearly 100,000 people in the decade from 2004-2014, while average daily car traffic in the city fell by some 60,000 trips over the same period. The travel demand created by population and job growth is being absorbed by the transit system—exactly the transportation trend booming cities need and should seek to achieve. New residents are not filling roads with cars, they’re filling buses and trains because the city and region planned for it."

Don't believe anything you read on the Internet ....

Study: Traffic in Seattle still horrible, ranks 2nd-worst in U.S. for evening rush hour congestion - GeekWire

[PJA]

Originally Posted by Newsboy

Yep. I went to Google maps and looked at the I 20 Bobby Jones intersection closely. It's actually only a partial flyover, with a half cloverleaf. That will not work for 16 and 95, especially with the huge volume of traffic on 95.

I would be surprised if this project does not also include one of those fancy new (formed concrete) sound retaining wall's along the length of 16 to Dean Forest Road, between the interstate and the pricey homes in Southbridge. There's a slight earthen berm and trees between the road and houses now but I fear some of those may have to go. Or there might be enough space in the median to add extra lanes for merging etc without sacrificing too many trees? Who knows.

Those scraggly overgrown crepe myrtles (or whatever they are) will be history, however. And there's some pretty nice looking nearly full-grown trees (magnolias!) in the loops of the interstate intersection now that will no doubt have to be sacrificed. But that's the price of progress!

The 520/20 interchange is actually busier than the 95/16 interchange. 95 north to the interchange had a traffic count of 80,700 while 95 south had a count of 73,500. 16 west had a count of 41,000 while 16 east had a count of 59,500.

With the 520/20 interchange, 20 east has a count of 78,000 while 20 west has a count of 71,200. 520 east has a count of 87,000 while the coming from the west there is a count of 82,000. That would be about an average of 318,200 passing coming through the 520/20 interchange vs 254,700 coming through the 16/95 interchange.

[fourthwarden]

Originally Posted by Newsboy

AS FOR RAIL TRANSIT IN SAVANNAH: It's only cost effective in areas with dense urban / suburban populations and concentrated employment centers, neither of which we have. Chatham County's largest private employer is Gulfstream, and most of the people who work there LIVE in West Chatbam or Effingham, etc. Ditto for the port, logistics and trucking companies, the sugar refinery and the paper mill. Downtown is dominated by government and tourism / service jobs. The only other major intown employment sector is health care, centered at the hospitals on DeRenne. Doctors are as likely to take a train to work as a sick person to the emergency room.

There's a decent bit of density to support it, at least on the lower end. Historic streetcars ah-la what's on the River Front, what's in New Orleans, and what's in Charlotte would make sense. To so future passenger station, the CAT multi-modal station, and a mile or so radius around Forsyth Park (along Broughton, Liberty, Oglethorp, etc.). Maybe a bit out into the neighborhoods too (like, on GA 204 and Waters St).

[SavannahLife]

The street car on River st is a tourist toy, it's neat but not really serving a real transit purpose. News etal are right, not enough density here for passenger rail at least within the city. Now what WOULD have been neat is if the CAT 'intermodal' station was built along with a re-located (rebuilt) Amtrak station in it, plus along or close to the River somewhere so it could also have a ferry stop, and also with a CAT eBike rent station. Now we're talking intermodal! Maybe working that into the whole new Powerplant Hotel area and Canal District idea. Currently it is 'intermodal' but you have to take a bus to get to Amtrak or the airport. Wish it could have colocated with Amtrak somehow. As yes the current station is in a weird area, not walkable at all, nested away from downtown in an industrial area as mentioned.

Yes News it is heartening to see public private collaboration on transit-based development up in Atl and hopefully that will come here too. However regarding Southbridge.. and I know this won't be popular but I will throw it out here... aren't sound barriers in this instance wasteful spending? The people bought there knowing they were surrounded by two interstates and a dump. It would be very, very different if Southbridge was there first, and then they built I-16 AFTER that. Then I would definitely say they deserve getting sound barriers installed. As it is though, it seems more like a taxpayer handout to an expensive neighborhood by an interstate. The second I drove in there first looking for a house here I could hear it and ruled out any place there. Perhaps they can afford to build their own sound barrier with their HOA. I do hope they can save the bigger trees in the median though like they did for King George and Abercorn when they build this intersection.