U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Covid-19 Information Page
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Science and Technology
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 04-11-2020, 12:54 PM
 
2,011 posts, read 510,658 times
Reputation: 3208

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by NightBazaar View Post
What in the world are you talking about?
Have a rolly eyes.

We're on the same page here.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 04-12-2020, 06:01 AM
 
13,249 posts, read 10,842,938 times
Reputation: 10428
Quote:
Originally Posted by saltine View Post
Hoping for educated replies. No snark please
Is there any truth that 5G will disrupt the uptake of oxygen?
Highly unlikely.

Molecules can absorb energy from the wireless signal, but when those molecules collide with other molecules such as air or body fluids, the molecules will lose that energy and the energy will get converted into heat.

Compared to normal body heat, the effect is very very small.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-17-2020, 03:32 PM
 
Location: Ohio
22,071 posts, read 15,422,238 times
Reputation: 18536
Quote:
Originally Posted by saltine View Post
Hoping for educated replies. No snark please
Is there any truth that 5G will disrupt the uptake of oxygen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by saltine View Post
Still reading and trying to understand.

At 60 GHz, the oxygen molecule becomes highly absorbent of electromagnetic energy

Was hoping some science geek could quickly lay it out without a pugnacious attitude.
I see the problem as you having some serious misconceptions of the meaning of "absorption" within the context of electromagnetic energy.

Electromagnetic energy doesn't absorb anything. It is a combined electric field and magnetic field that oscillates, moving at the speed of light.

This energy can be measured as wavelengths in meters or frequency in Hertz.

When this energy strikes an object, it can impart or convey energy to the object it strikes.

This is the reason you can see things, since colors are electromagnetic energy.

It's also part and parcel of the global warming nonsense.

A CO2 molecule absorbs electromagnetic energy, but not all of it, just electromagnetic energy at certain frequencies or band-widths, namely at 2.7 microns, 4.3 microns and 15 microns.

Since Earth does not emit Black Body Radiation at 2.7 microns, we only have to look at 4.3 microns and 15 microns, and we'll apply Wien's Law to both.

Wien's Law T (Temperature) = b / wavelength in micrometers, where "b" is a constant equal to 2,900 um-K.

T = 2,900 um-K / 15 um = 193°K = -112°F

T = 2,900 um-K / 4.3 um = 673.9°K = 753°F

What we can infer from science is that 4.3 microns has far greater energy and does far more damage than 15 microns, however the amount of Black Body Radiation Earth emits at 4.3 microns is minuscule.

So what does O do?

Well, free O in the atmosphere is rare. It's O2 since it's a diatom.

Okay, some important background you need to know first before understanding the problem.

We live in a digital world, right?

What is the conduit of that digital world? It's fiber optics, not radio waves.

Is that a problem? Yes. Why? Because the average cost to lay fiber optics is about $500,000 per mile.

Uh-oh.

Understand that's digging a ditch, dropping pipe and pushing fiber-optics through the pipe, then throwing dirt back on top of it.

What are you going to do in an urban area? Cincinnati is a small metropolis. Gonna run fiber-optics through the middle of town? What about the other streets? What about all those 20-35 story office buildings and all the data users in those buildings?

It gets real expensive real fast. Can we find a work-around to connect the users to the fiber-optics trunk?

Yes, we called it DSL, which works great so long as there is only one user. Who isn't streaming.

When you have thousands of users, it just doesn't work.

Can we find an alternative? Yes, we can use the cell-phone network to connect users to the fiber-optics trunk.

That worked for a while, but the growth was so phenomenal you now have more users than bandwidth.

Can we fix that? Yes, we find a bandwidth that has little or no use to connect users to the fiber-optics trunk.

That bandwidth is 60 GHz.

Does O2 absorb that bandwidth? Yes, in fact, it will absorb 98% of the energy.

So that's bad, right? Nope. That's good.

Why is it good? Because it means you can have lots of transmitters right next to each other broadcasting at 60 GHz and they won't interfere with one another.

How's that work? Simple. I set up a 60 GHz transmitter on the top of your 25-story office building and aim it at the tower 2 miles over yon and the receiver on that tower picks up the signal and connects to the fiber-optics trunk underneath the tower.

Wanna know something else? Because O2 absorbs 98% of the energy, it makes it very, very difficult for anyone to intercept the signal, so it enhances security.

Contrast that with 900 MHz. O2 doesn't absorb it and it bleeds everywhere. I used to be a private investigator and back in the day when people used landlines on the 900 MHz band, I used to sit down the street in my car with a scanner listening to their phone conversations.

That's because O2 doesn't absorb 900 MHz and the wave propagates everywhere. That's why the FCC heavily regulates, not because they hate you and want to make your life miserable, it's because if they didn't license broadcasters, there'd be so much RF interference it'd be a total mess.

In theory, you could probably have 50,000 to 150,000 60 GHz transmitters in a 5 sq mile area and they wouldn't interfere with each other. If you were operating 900 MHz to maybe 20 GHz there's no way you could to that. You'd constantly drop calls and lose your internet connection and everything else.

What harm is there? None. It's not going to set the sky on fire.

Let's do Wien's Law:

T = 2,900 um-K / 4996.54 um = 0.580°K = -458.62°F


Nope, the sky is not going to burn up.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-20-2020, 06:23 PM
 
Location: Portland, OR
1,223 posts, read 1,937,514 times
Reputation: 1637
It seems as if many of these 5G conspiracy theorists believe that uWave and mmWave communication systems are somehow brand new and that no one has used that RF spectrum before. In a stunning revelation that shoecked the world, it was disclosed that uWave and mmWave point-to-point RF communication links have been around for decades. How do they think a decent % of cellular communication backhaul and repeaters are connected? It's line-of-sight repeaters.


The cognitive dissonance and desire to listen to others who absolutely no scientific training just boggles my mind.



A good background paper on the subject of backhaul links is below. One other fact that eludes a lot the 5G conspiracy theorists is the atmospheric absorption of these higher frequency RF signals. Details are on page 25 but the cliff-notes version is that increasing frequency leads to increased absorption, leading to shorter link distances at a given power. Which said in a simpler way means they don't travel as far. Oh and the Y axis is logarithmic (dB).



https://www.commscope.com/globalasse...477-en.pdf?r=1
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-23-2020, 11:49 PM
 
510 posts, read 295,208 times
Reputation: 1419
I would like to add a key point to this thread.

The fact that a certain EMR wavelength doesn't penetrate the skin DOES NOT mean it has no effect on a biological system. Nor does the fact that it doesn't heat tissue past a certain threshold.

https://academic.oup.com/endo/articl...5/1992/4931051

UVR has a major effect on the neuroendocrine system, though it does not penetrate deeply. Nor does it heat as much as IR light. The article states that UVB has a much stronger effect than UVA, despite less penetration depth. A lot of these effects cannot be attributed to vitamin D, either. I can't comment on the heating effects of UVB vs UVA.

~480 nm blue light's effects on the endocrine system via the eye can be attributed to its specific interactions with melanopsin. Nothing to do with heating. Yet, that interaction in the eyeball affects every organ in your body.

My point is, if you simplify the effects of a given light wavelength on a complex biological system (e.g. a human) by using half-baked classical physics, then you don't understand what you think you do.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-24-2020, 10:39 AM
 
Location: Bear's town
4,777 posts, read 5,711,367 times
Reputation: 4428
Quote:
Originally Posted by timfountain View Post
It seems as if many of these 5G conspiracy theorists believe that uWave and mmWave communication systems are somehow brand new and that no one has used that RF spectrum before. In a stunning revelation that shoecked the world, it was disclosed that uWave and mmWave point-to-point RF communication links have been around for decades.

Fascinating info here and from Mircea. Thanks, guys,



I've just learned that 60gHz was first successfully demonstrated in 1897. [J. C. Bose, Calcutta, India.]

Last edited by Tantalust; 04-24-2020 at 10:58 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Science and Technology
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2020, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top