Moving to Seattle with cash and no job (or, ugh... San Fran? or Portland?) (Tacoma: sales, renting)

[steveoscaro]

Hi all, been scouring these forums over the last few days, but finally must give in and post my issues for all to comment on, as unoriginal as they may be.

I'm a 25 yr old recent college grad with a writing degree (yeah... I know. So vague.). I've lived in Colorado most of my life, except for a year working in Alaska. I've always wanted to live in the northwest, so here I am in Portland, having arrived yesterday, to check out these cities and hopefully find a place. My first and probably lasting impression of Portland is that it's not quite big enough, too much like Boulder, lacking the energy of a real city. I grew up in small towns, which I loved, but want to experience living in a vibrant city.

So now it's between Seattle and San Francisco. I have traveled through both areas, but not spent much time in either. Which city do you prefer?? If you were 25, and single, which place would you rather live? Kodiak, AK is probably more rainy than Seattle, so I can handle the gloom.
I actually have a somewhat varied resume and will will take whatever decent day job I can get while I whittle away at my writing in the wee hours of the night. Which city has better job prospects (not including service industry jobs)? Is San Francisco really so unaffordable for someone who's just renting? Seems like both cities have a good literary scene.

Thanks for your two cents!

[Xanathos]

When you say you have money, how much money? You're talking about moving to 2 of the most expensive cities in the entire country, with the biggest feather in your cap being a degree that's almost completely vocationally worthless.

I can tell you that Portland will eat you up, because that job market is horrible. It's also nothing like Seattle or San Francisco, but you'd have to live there for a while to understand why. Job markets are better in Frisco and Seattle, but you've got to have some sort of a hook to get employers into you.

[VeronikaW]

I think if you find Portland not big enough, you'll be less happy with Seattle. I like Seattle a lot, but it doesn't have the big city feel of San Francisco, and I felt like Portland was more vibrant and urban than Seattle. To me Portland felt more like a big city. Seattle always seemed sort of sleepy to me (but I'm in my 30s, so I wasn't out looking to party or anything, so I may just have missed the excitement).

San Francisco is really, really expensive, and you'll find yourself living with roommates and possibly not in a desirable area if you don't have much money. San Francisco is probably my favorite west coast city, though. I love it. It has a vibrancy that a lot of other cities lack. If I were rich, I'd want to live there.

Definitely go and check out Seattle though. WA is a great state to live in, and we're actually planning on moving back to the Seattle area in the next 2 years.

Good luck!

V. =)

[steveoscaro]

Originally Posted by Xanathos

When you say you have money, how much money? You're talking about moving to 2 of the most expensive cities in the entire country, with the biggest feather in your cap being a degree that's almost completely vocationally worthless.

I can tell you that Portland will eat you up, because that job market is horrible. It's also nothing like Seattle or San Francisco, but you'd have to live there for a while to understand why. Job markets are better in Frisco and Seattle, but you've got to have some sort of a hook to get employers into you.

You're right, forgot to mention that. I have about a $7K cushion.
I know these are two very expensive places, but by living in a studio or sharing a room and living frugally, it shouldn't be as horrendous as for someone needing lots of space and wanting to live the high life. Definitely correct me if I'm wrong, though! And I'm not saying I have a hat full of feathers, but I have more than my degree on my resume. And Portland is already off the table.

[Xanathos]

Originally Posted by VeronikaW

I think if you find Portland not big enough, you'll be less happy with Seattle. I like Seattle a lot, but it doesn't have the big city feel of San Francisco, and I felt like Portland was more vibrant and urban than Seattle. To me Portland felt more like a big city. Seattle always seemed sort of sleepy to me (but I'm in my 30s, so I wasn't out looking to party or anything, so I may just have missed the excitement).

All I can say is HUH?!?!?!? Seriously? You are the first person I have *ever* seen say that. Hell, I couldn't get out of Portland fast enough because it felt so small. There was literally nothing to do there if you weren't into bicycles or hiking. Seattle is a FAR more cosmopolitan city. It's not even close. Portland is like a slightly less smelly version of Tacoma. I was bored out of my mind in Portland. Seattle is like the 12th or 13th biggest city in the country. Portland would essentially be a suburb of Seattle if you were to move it (hell, I think Bellevue, which is an actual suburb of Seattle, might be bigger in terms of things to do, skyline, etc. than Portland at this point)

San Francisco is really, really expensive, and you'll find yourself living with roommates and possibly not in a desirable area if you don't have much money. San Francisco is probably my favorite west coast city, though. I love it. It has a vibrancy that a lot of other cities lack. If I were rich, I'd want to live there.

This, for the most part, is true. This brings me back to that first paragraph though. San Francisco and Seattle are SO alike, I just can't really get how you praise one and say the other is "sleepy", and then say that the ugly kid sister of the three cities somehow has more going on. SFO has *slightly* more going on in it and for it than SEA, but the cost of living there is significantly higher, which makes it a less-attractive place to call home. And then when you couple in their whacky ass government and how they ban bottled water and Happy Meals and tax you into oblivion aside from standard cost of living (high sales tax, high gas tax, high income tax, etc.) it doesn't become much of a competition.

[seattlenextyear]

Come visit. You're a quick train or car ride away.

[steveoscaro]

Originally Posted by Xanathos

This, for the most part, is true. This brings me back to that first paragraph though. San Francisco and Seattle are SO alike, I just can't really get how you praise one and say the other is "sleepy", and then say that the ugly kid sister of the three cities somehow has more going on. SFO has *slightly* more going on in it and for it than SEA, but the cost of living there is significantly higher, which makes it a less-attractive place to call home. And then when you couple in their whacky ass government and how they ban bottled water and Happy Meals and tax you into oblivion aside from standard cost of living (high sales tax, high gas tax, high income tax, etc.) it doesn't become much of a competition.

This is what I've read several times now - that San Francisco is 'a little' better, but 'a lot' more expensive. So financially I guess it's obvious.

But I'm not really on a make it or break it sort of thing. Where ever I end up, I'll give it a shot at landing a good job, I'll live the city life, and get to work on my writing. If I manage to establish a sustainable existence and enjoy it, then great. If I end up having to serve coffee for a few months as my savings dwindle, then OK, I have a good seasonal job in the summer I can fall back on.

So of course the economics are important, but I guess I'm more interested in the appeal of a place, rather than how much sense it makes to move there. If that makes any sense...
Thanks from the input from you both!

[steveoscaro]

Originally Posted by seattlenextyear

Come visit. You're a quick train or car ride away.

Headed that way tonight. It's still nice to see these discussions to augment actually seeing a city. I found that reading the forum about Portland while in Portland was pretty revealing!

[Xanathos]

Originally Posted by steveoscaro

Headed that way tonight. It's still nice to see these discussions to augment actually seeing a city. I found that reading the forum about Portland while in Portland was pretty revealing!

I'll give you a decent "night 1" guide:

1) Go to Shorty's. Order the no. 3. Play some pinball. Do some people watching.
2) If it's not after 9 and everything closed, wander around downtown for a while. It's a good time of year to look around
3) Make the drive across the bridge to Bellevue, get a little taste of the more upscale crowd. Head to Joey Bellevue and try something with a floater in it. The bartender will understand.

Good way to initiate oneself to the city. You're on your own tomorrow and beyond depending on your tastes and what you're into. There's simply too much here that caters to too many differnet kinds of people to provide a detailed map. You're coming in on a Monday, so some of the more offbeat activities won't be going. If you don't despise the taste of coconut, one thing you have to do is head to the Dahlia Lounge/Bakery and grab a piece of Tom Douglas's triple coconut cream pie. I'm only half joking when I said that pie alone was almost enough to convince me to move here.

[steveoscaro]

Originally Posted by Xanathos

I'll give you a decent "night 1" guide:

1) Go to Shorty's. Order the no. 3. Play some pinball. Do some people watching.
2) If it's not after 9 and everything closed, wander around downtown for a while. It's a good time of year to look around
3) Make the drive across the bridge to Bellevue, get a little taste of the more upscale crowd. Head to Joey Bellevue and try something with a floater in it. The bartender will understand.

Haha nice, thanks. Might have to wait till tomorrow night depending on how late I get in, but I'll do it.