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Old 09-25-2008, 08:06 AM
 
Location: Seattle area
854 posts, read 4,134,017 times
Reputation: 527

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Agree with texastrigirl. Anyone who thinks there are SUVs 'everywhere' out here has not lived someplace where they ARE everywhere. Moved here from Dallas in January and the first thing you notice is that there's a ton of Priuses everywhere and very few SUVs, relatively. In TX most every family owned at least one truck, minivan, or SUV. Here in the burbs, I'm guessing it's more like...30% of families, maybe?

Happy to report that with one kid, we are doing fine in a honda accord and a toyota solara (a coupe at that). If we add a second kid, that will get a lot tougher, since we take a lot of trips and the stroller that will handle the trails is pretty big. Add a cooler to the trunk and it's pretty full. But we'll see. Three kids? No way. Would need at least one bigger vehicle, as much as I hate driving them.

I have no idea how people with bigger cars park around here. I have a terrible time parking at my dr's office, which has parking spaces just a couple of inches wider than MY car. We've discussed whether they're trying to squeeze in another space or two for financial reasons or if they're trying to make a point. Either way, I'm thinking we might look for other doctors because it's just so d*mn impossible to park there. Hate it. I do not have time to get there fifteen minutes early to look for a parking spot. And NO, I am not walking my toddler to a bus stop, waiting with him for a bus, riding with him on the bus, walking from the nearest bus stop to the doctor's office, and then doing that in reverse after he gets his vaccines. In the cold and rain. Talk about miserable.
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Old 09-25-2008, 09:11 AM
 
Location: WA
4,242 posts, read 8,756,135 times
Reputation: 2375
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDTD View Post
Do you even live here yet? I'm not keeping up. Okay...you are wrong. I grew up in the country (in WA), and 4 wheel drive bailed me out so many times I can't even count. How many times have I had to pull people out of a snow-bank or someone stuck in the mud? A lot. Sure...you can drive your Z3 into the mountains, but just pray that you don't find yourself in a place where you get stuck (because you may never get your car out and will have to hope that either your phone has service or someone with a 4x4 comes by to help). As for the last sentence...there you go (and many, many other things to include the fact that you can't pile five kids into a Z3). It's like insurance...you hate to have to pay for it, but you sure appreciate it when you need it. I put my truck in 4wheel drive at least 10 times this year enjoying the great outdoors. And no...i'm not one of those people who just goes out 4wheelin'. Each time was a practical application.
Nope, don't live there yet, but everything I said was true. My husband's taken his Z3 to all of the hiking spots in the mountains and has never had problems. His friend has followed him in another small convertible. And I've taken my Cavalier through NC mountains, in NY state snow/blizzards, up mountains there. Last summer, I drove through a stream to get to a field site almost every day.

I've been on backroads with idiotic men who get 4WD trucks stuck in mudpuddles. The 4W drive doesn't protect you from stupidity. If you can't drive a sedan through it, it doesn't have to be much worse before you won't be able to drive your SUV through it.

Anyways, we have AAA. Its about $100 a year, which is about 1 tank of gas for an SUV. Haven't ever had to use it, but its there if you're little fantasies of us getting stuck come true.
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Old 09-25-2008, 09:16 AM
 
Location: WA
4,242 posts, read 8,756,135 times
Reputation: 2375
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDTD View Post
A. SUV's became evil since they were around for years and years (Trail-Duster, Travel-all, Suburban, Bronco, Ram Charger, etc.) before they became evil, and B. why this would be a factor in moving to a place, because they probably aren't going away and they are everywhere (except apparently Europe).

Maybe I'm way out of wack here. Help me out.
SUV sales are way down, and will continue to decline as gas prices go up. Its great news to those of us who hate parking next to one because you can't see crap when you back out again.
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Old 09-26-2008, 12:40 AM
 
339 posts, read 705,998 times
Reputation: 173
Quote:
Originally Posted by seattlenextyear View Post
Nope, don't live there yet, but everything I said was true. My husband's taken his Z3 to all of the hiking spots in the mountains and has never had problems. His friend has followed him in another small convertible. And I've taken my Cavalier through NC mountains, in NY state snow/blizzards, up mountains there. Last summer, I drove through a stream to get to a field site almost every day.

I've been on backroads with idiotic men who get 4WD trucks stuck in mudpuddles. The 4W drive doesn't protect you from stupidity. If you can't drive a sedan through it, it doesn't have to be much worse before you won't be able to drive your SUV through it.

Anyways, we have AAA. Its about $100 a year, which is about 1 tank of gas for an SUV. Haven't ever had to use it, but its there if you're little fantasies of us getting stuck come true.
A. You are arguing with someone who actually [grew up in the country/mountains in WA] about the benefits of 4wd like you know better than them. Do you go to the doctor and tell them they are wrong too? There was literally a trailhead in my back yard. I rode my snowmobile to school as a kid on more than one occasion (to put it in perspective). I do agree that 4WD doesn't protect you from stupidity. I've seen plenty of that too, but I have seen waaaaaaaaaayyyyyy more practical application of it.

B. Does AAA respond to flares? Apparently you have magic cell service that works everywhere. And...based on your theory of the lack of use for 4wd, why do tow-companies (yes...some tow for AAA) have 4x4 tow trucks at all? They obviously feel like it's a necessity, and they are experts in that matter. Why don't you tell them their idiots too.

C. I don't wish getting stuck in the woods on ANYONE. You made a very big "generalization" with you "racket" comment. That's all.
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Old 09-26-2008, 01:11 AM
 
339 posts, read 705,998 times
Reputation: 173
Quote:
Originally Posted by seattlenextyear View Post
SUV sales are way down, and will continue to decline as gas prices go up. Its great news to those of us who hate parking next to one because you can't see crap when you back out again.
No kidding? Lucky I don't have one I guess. I think that the sales of any vehicle (SUV or not) that doesn't get spectacular gas mileage is down right now. I'm sorry that you are inconvenienced by others who have families, etc. What about trucks and minivans? Get rid of them too? You can't see well when you park by them either. Hey...It's your world and we're just livin' in it. That's why I'm asking. Maybe we can make it happen before you move out here.
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Old 09-26-2008, 05:14 PM
 
1,630 posts, read 3,873,724 times
Reputation: 1116
Don't lump all SUVs together. Our family of four owns one car - a big huge Chevy Suburban that gets about 15-20 mpg. Having said that, I bet our family uses less gas per year than most families of four. We are all bicycle commuters and only use the car for long trips. I always challenge people who talk about SUVs to tell me what their passenger miles per gallon is. Our Suburban gets 60-100 pmpg - beating any single driver hybrid.
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Old 09-27-2008, 11:25 PM
 
339 posts, read 705,998 times
Reputation: 173
Quote:
Originally Posted by tobester View Post
Don't lump all SUVs together. Our family of four owns one car - a big huge Chevy Suburban that gets about 15-20 mpg. Having said that, I bet our family uses less gas per year than most families of four. We are all bicycle commuters and only use the car for long trips. I always challenge people who talk about SUVs to tell me what their passenger miles per gallon is. Our Suburban gets 60-100 pmpg - beating any single driver hybrid.
What? You mean that you don't just randomly drive your SUV around burning gas and parking next to people so they can't see when they back out?
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Old 09-28-2008, 05:38 PM
 
Location: WA
4,242 posts, read 8,756,135 times
Reputation: 2375
There's a lot of sedans out there that also seat 4 people.
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Old 09-28-2008, 06:19 PM
 
Location: where you sip the tea of the breasts of the spinsters of Utica
8,298 posts, read 14,125,270 times
Reputation: 8104
I just hate going out for a walk and having noisy, throbbing, obnoxious SUVs swarming all around me. They always seem to contain one mother and one daughter, both wearing sunglasses, or else one angry-looking male in his 20s.

Yes, they also waste gas (unless they're efficiently packed) and pollute. Air and noise pollution.
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Old 09-29-2008, 12:57 AM
 
339 posts, read 705,998 times
Reputation: 173
Quote:
Originally Posted by seattlenextyear View Post
There's a lot of sedans out there that also seat 4 people.
If anything, IMO, people need to be targeting sports cars as being "evil". Seriously...2 seats (no practical use besides looking cool) and horrible gas mileage to boot (many worse than any SUV out there). My full size diesel truck (4x4 ) gets almost as good as gas mileage as the Z3 you referenced earlier. I can carry a total of 5 people, a couple dogs and lots of "stuff" in the bed. Basically, I can do waaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyy more practical, everyday "stuff" in it. I have a second business that requires me to pull a heavy trailer with equipment (my choice...yes, but I can already foresee your next brilliant comeback which would be that I could have bought a small four-door truck that does the same thing). You can get from point A to point B in a sports car and that's about it. Like tobester said...he can actually probably haul six or more people (think he only referenced 4) since it is a Suburban when his kids want to bring friends along (which that day will probably come if it already hasn't) for the price of your Z3's 2. He can also probably haul a ton of camping gear,ski equipment, maybe a dog or two and pull a trailer whether it be for camping or for a weekend landscaping or home improvement job if he wants. I don't see many 2 seat sports cars doing this.

My point is that people make these broad generalizations like they know what other people are all about. They see one person driving in an SUV and smugly assume that they lead a gluttonous lifestyle with no regard to "whatever". If you were to actually do the real math and know the facts about that person, it may not necessarily be what is initially perceived. You can drive a hybrid or small car all you want. That's spectacular. But...if you are commuting and hour (one way) every day like many of the people in this area do (I don't think there will be a huge argument on that one), why are they better than a person who drives 10 minutes (one way) in an SUV? Everyone will assume they are.

I have had my truck for almost 2 years. I just reached 10k miles. A Toyota Prius gets about 46mpg combined. I get about 17 combined. A Prius driver would only have to drive 13,500 miles a year to be burning the same amount of gas as me (11,500 if I was driving a Z3 at 5k per year). But...not knowing this, I would be the a-hole if you saw the both of us pulling into a parking lot at the same time. Tobester is a bicycle commuter, and you are commenting that he can do better? His family, for the most part, pedals (as in no gas/parking).
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