How can we as a city (seattle) keep affordable apartment rents in the city for non tech workers?? (schools, camps)

[Returning2USA]

Originally Posted by Montezia

There are a lot of non techies (nurses such as myself) that can afford Seattle. But otherwise I agree. I haven't had much difficulty getting and finding a job in healthcare as a POC. I feel like this post is generalizing. Sooner or later the real estate bubble is going to burst here. It always does.

A burst or correction is needed to balance things out.

Also, american (and I assume Seattle per capita debt is high?).

When the next downward economic cycle comes and UE goes up it will be another cycle for many who are delinquent or in default because they over extended on credit and didn't save sufficiently.

I remember the recession of 2001 when they interviewed people in the Seattle metro area who made $100K back then but when they lost their job they were literally broke and struggling.

[rkcarguy]

Originally Posted by Bluefox

The problem is... the world doesn’t just run on tech workers and wealthy people. You may think anyone who isn’t making 6+ figures didn’t “keep up with their peers” but at the end of the day, society still needs people to be teachers, police officers, firefighters, vet techs, waiters/waitresses, other service industry workers, health aides, janitors, city/state government workers, etc. I mean, they don’t always require a fancy degree but they’re still vital roles that need to be filled. So I would argue that it’s in the interest of everyone to be able to accomodate people who fill those sorts of roles. Now, a true capitalist might say the job market would sort that out itself, but I do wonder what that would look like.

Vancouver BC deals with this on an ongoing basis, they are short nurses, teachers, fire fighters, police, and so on, nonetheless the service level jobs because there is no affordable housing. Teacher positions stay open for months on end. Many cities are headed this way, Bellingham as well. The thing is we have the space to build more, but between the Nimby's, over-bearing ecological restrictions, and the snails pace of getting a permit, projects take years to get off the ground....IF they get off the ground at all.

The problem is pretty simple, the growth is nearly ten-fold the amount of additional units being permitted.

[Montezia]

Originally Posted by Returning2USA

A burst or correction is needed to balance things out.

Also, american (and I assume Seattle per capita debt is high?).

When the next downward economic cycle comes and UE goes up it will be another cycle for many who are delinquent or in default because they over extended on credit and didn't save sufficiently.

I remember the recession of 2001 when they interviewed people in the Seattle metro area who made $100K back then but when they lost their job they were literally broke and struggling.

This post and the below post raise very valid points. You cannot have a city of just those making 100k unless you plan on raising minimum wage to 30/hr. (And even that wouldn't help as it would skyrocket inflation) American debt is definitely high. What I think is more likely to happen and probably is is that fewer investors are likely to invest into the whole American banking system.

What's happening in BC definitely sounds scary. I think it could definitely happen in Seattle aa well.

[Seacove]

Originally Posted by Montezia

This post and the below post raise very valid points. You cannot have a city of just those making 100k unless you plan on raising minimum wage to 30/hr. (And even that wouldn't help as it would skyrocket inflation) American debt is definitely high. What I think is more likely to happen and probably is is that fewer investors are likely to invest into the whole American banking system.

What's happening in BC definitely sounds scary. I think it could definitely happen in Seattle aa well.

Then why move here? Why doesn't any of this discourage people from moving here? I find myself mildly pleased by a negative Seattle story because I sort of hope it deters a few thousand people from moving here so they can choose somewhere else. Still they come - from thousands of miles away, skipping many other states and many other cities in between to land right in King County.

[87112]

Seacove. For the love of God people are moving here for job opportunities. Not to make you upset. Humans will always complain about life. Get this point and you will finally see the light.

[rkcarguy]

Originally Posted by Seacove

Then why move here? Why doesn't any of this discourage people from moving here? I find myself mildly pleased by a negative Seattle story because I sort of hope it deters a few thousand people from moving here so they can choose somewhere else. Still they come - from thousands of miles away, skipping many other states and many other cities in between to land right in King County.

I don't understand it either. I mean we have a horrible housing situation as far as comparing income to cost of housing as a ratio. Move here for a job that maybe pays good compared to where these people came from, but unless you work two jobs or am well into the 6 figure income bracket, you'll end up living in a tiny apartment in the get shot part of town, an RV, or in your car? Are they not any smarter than that?

Furthermore I am disgusted with the state that they let this happen, and instead of upping their game and doing something to provide affordable housing their solution is to subsidize rents and food for the poor with the taxpayers money while many of the middle class are actually worse off.

[mhays25]

For anyone without kids, debt, or car, you don't need to be anywhere near six figures to live pretty well. So we have a disproportionate number of people like that.

[Seacove]

Originally Posted by 87112

Seacove. For the love of God people are moving here for job opportunities. Not to make you upset. Humans will always complain about life. Get this point and you will finally see the light.

Come on. Seattle is not the only place with job opportunities and look at all the complaints. There are plenty of job opportunities elsewhere with a lower cost of living too.

[Bluefox]

Originally Posted by Seacove

Come on. Seattle is not the only place with job opportunities and look at all the complaints. There are plenty of job opportunities elsewhere with a lower cost of living too.

But you have to keep in mind that a lot of the growth is coming from immigration and from migration from California, where all the gripes about Seattle are as true if not more so. If you’re coming from CA with a lot of cashed out equity and/or a high paying job, Seattle’s negatives aren’t that bad. Not to single out CA but more than 3x people come from there than the next highest contributory state, Texas. Plus, tech salaries are really good here. And one can make a lot of money in the construction industry right now.

I don’t think the people who are most affected by the “negatives” in Seattle are the ones driving the growth, which is why I think your comments miss the mark. I’m sure some people are deluded or haven’t thought things through, but at the end of the day, income levels and housing keeps going up, and we can’t really blame the people who are already here or people who move here for modest career prospects. It’s clear many if not most of the newcomers in Seattle are able to afford the prices and are undeterred by the homelessness, housing cost, weather, etc. Probably because things are even worse where they came from, or the money is just that good. And who do you have to blame for that?

[mhays25]

Well said.

We have a ton of stuff to work on, including cracking down on behavior and addressing affordability more broadly. But the region is attracting people for very good reasons. Seattle has become the junior San Francisco of the tech world.