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Don't think of it in terms of numbers. If you do, you'll miss out. There are too many variables with dating and relationships. It's not about being "good enough" but rather being a "good match" that's more important. People want to find someone who compliments them. Once you realize that, you'll know it's not about being rich, or good looking, etc.
One of the main things women seek is security. Even independent women. Some men show this with money, yes, but security is also shown with strength (be it physical, political, or social) and being responsible (taking care of yourself, etc.). Really it depends on you. Not the number of men vs. women, but how you relate with them.
I'm not sure I can definitively answer why some experience the city of Seattle as less socially open or friendly than the suburbs, but I'll try... Seattle isn't just a big city, it feels like one too. People are constantly in your face and all kinds of strangers are constantly trying to get your attention. The professional signature collectors for political campaigns, the do-gooders collecting cash for dubious charities, the religious missionaries trying to persuade unconverted souls to whatever vision of salvation they're selling, the touts for neighborhood businesses... legal & black market, and finally the perhaps pitiable but usually aggressive pan-handlers begging for a handout or selling their poetry... everyday city dwellers are confronted by countless unwelcome demands on our attention by strangers. For women I imagine this to be even more of a burden if one adds all the dudes approaching hoping for a chance to capture some of their time to get to know them better and perhaps get a date out of the uninvited encounters. Finally big cities suffer from the overlarge population of strangers who just seem to be getting in the way. Too much of something, and they lose their value.... in this case too many people means that they too get devalued, discarded and generally treated worse than the trash that mindful of our responsibility to the environment we carefully sort and recycle.
I'll give the original poster of this thread the benefit of the doubt that he's just gotten frustrated and cranky by the tough situation for men trying to date in a city with an enormously unbalanced ratio of single men to single women. According to Jeff Reifman there are >130 single men to 100 single women in key age groups. That these precious women can afford to be picky should be no surprise. One can hardly begrudge them for making the best of their situation and trying to get the best offer they can based on whatever social capital and personal assets they bring to the singles marketplace. If the ratio were reversed, you better believe we guys would be picky too... shopping around until we found the sweetest sweetheart we could find.
On the other hand I do find regrettable some of the unbelievable ill-mannered and frankly inhuman behavior of the single women I've encountered since I've moved to Seattle. I'm going to agree with the original poster about the phony politeness and the unreliability of many of the single women. However I'm not sure that it's unique to Seattle that women are unable to deal straight and directly express their perspective and respectfully decline invitations or overtures for social engagement. Men complain that they have to do most of the work and take most of the initiative especially in the early phases before dating, however women have to decline all the offers they're not really into from the guys who aren't their type. It's tough for guys approaching and opening conversations with dozens of strangers a week, but rejection isn't easy for the one doing the rejecting either. I might imagine if I got a lot of offers for dates that I'd probably want to save face by saying I'm just busy instead of something more honest and direct like "Thanks for the invitation, but I just don't think you're my type..." But this doesn't excuse some of the more plain rude avoidant behaviour I've experienced trying to date in Seattle. For example I've been stood up for more dates than I actually went on in 2016. Stood up 3 times vs. 2 actual dates. How hard is it for even the most confrontation shy personality to at least send a text "Sorry can't make it." instead of leaving me waiting? From what I hear from fellas in the trenches trying to date around here, this isn't uncommon. But for the ladies with plenty of attention and plenty of opportunities among Seattle's surplus of anonymous dudes, what are the consequences of such atrocious behavior? Well perhaps we can just blame it on the unnatural selection of the dating landscape? The sweet ones have been already been snapped up, and all that's left are the rude ones with the deformed personalities... In his series "Master of None" fellow south Asian, Aziz Ansari, describes how we've become the rudest generation in history with all the competing offers always available at our fingertips which means we are reluctant to commit to anything but then quick to change our minds when something better comes along. Appalling... but very familiar. One thing I fear happening in this milieu of monstrous rudeness is that it's "socially" contagious. Get treated badly often enough, one might start to act rudely like one of the jerks so numerous to the environment. This doesn't excuse the original poster's or my crankiness, but it sure does explain it.
For now the only words of encouragement I can give for men dating in the Seattle market is that it's so tough here, that if you can make it here, you can probably make it anywhere. Nevertheless I'm not sure how transferable any of the skills acquired here by dating in this peculiar chilly social environment are transferable to situations in other regions with saner cultures.
At the moment I'm not pursuing "dating" aggressively any more. Sure I think a relationship could possibly enrich my life, but I'm not so desperate to get a girl at any cost. My most recent dates were awfully uninspiring. I don't want to say that the ladies involved were boring, because maybe it was just I who was the boring one... unable to make for lively and engaging conversation. So I fear I risk burning out and turning into a cranky bitter old bore which is of no fun or use for dating.
WHOA, Treu! I can't relate at all to your description of Seattle. "...people constantly in your face"? Never. Religious proselytizers? People collecting charitable donations? Polit. campaigners/signature-collectors? The latter--so rarely it made no impression. The others--never. Panhandlers? Only downtown around 2nd Avenue. Guys approaching women to start a convo? IF ONLY! Unfortunately, that never happened to me or my women friends. That's what the Freeze is about, after all.
"An enormously unbalanced ratio" between men & women in key age groups? If that's true, and if the men were trying to actively do something about it (approach women), there wouldn't be complaints about a Freeze. The women I know only get approached maybe once in 6 years, if that. Oh, wait, there was one who got approached several times/week, but she was exceptionally pretty and was curvy. It seems that all those guys rumored to be chronically thirsty are being very picky. And they're probably not very good at figuring out where to meet women and/or how to talk to them.
The OP didn't say anything about phony politeness. What he said was that after 1 date, the women weren't interested in a 2nd one. That's neither "phony polite" nor flakey. It's the opposite of flakey; instead of just fading out on him, i.e. pretending to be ok with a second date in order to be polite, but then ghosting, they give him the courtesy of being honest and up front at the end of the date. It's actually the opposite of phony polite and flakey.
The fact is, as I told the OP, dating is difficult for most people.
Location: In a perfect world winter does not exist
3,661 posts, read 2,948,846 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth
WHOA, Treu! I can't relate at all to your description of Seattle. "...people constantly in your face"? Never. Religious proselytizers? People collecting charitable donations? Polit. campaigners/signature-collectors? The latter--so rarely it made no impression. The others--never. Panhandlers? Only downtown around 2nd Avenue. Guys approaching women to start a convo? IF ONLY! Unfortunately, that never happened to me or my women friends. That's what the Freeze is about, after all.
"An enormously unbalanced ratio" between men & women in key age groups? If that's true, and if the men were trying to actively do something about it (approach women), there wouldn't be complaints about a Freeze. The women I know only get approached maybe once in 6 years, if that. Oh, wait, there was one who got approached several times/week, but she was exceptionally pretty and was curvy. It seems that all those guys rumored to be chronically thirsty are being very picky. And they're probably not very good at figuring out where to meet women and/or how to talk to them.
The OP didn't say anything about phony politeness. What he said was that after 1 date, the women weren't interested in a 2nd one. That's neither "phony polite" nor flakey. It's the opposite of flakey; instead of just fading out on him, i.e. pretending to be ok with a second date in order to be polite, but then ghosting, they give him the courtesy of being honest and up front at the end of the date. It's actually the opposite of phony polite and flakey.
The fact is, as I told the OP, dating is difficult for most people.
I would not be surprised at this. Seattle Freeze, Big Asian population where males are taught to know your boundaries. In Seattle it seems you need a formal introduction to meet a mate.
Location: From Sunny Honolulu to Rainy Puget Sound Area
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I sort of have to concur with the OP that the dating scene is not that great, however, it depends on which part of the Seattle / Tacoma metro area you live in.
I am like the OP, a minority guy (Korean/japanese descent), and have been struggling with online dating in this area, as well as having post-meet up success with participants at scheduled speed date events. I actually prefer Korean or East Asian women in general so my dating pool potential is not too big.
So getting back to location, I'd say that since I live down in boony puyallup, there isn't much in store for me in terms of dating opportunities.
I have had some online girl dates who have messaged me. But the majority of these girls were living far away in Bellevue, Redmond, Bothell, downtown Seattle area (i.e. capital hill), or Lynnwood.
I just hate driving long distances from puyallup to Factoria, Bellevue, Lynnwood, Bothell, etc. You get the gyst, and that is, I hate spending time stuck in the 405 freeway traffic, and using up a lot of gas to drive to those locations to meet up with potential girls I've met online.
I am thinking of moving away from Puyallup once my current job contract expires, and plan on moving to Lynnwood, Bellevue, Factoria, Kirkaland (<-- although I made a thread long ago that I hated Kirkland, but it sure beats puyallup) or Renton.
I sort of have to concur with the OP that the dating scene is not that great, however, it depends on which part of the Seattle / Tacoma metro area you live in.
I am like the OP, a minority guy (Korean/japanese descent), and have been struggling with online dating in this area, as well as having post-meet up success with participants at scheduled speed date events. I actually prefer Korean or East Asian women in general so my dating pool potential is not too big.
So getting back to location, I'd say that since I live down in boony puyallup, there isn't much in store for me in terms of dating opportunities.
I have had some online girl dates who have messaged me. But the majority of these girls were living far away in Bellevue, Redmond, Bothell, downtown Seattle area (i.e. capital hill), or Lynnwood.
I just hate driving long distances from puyallup to Factoria, Bellevue, Lynnwood, Bothell, etc. You get the gyst, and that is, I hate spending time stuck in the 405 freeway traffic, and using up a lot of gas to drive to those locations to meet up with potential girls I've met online.
I am thinking of moving away from Puyallup once my current job contract expires, and plan on moving to Lynnwood, Bellevue, Factoria, Kirkaland (<-- although I made a thread long ago that I hated Kirkland, but it sure beats puyallup) or Renton.
Where were Asian guys like you and the OP when I was living in Seattle? I never ran into Asian guys, not even as a university student.
That was pretty interesting, if-true. Could be "confirmation bias" on my part, as I seem to be something of a "ranger" in disposition and need a *lot* of space. The "evolved in groups (tribes) of about 150" I've heard before, and seems eminently logical for the what, hundred thousand -odd years since Homo Sapiens evolved, prior to the advent of animal husbandry and organized agriculture. Followed by and/or contemporaneous with the city-state, places like Ur and doubtless many others lost to time. The rest, as they say, is history.
Technology and population density is changing everything, we're in uncharted waters here as to how humans will adapt (or not adapt) to changing mating rules. Like everyone else, roll with it or perish. No choice, really.
It's always about appearance OP, any woman will be "single" if you're attractive enough, regardless of their actual relationship status... true story.
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