No more NBA (Seattle: hotels, buying, organic)

[Hesster]

Originally Posted by SonicsFan93

There are so many problems with what your saying, that it's not even funny. It's so shortsighted! The Kingdome DID need to be replaced. It was dangerous. By 1993, the roof was leaking severely. In 1994, tiles were falling from the roof. It was a hazard, and it was falling apart.

They fixed the roof, remember? That's what the $33 million renovation was for.

Originally Posted by SonicsFan93

Here's why Seattle needs professional sports. Do you remember what the SODO district was like before Safeco and Qwest Field? It rejuvinated the area. Those teams provide thousands of jobs each. Not just those who run the team, but game-day operations like ticket takers and ushers. That money wasn't wasted, it was invested in jobs, and into the economy.

Are you going to argue that spending a half billion dollars on stadiums that are open around half of the year were a better investment than say using the money to fix the 520 bridge or the Alaskan Way Viaduct? How many of those jobs are full time, living wage jobs and how many are minimum wage service jobs with no benefits?

Originally Posted by SonicsFan93

Did you notice how badly Oklahoma City wanted the Sonics? Do you know why? Because it brings jobs, and improves the quality of life. Professional Sports brings people closer together. This may sound cliche, but where else are you going to get people of all creeds and races together in one place, all rooting for one common goal?

There are many cities that don't have professional sports teams and don't seem to be suffering. Besides, you're acting like having the professional sports teams ship out would leave no sports in Seattle at all. Have you forgotten about the Huskies? Or is college sports somehow different than seeing million dollar prima donnas prance around the field?

Originally Posted by SonicsFan93

Another thing, Safeco Field is going to be paid off so much earlier than anyone could of imagined, because they're making so much money. We're paying for it through a 1% Hotel/Rental Car Tax. This is taxing tourists, not residents. The new potential Seattle NBA ownership group is willing to pay for half ($150 million) of a $300 million Key Arena renovation. The city has already committed $75 million. They just want that tax shifted to a new Key Arena. Key Arena should be the crown jewel of Seattle Center.

It's not just tourists who need hotels and rental cars, you know. How many of the people have we seen asking on this very board who are planning on staying in a hotel while they look for a permanent residence? How many residents need a rental car now and then or are paying for rental services like Zipcar?

Originally Posted by SonicsFan93

One more thing. How would you like it if I said, "Good riddance to the opera or the ballet. Personally, not being an opera or ballet fan, I don't see why Seattle needs any ballet or opera at all.

The ballet and opera houses aren't asking taxpayers to fork out hundreds of millions of dollars to millionaires, either.

[SonicsFan93]

Originally Posted by Hesster

They fixed the roof, remember? That's what the $33 million renovation was for.



Are you going to argue that spending a half billion dollars on stadiums that are open around half of the year were a better investment than say using the money to fix the 520 bridge or the Alaskan Way Viaduct? How many of those jobs are full time, living wage jobs and how many are minimum wage service jobs with no benefits?



There are many cities that don't have professional sports teams and don't seem to be suffering. Besides, you're acting like having the professional sports teams ship out would leave no sports in Seattle at all. Have you forgotten about the Huskies? Or is college sports somehow different than seeing million dollar prima donnas prance around the field?



It's not just tourists who need hotels and rental cars, you know. How many of the people have we seen asking on this very board who are planning on staying in a hotel while they look for a permanent residence? How many residents need a rental car now and then or are paying for rental services like Zipcar?



The ballet and opera houses aren't asking taxpayers to fork out hundreds of millions of dollars to millionaires, either.

Yes, they did fix the Kingdome roof. But it was like they put a band-aid on gun shot wound. It was temporary, and the eyesore still needed to be replaced.

I'm not going to argue about 1/2 billion dollar stadiums that are only open half the year. Those were both built before 520 Bridge and Viaduct Concerns. I'm going to argue about spending $75 MILLION ON A PLACE THAT'S OPEN YEAR ROUND! Somewhere that everyone can go to watch not just Sonics Basketball, but concerts and other events as well. Key Arena employes ushers and concessionaries year-round, but with the Sonics and Thunderbirds leaving, they may be laid off.

The money to fix the bridge and viaduct comes from completely different places than what the NBA ownership group wants. The viaduct money will come from the gas tax, federal earmark funding, and possibly monorail funding. The ownership group wants the Hotel/Car Rental Tax Money. IT'S AN EXISTING TAX.

College Sports and Professional Sports Are Completely Different. College sports don't bring people together the same way. Pro Sports bring civic pride. I'm not a cougar or a husky, so I could care less. Many people are the same way.

FYI, McCaw Hall used $55 Million in Public Funding. And Again, THE NBA OWNERSHIP GROUP DOESN'T WANT HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS! $75 MILLION! GET IT RIGHT!

[Wishin4sun]

Originally Posted by Hesster

Good riddance, I say. Personally, not being a sports fan, I don't see why Seattle needs any professional sports teams at all.

As for the Kingdome, it did not need to be replaced. It had just gone through a $33 million renovation a few years before it was torn down, which I might add, last I heard is still being paid off because the cost for it was rolled into the funding for Safeco Field.

While I'm on that subject, I wish that all that money that was wasted building those new stadiums could have been spent on actually fixing the infrastructure of the city rather than fat cat corporate handouts.

I don't think the city of Seattle will ever get that

[Hesster]

Originally Posted by SonicsFan93

Yes, they did fix the Kingdome roof. But it was like they put a band-aid on gun shot wound. It was temporary, and the eyesore still needed to be replaced.

I'm not going to argue about 1/2 billion dollar stadiums that are only open half the year. Those were both built before 520 Bridge and Viaduct Concerns. I'm going to argue about spending $75 MILLION ON A PLACE THAT'S OPEN YEAR ROUND! Somewhere that everyone can go to watch not just Sonics Basketball, but concerts and other events as well. Key Arena employes ushers and concessionaries year-round, but with the Sonics and Thunderbirds leaving, they may be laid off.

The money to fix the bridge and viaduct comes from completely different places than what the NBA ownership group wants. The viaduct money will come from the gas tax, federal earmark funding, and possibly monorail funding. The ownership group wants the Hotel/Car Rental Tax Money. IT'S AN EXISTING TAX.

College Sports and Professional Sports Are Completely Different. College sports don't bring people together the same way. Pro Sports bring civic pride. I'm not a cougar or a husky, so I could care less. Many people are the same way.

FYI, McCaw Hall used $55 Million in Public Funding. And Again, THE NBA OWNERSHIP GROUP DOESN'T WANT HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS! $75 MILLION! GET IT RIGHT!

They were not built before the Viaduct and 520 became concerns. The Viaduct has been a concern since the California earthquake of 1989. There was a study done in 1996 that found the soil underneath the Viaduct could liquify in a major earthquake and cause a collapse. The 520 bridge had an earthquake retrofit in 1999, and its instability in storms was known long before that.

They might not want hundreds of millions now, but I seem to remember Bennet making a demand for a new venue for the Sonics and not accepting a remodel on KeyArena (which the voters rejected anyway). Considering the state of the economy and the other projects that need doing, I doubt that taxpayers' attitudes will change anytime soon.

[allforcats]

Originally Posted by Blindtom

Seattle is not rated as the most intelligent city for nothing.

Oh three cheers!!!

[SonicsFan93]

Originally Posted by Hesster

They were not built before the Viaduct and 520 became concerns. The Viaduct has been a concern since the California earthquake of 1989. There was a study done in 1996 that found the soil underneath the Viaduct could liquify in a major earthquake and cause a collapse. The 520 bridge had an earthquake retrofit in 1999, and its instability in storms was known long before that.

They might not want hundreds of millions now, but I seem to remember Bennet making a demand for a new venue for the Sonics and not accepting a remodel on KeyArena (which the voters rejected anyway). Considering the state of the economy and the other projects that need doing, I doubt that taxpayers' attitudes will change anytime soon.

Still, the stadiums were built/being built before the Nisqually Quake. They were just as worried about the Kingdome in an earthquake too.

Don't talk about Bennett. Bennett's gone, out of the picture. He made a one-day hail mary attempt to get the Taj Mahal. I don't know what the hell you're talking about with the voters rejecting a Key Arena remodel. If you're talking about that initiative by, "Citizens for More Important Things", and Chris Van Dyk, they are FOR THE KEY ARENA REMODEL BY BALLMER'S GROUP! Even the non-tax people are on the side of the Key Arena remodel. GOD!

[Ira500]

This is not a simple issue. Seattle these days loves to bandy about the term " world class", and world class cities don't simply have art museums and opera, they also have pro sports teams. Unfortunately, the way the system is set up right now means that for a team owner to make money, they have to have a certain number of luxury boxes, and even more unfortunately, that often means a completely new arena, and the NBA is very complicit in team owners trying to extort taxpayers into paying for brand new arenas that the vast majority of the citizens will never visit.
But...part of how a city is viewed is by the amount of attractions it has and it's economic diversity, and pro sports teams add to that.
Sure, Seattle could survive with no Sonics, or Mariners, or Seahawks. LA survives without a pro football franchise...But pro sports teams do add to a city's greatness, and ought to be willing to pay for some of that.
Local ownership is usually necessary for the kind of commitment a city needs to pony up some tax dollars, and a willingness on the part of the owners to pony up the vast majority of the dollars needed is also essential...The Ballmer proposal might just be the ticket...Some fans will say that we need to build any new arena that any owner wants, and some naysayers say that any kind of taxpayer money used to build an arena should never happen. The truth is probably somewhere in between.

[Bud Dickman]

Are you going to argue that spending a half billion dollars on stadiums that are open around half of the year were a better investment than say using the money to fix the 520 bridge or the Alaskan Way Viaduct? How many of those jobs are full time, living wage jobs and how many are minimum wage service jobs with no benefits?


We have money going into those projects? And you sound like an elitist with that last comment. You're saying that if you have a low paying job with no benefits that you don't matter and should just lose your job. Most employees at the Key work that as a 2nd job and are struggling to get by as is. You'll also find the employees to be more diverse then all the residents of Queen Anne.

[maniabeatle01]

I am very happy that Seattle got to keep the name and history. I'm hoping a renovated Key Arena brings in not just an NBA team, but an NHL team as well. I think Seattle can support both successfully.

[SonicsFan93]

Bump up the volume!