Nuclear Preparedness (good, system, truck, area)

[lifelongMOgal]

Originally Posted by HappyTexan

Well then you're invited to sit on my front porch with me and my 6 pack and we'll watch the world end together while chugging down "cold ones"

Or you can come up North. I've decided to add a case or two of Gentleman Jack to my survivial supplies for barter material. May as well drink it up. Won't have to worry about a hang-over! I appreciate the hospitable invitation.

[Opyelie]

Originally Posted by HappyTexan

Nukes..I'm not preparing. Get a six-pack and sit on the porch savoring my last moments.
I don't know that I want to be a survivor of a nuclear war.

I'm with you...............not sure I'd want to be a "survivor" either

[jim9251]

Oh heck I'll do everything I can to survive. I wouldn't give up or not want to live, that's crazy. But I can see millions of people, faced with the shock of nuclear war, just shutting down and wanting to die. Anyway living in the rocky mountains full of fresh water, game and fish would help. The biggest problem I would think would be nuclear winter.

Does anyone remember the movie The Day After? It followed a doctor in Kansas during and after a nuclear war. Carl Sagan said it was pretty darn close to what the real thing would be like.

[Mircea]

Originally Posted by jim9251

Does anyone remember the movie The Day After?

The propaganda film? Sure, I remember what garbage it was.

Originally Posted by jim9251

It followed a doctor in Kansas during and after a nuclear war. Carl Sagan said it was pretty darn close to what the real thing would be like.

Which Carl Sagan are you referring to, the Carl Sagan that stood on Jimmy Carter's desk in the Oval Office screaming and frothing at the mouth that glaciers would be rolling down Pennsylvania Avenue by the year 2000 because he was certain we were returning to an Ice Age, or would that be a different Carl Sagan?

Originally Posted by Christian for Israel

come on folks...say SOMETHING...

If you insist....

Originally Posted by Christian for Israel

just to let everybody know, i've been studying nuclear war effects and survival since the early 80's.

That's really sad. You've wasted 30 years of your life, because you don't understand anything about it.

Originally Posted by Christian for Israel

Radioactive fallout can be easily avoided, but if you choose to do nothing, it will cause you much suffering.

Which weapon produces more radioactive fallout, a 60 kt fission warhead or a 750 kt warhead?

The 60 kt warhead.

If you have to ask why, you didn't study enough.

Originally Posted by Christian for Israel

Today, because of improvements in the guidance systems, the warhead can land within FEET of it's target, and the large, heavy warhead has been replaced with several smaller warheads, each of which will go to a different target.

Strategic nuclear warheads don't "land."

That's a major mistake right there. Looks like you've been drinking out of His Excellency Colonel General Supreme Scientist Carl Sagan's cup.

Originally Posted by Christian for Israel

Most nuclear detonations will be at a height of a couple thousand feet or so.

Wrong again. Detonation will occur at 25 miles to 80 miles above the surface, not a few thousand feet. It's a matter physics.

If you have to ask why, you need to study more.

Originally Posted by Christian for Israel

The best way to stay healthy during a nuclear war is to stay away from target areas like cities, military bases, power stations, rail centers, and major ports.

That might actually be good advice for 1950s America, but as everyone can plainly see, this isn't 1950s America. No one lives in cities and there are no factories on the cities. The population lives on the periphery and the factories are usually located outside the beltway.

There are a few cities that still fit the bill, like Los Angeles, Chicago and New York.

Originally Posted by Christian for Israel

The next thing is to recognize that you probably live downwind of at least one target area, and plan accordingly. This means building some kind of shelter, and understanding what will happen after a nuclear attack.

Not likely. The best course of action would be to detonate 4-6 MIRVs about 400 kt each at 60-80 miles above the surface then sit back and watch as a 15-state area is reduced to the Stone Age by electromagnetic pulse.

Be kind of stupid to kill Americans when they'll be killing themselves for food and medicine and damn near everything else.

And assuming the war ends at the exact moment the warheads are detonated, it would be 10-12 years before an agrarian based economy emerged.

Originally Posted by Christian for Israel

When building a shelter, as with any other form of preparedness, we hope for the best but prepare for the worst. In this case we prepare as if we are downwind of a ground burst, with lot's of deadly fallout on it's way.

You spent 30 freaking years studying this and you still don't understand that it takes a nominal-sized particle (about 48 microns) an hour to fall 2,000 feet?

Well, I think that says it all.

Of course, that's assuming the detonation was a ground-burst. Anything detonated over 12 miles will sail around the Earth for decades before finally hitting Earth, and by then (if you apply the Rule of 7) it won't be very harmful.

The issue in a nuclear with ICBMs and SLBMs is not fallout, it's safety and security.

As I said, you'll be instantly relegated to the Stone Age. Well, actually worse than that. The governments at all levels will be in no position to collect taxes, and it doesn't matter since no one will be working.

I mean you can hand out paper and pencil to the clerks at Krogers or Alberts or Aldi's and they can record transactions as long as there is an inventory, and once the inventory is gone, it will not be replaced for at least a decade.

You'll have to learn to farm and milk cows and goats and eat wren's livers and wolf nipple chips, and learn how to ride horses and build carts and use bicycles, because that'll be your only form of transportation.

A quasi-Feudal System will emerge. The person who has power and charisma and can organize a small armed security force that is mobile (on horseback) will take over and run the local area. You'll be working for that person for quite a while.

If things hold true, and they probably will, everyone will be in shock for the first few days, and they'll cooperate and be friendly and there won't be any violence except in the usual areas by the usual suspects.

However, once the shock wears off, and people realize there's no more food and there ain't gonna be any more food, and you have to start hauling water out of rivers, lakes, streams, creeks and ponds then things will get really nasty and everyone will turn on everyone else.

As I said, security first, then safety, then food and water.

Best to organize on your street. Get with the families on your street and organize a plan. Someone's home will be the military headquarters and another home will be the administrative center.

Another place should be selected for the "last stand."

Start organizing details. Gather fire wood for winter and for cooking and cleaning.

Send a 5-man fire team out with a group on bicycles and start rounding up as many animals as you can. Horses and cows.

Have another groups start clearing a field to plant crops like wheat/corn, and another field for fallow/pastures for your horses and cows.

Make sure you have unimpeded access to water anyway you can, even if you have to dig a ditch or improvise an aqueduct to get it to you. It would be best if someone had a well dug now, assuming there's any water to be had. You don't have to worry about contamination and even if that was a concern, it would take decades to leach into an aquifer (and your local university probably has a hydrology section in the geology department that shows the aquifers and more importantly, the flow rate which will be in meters/year -- that's right it moves really really slow -- and the direction of flow).

Have a security group go around and set up early warning devices of whatever kind you can to detect intruders early so you can locate and kill them quickly.

If you're going to go it alone, you won't make it for any number of reasons, primarily the psychology of it. Your kids and wife couldn't handle it. Small groups of 40 to 100 people would be ideal.

[henry1]

h every one who i knows builds shelter for a liveing breaks down in the area of three or four thing as follows that must protect the people inside the shelter for the Utah shelter people are the best in my book and will allways tell people to go them first over anyone else ..

EMP from the nuclear weapon going off to keep the basic items that are powered by a socalled electric enegry power system ..that why a lot of shelter have what is known as a throw away battie bank or power system to let the nuclear device going off destory that system and saveing the other system inside the shelter for a later time frame ..

BLAST wave from the two sources

-x-Air or overhead bust

for the air one is as this type of blast with a large fire ball type blast from the air blast that goes up into the area of the upper levels of the earth atmostphere ..this one is the best for it will cover a larger area with more radiation and the so called emp effect of the device going off ..


x-ground one is as this type of blast the ground wave is second type of blast that you deal with where nuclear device has hit the ground then going off ..this a old way of doing things for the air bust of the device going off is a lot better for it covers a larger area..

the reason behind the ground blast is more of a personal area to make sure the country was totaly destoryed and the area could never be used again like in the cold war when the russian target major citys over the fact never let us use them again as there way of thinking at the time .

this one has the most of the effect called the ground slap as the enegry of the blasts travel through the earth ground and in the pathway of the blast enegry the blast wave destorys the building and other things in path the wave of energry and heat and other parts of the nuclear device going on at a ground level ..

go and look at areas in the State of Neveda where they did ground blast test and look how the land looked before and after the test to give you a basic idea about the effect of a ground wave going through the blast site area and the damage it does on the land ..

Thermal effects of a nuclear device going off

Thernal effect of the blast wave it basically wild fire and it going to destory every thing in it path with the pressures wave of heat and fires from the device going off in it path ..

Radiation effects of a nuclear device going off

is the socalled three diff types of radiation that the bomb has produce as folllows
Alpha
Beta
Gramma

the Alpha and Beta are can be block by a few inchs of dirt but the Gramma is the most deadly of the radiation for it the real killer in the long term expouser to the effects of the nuclear blast going off ..


that way all shelters have what is called a 90 degree turn in them to keep gramma radiation out of the shelter ..with the entances are placed in a way to max out the effects of the device

in shelter building most shelters have a two 90.degree turns in them to keep out the radiation out of the shelter body ..

most shelters are placed at the depth of 10 ft or more ..the reason behind it that the shelter body has to be covered to at least the dirt depth of 1o ft or more ..

also peagravel is used in what is known as earth arching to proctect the shelter from the ground wave slap as it comes from the device inpact on the earth ..

so iam right or wrong

[Barking Spider]

Mircea kind of said it all.

[stevej64]

put your head between your legs and kiss your arse goodbye

[jim9251]

Originally Posted by Mircea

The propaganda film? Sure, I remember what garbage it was.

Really? A 1983 movie was propaganda? Ok.

[henry1]

here is the $.64.dollar question are sure the person called Micrea is right about the info in his above post ..this is not a personal attack in shape or form it a simple question of getting the right info out to the people about the nuclear warfare ..it is a basic question of do you take the info with a grain of salt or take it all the way .. ..for remember this statement about nuclear warfare ..it takes only one bomb to ruin your day ..

remember this also info is only good as the personal giving you the info who has the knowage and the know how of how a nuclear weapon is going off is going to effect you in your own area where you live ..if live in the middle of nowhere it going to diff than a person who lives in the middle of a large city or a small city ..that why it is very inportant that you as the person read up on nuclear warfare ..most of the info on it old and outdated on both sides of the world because of the fact a nuclear weapon has not gone off in anger or testing now for a while..so most of the data out there is little outdated at the time .. ..

plus i be more worry about a dirty type of device than a full scale attack with the useage of a nuclear weapon or a emp attack where the bad guys knocked out the grid useing air burst emp attack instead of a nuclear weapon ..

i trained for years in my job in the military for full scale NBC warfare and can i remember all the details and other things i was taught to point yes and to point no do i remember them all ..

so go and read a few books on the subect of nuclear warfare and come to your own ideas about it ..

[BigJon3475]

Originally Posted by Barking Spider

Mircea kind of said it all.

Or they could read the 208 page report here:

http://www.empcommission.org/docs/A2...ission-7MB.pdf

(I kinda like Mircea's)