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How will a longarm that you aint GOT with you be of any help to you, if shtf? Do you really think that looters will actually LET you go trade your xbow, pellet rifle, .22, bolt-action centerfire or shotgun for the fighting rifle you really need to be carrying at all times, if shtf? The shotgun is too short-ranged, the bolt-action is too slow for repeat shots, the .22 is lacking in stopping power, the pellet gun is a joke against men and the xbow aint much better, either.
If you are serious about shtf survival, you have to look at the .22lr conversion units for 223 fighting rifles, like the AR-15, the Mini-14 Ruger and the AK clones. they cost $150 from Ciener firearms, and take but 20 seconds to swap into or out of a 223 rifle. They weigh but 3/4 lb, so they are quite feasible to carry along with your fighing rifle, and they group 2" or better at 50 yds, so they are plenty accurate enough for foraging game. The 223, using good softpoints, takes deer every bit as well as the 30-30 ever did. Get the 60 gr Nosler Partition softpoints, for deep penetration.
You also have to buy or make an effective sound suppressor for your fighting rifle (see Mod Note). At the very least, you must have a silenced .22 autopistol for foraging, while you carry a 223 autorifle for defense, because that is the caliber which the N. Guard armories have billions of rds of. Those armories don't have a single rd of AK ammo, and very little of match grade 308. the 308 ball that they do have is intended for use in belt fed machineguns. It is not accurate enough to let the 308 user outreach a 223 user, at all. It will miss men a lot at a mere 400 yds, because it groups only 3" at 100 yds.
Mod Note: Be aware that firearm silencers/suppressors are strictly regulated in the US by the National Firearms Act. Manufacture, sale and possession of a suppressor without proper licensing and taxes is considered a federal felony and is banned in many states.
Last edited by MissingAll4Seasons; 07-27-2011 at 09:31 AM..
Reason: Added regulation warning
How will a longarm that you aint GOT with you be of any help to you, if shtf? Do you really think that looters will actually LET you go trade your xbow, pellet rifle, .22, bolt-action centerfire or shotgun for the fighting rifle you really need to be carrying at all times, if shtf? The shotgun is too short-ranged, the bolt-action is too slow for repeat shots, the .22 is lacking in stopping power, the pellet gun is a joke against men and the xbow aint much better, either. Good
If you are serious about shtf survival, you have to look at the .22lr conversion units for 223 fighting rifles, like the AR-15, the Mini-14 Ruger and the AK clones. they cost $150 from Ciener firearms, and take but 20 seconds to swap into or out of a 223 rifle. No. 20 seconds in an ambush = your dead. They weigh but 3/4 lb, so they are quite feasible to carry along with your fighing rifle, and they group 2" or better at 50 yds, so they are plenty accurate enough for foraging game. The 223, using good softpoints, takes deer every bit as well as the 30-30 ever did. Get the 60 gr Nosler Partition softpoints, for deep penetration.
You also have to buy or make an effective sound suppressor for your fighting rifle. Yes At the very least, you must have a silenced .22 autopistol for foraging, Yeswhile you carry a 223 autorifle for defense, because that is the caliber which the N. Guard armories have billions of rds of.Actually no. they (By regulations, unless they are within a couple weeks of going to the range) are regulated to 200 rounds of 9mm 'security rounds' Those armories don't have a single rd of AK ammo, and very little of match grade 308. the 308 ball that they do have is intended for use in belt fed machineguns. That's not in it ether. It is not accurate enough to let the 308 user outreach a 223 user, at all. False, but nonpertanant b/cit's not there. It will miss men a lot at a mere 400 yds, because it groups only 3" at 100 yds.
By the regs: The M16, AK, and M1 are ALL 4MOA rifles...
JMHO:
Suppressed Folding stocked AK or FAL
Glock 9mm
Glock 9mm with .22 Conversion and suppressor.
(Advantage arms is VERY light)
How will a longarm that you aint GOT with you be of any help to you, if shtf? Do you really think that looters will actually LET you go trade your xbow, pellet rifle, .22, bolt-action centerfire or shotgun for the fighting rifle you really need to be carrying at all times, if shtf? The shotgun is too short-ranged, the bolt-action is too slow for repeat shots, the .22 is lacking in stopping power, the pellet gun is a joke against men and the xbow aint much better, either.
If you are serious about shtf survival, you have to look at the .22lr conversion units for 223 fighting rifles, like the AR-15, the Mini-14 Ruger and the AK clones. they cost $150 from Ciener firearms, and take but 20 seconds to swap into or out of a 223 rifle. They weigh but 3/4 lb, so they are quite feasible to carry along with your fighing rifle, and they group 2" or better at 50 yds, so they are plenty accurate enough for foraging game. The 223, using good softpoints, takes deer every bit as well as the 30-30 ever did. Get the 60 gr Nosler Partition softpoints, for deep penetration.
You also have to buy or make an effective sound suppressor for your fighting rifle. At the very least, you must have a silenced .22 autopistol for foraging, while you carry a 223 autorifle for defense, because that is the caliber which the N. Guard armories have billions of rds of. Those armories don't have a single rd of AK ammo, and very little of match grade 308. the 308 ball that they do have is intended for use in belt fed machineguns. It is not accurate enough to let the 308 user outreach a 223 user, at all. It will miss men a lot at a mere 400 yds, because it groups only 3" at 100 yds.
strange, my military ball ammo makes 3" groups at 500 meters, so i dont know what you are talking about. also, suggesting to people to buy or make a sound suppessor or silencer is illegal and can constitute a federal felony.
Silencers are NFA and have to be registered plus a $200 tax paid. Some states ban them.
As for the OP, if you don't live in the big urban areas, you shouldn't have hordes of looters everywhere you go. Rural areas are the places to be.
In a disaster where the government is supposedly disfunctional, rural areas will fill up pretty quickly with people looking for food. Assuming otherwise is thinking that the city dwellers are all dumb and blind - trust me, they'll look around and say, hey, aren't there farms just 10 miles out? After looting those they will say, hey, what's just behind that hill? Et cetera, et cetera...
strange, my military ball ammo makes 3" groups at 500 meters, so i dont know what you are talking about. also, suggesting to people to buy or make a sound suppessor or silencer is illegal and can constitute a federal felony.
$200 tax and some paperwork and in most states you can ether make or buy one.
And if your Military ball makes 3 inch groups at 500 meters you need to turn me onto that Lake City!
B/c it's less than 1 MOA and there are target shooters who are going to wonder where you are getting it from!
$200 tax and some paperwork and in most states you can ether make or buy one.
And if your Military ball makes 3 inch groups at 500 meters you need to turn me onto that Lake City!
B/c it's less than 1 MOA and there are target shooters who are going to wonder where you are getting it from!
It is not hard to get 3 inch groups with military ball at 500 meters, just practice, practice and more practice. the only match rounds I have on hand are for my Remington 700 in 7.62x51. I have over 30k rounds through my M1A and still believe that I have not practiced enough. I was also lucky enough to have a gentleman that lives 2 doors down from me that was in WWII that showed me a thing or 2 I did not know about shooting. it helped alot.
as far as the tax stamp goes i know that, but suggesting it to others and not mentioning the tax stamp from f-troop can constitute a federal felony.
edited: My military ball is not lake city, it is british.
Last edited by monkeywrenching; 07-27-2011 at 08:05 AM..
Reason: edited to add
It is not hard to get 3 inch groups with military ball at 500 meters, just practice, practice and more practice. the only match rounds I have on hand are for my Remington 700 in 7.62x51. I have over 30k rounds through my M1A and still believe that I have not practiced enough. I was also lucky enough to have a gentleman that lives 2 doors down from me that was in WWII that showed me a thing or 2 I did not know about shooting. it helped alot.
as far as the tax stamp goes i know that, but suggesting it to others and not mentioning the tax stamp from f-troop can constitute a federal felony.
edited: My military ball is not lake city, it is british.
Interesting, Radway Green as a rule is more underpowered than LC, and while not bad, is not renowned for it's accuracy.
In NH you can buy factory made suppressors, my son has one he shares with several .22's
I don't worry a bit of 500 meters as I can't see 50 feet in my woods. All NH is that way.
I kinda got lost on the point as the title says one thing and the OP says another. I can carry a long gun folded AK with a pig sticker all day long. With that in a holster i can carry my WW-2 vintage Remington Rand Colt clone. But I will still hunt with flintlocks, and so will carry up to 3 guns at one given time.
With a propane fired genny, and a full blown machine shop I can mill out a suppressor after the shtf and pay nothing That genny runs the shop and the house now anytime the power is out anyway. That gennie runs everything as if the power were on. Running the genny would be rather limited and for a real good reason in shtf.
OP, if you really believe a bolt action rifle is too slow for repeat shots then you don't know squat about running a bolt rifle. That is really I'll I need to know to understand that the rest of your post belongs over with the other testosterone filled know-nothings at ar15 or glocktalk. Stick around and read to learn but enough of the really silly threads you've been starting. Please, stop embarrasing yourself.
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That genny runs the shop and the house now anytime the power is out anyway. That gennie runs everything as if the power were on. Running the genny would be rather limited and for a real good reason in shtf.
