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How do you all see a food crisis unfolding? Are you talking about just a temporary power outage? If not, what is the scenario you are seriously contemplating, and what kinds of "signs" or events will kick it off?
Ah. There are several scenarios that one could postulate.
1)Weather changes that cause the price of food to escalate. The less there is, the more expensive it is, and the poorer quality it is.
2) Fuel prices going up. The more expensive it is to ship things - and most grocery stores buy from the big warehouses, who in turn buy from all over the country as well as overseas - the more expensive food will be.
3)"Links in the chain" failures. The drought in TX, KS, and OK has caused the hay crops to fail. The cattle that are raised there need hay for the winter. Most of our hay in NE has already been sold, not only to local ranchers but to be shipped to other states that need it. The shipping costs have to factor in - it costs about $3000.00 to truck a full load of hay bales 300 miles, not including the price of the hay. How many cattle do you have, and how much hay will they need, and would it be better to sell the cows now or try to overwinter them? If they sell them now, there will be a glut on the market and the price will go down; next spring there may be no beef to be had from these areas, and the price will go up. This is just one example. Food is perishable; no matter if it is frozen or GMO'ed to last, it can only last so long.
4) Commodities playas. There are all sorts of people investing in the commodities markets, many with no earthly clue of a) how to invest or b) how to follow the market on commodities. If there is, say, a drought in Brazil, then coffee investors will buy up all of the Brazilian coffee futures to sell at a higher price later. Playas keep the markets high (just like they do in fuel) by buying and selling the futures at ever-increasing gambles and heights. If the FedGov decides to stop subsidizing food costs, from the farm to the store, all bets are off and food prices will jump astronomically as well. (There are a lot of ins-and-outs to commodities buying and selling that most folks - especially newbies - don't grasp.This is just a very brief example of how the market can be warped and played.)
5. A pandemic or other disaster. Food is one of the most important supplies in any disaster; food transportation is interrupted (either the truck drivers are too ill to drive or won't go into a pandemic area) and folks in a disaster - especially the unprepared ones - go into a panic-buyiing spree, cleaning out shelves in hours. Food riots ensue when the food is gone and no more is coming in. Outside of the disaster area, 'helping' agencies are buying truckloads of food at premium prices to ship in to the devastated area (not everything is donated, and rarely is it enough, which is why the Red Cross will say they prefer monetary donations) "Helpers" have to be fed as well as those afflicted by the disaster. A widespread pandemic or disaster mans that there is no one coming in, for days, weeks, maybe months, to help. And - maybe never, if the disaster afflicts enough people.
Signs? We are already seeing signs. Last year, 2.6 million more Americans descended into poverty. That was the largest increase that we have seen since the US government began keeping statistics on this back in 1959. It isn’t just the ranks of the “very poor” that are rising. The number of those just considered to be “poor” is rapidly increasing as well. Back in the year 2000, 11.3% of all Americans were living in poverty. Today, 15.1% of all Americans are living in poverty. More than 20 million US children rely on school meal programs to keep from going hungry.One out of every six elderly Americans now lives below the federal poverty line. Today, there are over 45 million Americans on food stamps. According to The Wall Street Journal, nearly 15 percent of all Americans are now on food stamps. In 2010, 42 percent of all single mothers in the United States were on food stamps. The number of Americans on food stamps has increased 74% since 2007.
What happens when the perfect storm of government failure to provide, food shortages, transportation costs, dependencies on foreign food imports,and a pandemic, natural, or man-made disaster strikes on a large scale? Or even a small one that can escalate?
Ah. There are several scenarios that one could postulate.
1)Weather changes that cause the price of food to escalate. The less there is, the more expensive it is, and the poorer quality it is.
2) Fuel prices going up. The more expensive it is to ship things - and most grocery stores buy from the big warehouses, who in turn buy from all over the country as well as overseas - the more expensive food will be.
3)"Links in the chain" failures. The drought in TX, KS, and OK has caused the hay crops to fail. The cattle that are raised there need hay for the winter. Most of our hay in NE has already been sold, not only to local ranchers but to be shipped to other states that need it. The shipping costs have to factor in - it costs about $3000.00 to truck a full load of hay bales 300 miles, not including the price of the hay. How many cattle do you have, and how much hay will they need, and would it be better to sell the cows now or try to overwinter them? If they sell them now, there will be a glut on the market and the price will go down; next spring there may be no beef to be had from these areas, and the price will go up. This is just one example. Food is perishable; no matter if it is frozen or GMO'ed to last, it can only last so long.
4) Commodities playas. There are all sorts of people investing in the commodities markets, many with no earthly clue of a) how to invest or b) how to follow the market on commodities. If there is, say, a drought in Brazil, then coffee investors will buy up all of the Brazilian coffee futures to sell at a higher price later. Playas keep the markets high (just like they do in fuel) by buying and selling the futures at ever-increasing gambles and heights. If the FedGov decides to stop subsidizing food costs, from the farm to the store, all bets are off and food prices will jump astronomically as well. (There are a lot of ins-and-outs to commodities buying and selling that most folks - especially newbies - don't grasp.This is just a very brief example of how the market can be warped and played.)
5. A pandemic or other disaster. Food is one of the most important supplies in any disaster; food transportation is interrupted (either the truck drivers are too ill to drive or won't go into a pandemic area) and folks in a disaster - especially the unprepared ones - go into a panic-buyiing spree, cleaning out shelves in hours. Food riots ensue when the food is gone and no more is coming in. Outside of the disaster area, 'helping' agencies are buying truckloads of food at premium prices to ship in to the devastated area (not everything is donated, and rarely is it enough, which is why the Red Cross will say they prefer monetary donations) "Helpers" have to be fed as well as those afflicted by the disaster. A widespread pandemic or disaster mans that there is no one coming in, for days, weeks, maybe months, to help. And - maybe never, if the disaster afflicts enough people.
Signs? We are already seeing signs. Last year, 2.6 million more Americans descended into poverty. That was the largest increase that we have seen since the US government began keeping statistics on this back in 1959. It isn’t just the ranks of the “very poor†that are rising. The number of those just considered to be “poor†is rapidly increasing as well. Back in the year 2000, 11.3% of all Americans were living in poverty. Today, 15.1% of all Americans are living in poverty. More than 20 million US children rely on school meal programs to keep from going hungry.One out of every six elderly Americans now lives below the federal poverty line. Today, there are over 45 million Americans on food stamps. According to The Wall Street Journal, nearly 15 percent of all Americans are now on food stamps. In 2010, 42 percent of all single mothers in the United States were on food stamps. The number of Americans on food stamps has increased 74% since 2007.
What happens when the perfect storm of government failure to provide, food shortages, transportation costs, dependencies on foreign food imports,and a pandemic, natural, or man-made disaster strikes on a large scale? Or even a small one that can escalate?
if the goverment promises to feed the poor through foodstamps or some other program, and then all of a sudden they go bankrupt and cannot do what they say, what do you think the poor and others will do to the goverment.
when goverment fails the people they are supposed to be serving, that is when you get goverment change, and I sure as heck do not think either the democrats nor the republicans will like that change, especially when they get tossed out on their butts and no longer have any power at all.
if the goverment promises to feed the poor through foodstamps or some other program, and then all of a sudden they go bankrupt and cannot do what they say, what do you think the poor and others will do to the goverment.
Actual hungry people don't cause problems. If they're starving they won't have the strength. But expect the government to put their interests ahead of people who perform productive labor. The poor, better called the welfare class, are reliable government supporters. Consider even this. People who riot, people who commit crimes are strong supporters of the government. They, their families, and their society receive government support in return for their votes. I'd wager everything I own that a poll taken in any prison would show strong support for any welfare program and any proposed government expansion..
There's an even more dangerous group, government employees. There are twenty-two million employees of the federal government, all of whom prosper regardless of the state of the economy. They've been the most successful group in the last five years. I don't know how many additional retired government employees there are; but rest assured that they won't suffer. Career government employees (I'll never call them workers) are unabashedly running the government for their own benefit.
Now consider the millions of state and local government employees. Be assured that Officer Friendly feels more comraderie with the man driving the street sweeper for the city than he does with anyone at any level in private industry.
The ranks of productive citizens shrink; the ranks of those who look to the government for their sustenance grow. Today's events dwarf the obscene expansion of the government under Franklin Roosevelt, an expansion that starved private business until the government needed them for the war to preserve Communism.
How do you all see a food crisis unfolding? Are you talking about just a temporary power outage? If not, what is the scenario you are seriously contemplating, and what kinds of "signs" or events will kick it off?
I see me wanting to eat today. And tomorrow, next week, next month, and HOPEFULLY next year.
How do you all see a food crisis unfolding? Are you talking about just a temporary power outage? If not, what is the scenario you are seriously contemplating, and what kinds of "signs" or events will kick it off?
Suggest you read through the entire thread as the answer to your question has been answered. There are several other threads in this subforum dealing with food storage and "crisis" as well.
Food/water are among the most basic needs which must be met for survival. Is it really prudent to take them for granted?
Suggest you read through the entire thread as the answer to your question has been answered. There are several other threads in this subforum dealing with food storage and "crisis" as well.
Food/water are among the most basic needs which must be met for survival. Is it really prudent to take them for granted?
I bolded the above as food for thought...
"water". How many are on city water ? You depend on the city to send you clean fresh water.
We now read about cities going bankrupt.
There are also articles about cities being behind in their payments ..some up to a year.
With this "recession" going on 4 years old, how much longer can cities stay solvent on declining revenues ?
"water". How many are on city water ? You depend on the city to send you clean fresh water.
We now read about cities going bankrupt.
There are also articles about cities being behind in their payments ..some up to a year.
With this "recession" going on 4 years old, how much longer can cities stay solvent on declining revenues ?
Has anyone noticed besides me that cities are selling their bankrupt water, sewer, and other infrastructure resources to Chinese "corporations" - i.e, the Chinese government?
If you didn't like melamine in your food, wonder how strict they will be about your water supply...
Has anyone noticed besides me that cities are selling their bankrupt water, sewer, and other infrastructure resources to Chinese "corporations" - i.e, the Chinese government?
When the San Francisco Bay area had a severe drought about thirty years ago, there were severe water shortages over the region. Lawn watering was forbidden. People were adjured not to flush their toilets in San Francisco. There was a panic everywhere there, well no not quite everywhere. San Jose was doing just fine. People could flush their toilets every time. Lawns were green and verdant. Can you guess why?
San Jose Waterworks, a private utility company, was providing the water. They had employees who were required to perform, to produce. Needless to say, they had made sure that they had adequate water supplies long before the drought. Some of their stockholders were American, some European, some from the Orient. It hardly mattered, did it? The US Dollar is fungible.
Did the government compensate businesses and homeowners for landscaping costs to restore their lawns and gardens? But if a private company had done this you know that their lawmakers and courts would have so decreed.
American capitalists have a long history of success. The American government does not. We've been attracting European investment capital since colonial times. Now the Chinese can take their turn. Plenty of foreigners were skinned, but plenty more made money.
Rich folks invest whether they're of the English nobility or the Chinese merchant class. They don't care about politics; they want money. Therefore I say, "Welcome! Welcome! Welcome! This is capitalist America! Get a piece of the action!"
Has anyone noticed besides me that cities are selling their bankrupt water, sewer, and other infrastructure resources to Chinese "corporations" - i.e, the Chinese government?
If you didn't like melamine in your food, wonder how strict they will be about your water supply...
Do you have a link? I thought most municiplaities had public bond offerings (usually tax free within the state in regard to earnings) for such financing. Are you suggesting they are outright selling the utilities to the Chinese or that the Chinese are buying some of these bonds on the open market?
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