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I believe in polite discussion, and many have responded in a courteous manner. There are many ways to post an opposing view without engaging in a personal attack. It's called debate in civilized society, and it can be done without becoming defensive (or in this case, offensive).
No intent to be "offensive" here, but I know very well that you can see the rhetorical nature and the "offensive" tactics used in this sentence, since you constructed it:
Really, that kind of emotional turmoil will kill you faster than any marauders roaming the countryside in some imagined catastrophe that might happen.
It's rhetorically loaded: "emotional turmoil," implying that preppers are, by nature, emotionally unbalanced; "marauders roaming the countryside" implying that preppers are engaged in some kind of feudal Dungeons and Dragons sort of fantasy; "imagined catastrophe," implying that the idea of bad events of whatever sort is nothing more than a wild imagination in overdrive.
Need I mention the rhetorical term, "Glass Houses"?
I have been hearing these scenarios (and watching people plan for them) since the 1950's. I know of at least two hidden "fallout shelters" on Long Island. I went through grammar school enduring endless duck and cover drills, which were simply absurd. I would rather live my life to the fullest without this dark cloud that seems to threaten so many people's emotional well-being than worry over the endless possibilities. Really, that kind of emotional turmoil will kill you faster than any marauders roaming the countryside in some imagined catastrophe that might happen. And who wants to be one of the few survivors of a true Armageddon?
OP, chance favors the prepared. Some people will take any chance that comes along to survive. If you choose to check out that is your choice. Don't disparage others that prefer the former.
Jenny, there are many types all lumped under one category. because there is no real definition or meaning to the different types of people who are involved in these issues, one man's prepper is another man's militia, and one man's malitia is another man's survivalist, and one mans survilavist is another man's prepper..... I have a good friend I;ve known for years who's involved in this issue and even he keeps his distance in discussing items using what we may think are common terminology or items but can run the gamout of meanings to so many different people. Like I pointed out above, a person may see themself as a "prepper" while others may see a "wacko militia man". and I have met some wacko survivaliist malitia who do not consider people prepping for events as being real like them if they don't own 4,000 guns and 384,896 round of amuunition (even those those wackos have no food or water in storage). Likewise I know some preppers who stop short of dealing with the all out life ending events since to them the odds are too small you will survive so they put the effort in what they think is survivable.
basically, yes there are many weirdos running around playing survivalist who are doing it just to PLAY survivalist. They are not the same as people who are preparing for survival who have a well developed plan. And they may or may not be preparing for the life ending events based on their own personal beliefs. So when you see someone digging a whole inthe back yard filling it with Spam and guns and duct-tape and plastic, don;t automatically assume that the person down the block who also is prepearing are the same types.
Now, I am not a prepper or a survivalist or a militia man, or a doomsdayer, or (insert latest phrase here). But I have taken my friends advice to heart. besides the end of world scenerio, there are huindreds of more likely local to regional to country scenerios that may make you want to think about the basics. My friend said that the odds are that at somepoint in your life an event will occur that forces you to scramble for everyday living. It could be a tronado, a wildfire, a hurricane, a tusnami. Even a derailedtrain with toxic chemicalss can distrupt some basic everyday function. I have lived ON hawaii and in other places in the rim of fire, and I have lived through tusanmis and earthquakes and a volcanic erruption. None were the tragic events you see on TV, but they all disrupted some form of basic services for hours and weeks. Now ask yourself, if there was an event, and the supply chain was disrupted, how do you think things will go as food and basic needs dissapear off the shelves? If you did not have to worry about that, wouldn;t hat make life during those times just a bit less worrisome?
I will be the first to admit that yes, there are lots of wackjobs running around declaring themselves preppers or survivalist or whatever even though they have about a 10% of of surviving a day cause its all a fanstay play date game. They are playing a game and engaging in role playing. Yes some of them have appeared on shows and had their stuff showcased even though true professionals give them little chance of surviving. They are doing it for the planning and the feeling of power, but reality is most will be the frist to get bonked because its just a "fashion accessory" in their life. Don;t let those wack jobs and false preparrers be seen as reality.
I have been hearing these scenarios (and watching people plan for them) since the 1950's. I know of at least two hidden "fallout shelters" on Long Island.
Yeah, so?
Do you also have a crystal ball that will give you sufficient advance warning to get to the shelter before a 750 kt warhead detonates?
Countries don't give warning prior to attack. Warnings are not part of Russian or Chinese military doctrine (but surprise and speed is -- same is true for Israel).
And what fallout?
What moron would detonate a perfectly good 750 kt warhead below 30 miles?
The function and purpose of strategic nuclear weapons is to kill/injure as many people as possible, and cause destruction and damage on the largest scale possible.
So, again, what moron would detonate a 750 kt warhead at 5,000 feet in a city like Chicago? Okay, so it kills 200,000 people. Big deal. Detonate at 30 miles and you'll nail about 8 Million people.
It's spherical geometry. I guess they don't require that in school any more. Anyway, unless you have prior knowledge of the attack and can take adequate shelter in time, this is what 4 psi over-pressure will do to your chest and abdomen:
That little white blob is all of your jellied organs (which are no longer functioning by the way -- sucks to be that).
And what fallout? I guess they don't teach Earth Sciences anymore in school. The Stratosphere starts at about 11 miles. A 750 kt warhead will have a 30 kt plutonium trigger, and that is the only thing that will produce fallout, which will be moving at 80 mph - 200+ mph in the Stratosphere and be well dispersed so as to pose no problems when it finally starts hitting ground about 80 hours later a few thousand miles downwind (and you calculate and plot based on 30 kt and not 750 kt like the Federation of Ass-Clown Scientists would do).
Quote:
Originally Posted by jenny1951
I would rather live my life to the fullest without this dark cloud that seems to threaten so many people's emotional well-being than worry over the endless possibilities.
And you cannot do both? Why not? I live life to the fullest and I already have a plan. It isn't like people are scheming 24/7 like some ass-munch internet gamer plays World of Warcraft or something.
I occasionally pick up a few pointers now and again, like monitoring wells. It took me like 30 seconds to incorporate that into a plan.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jenny1951
Really, that kind of emotional turmoil will kill you faster than any marauders roaming the countryside in some imagined catastrophe that might happen.
What emotional turmoil?
Imagined catastrophe? Like the 1859 Carrington Event? That is not imagination, it actually happened, and it is guaranteed to happen again, quite possibly in the life-times of people posting now on this forum.
About 30 miles south of Winslow, Arizona is Meteor Crater.
This is North Carolina:
That happened 11,000 years ago. Asteroid broke up hit Canada, the US, southern Africa and Antarctica near the Ross Sea where the western ice sheet sits. Caused a global tsunami which is retold in myths world-wide as "the Flood."
Ended the Ice Age and started the present Inter-Glacial Period. It also killed off all of the mastodons, wooly mammoths, giant bears, giant sloths and saber tooth tigers (and a few others).
That will happen again, too, guaranteed. The only question is "When?" (not "If").
Quote:
Originally Posted by jenny1951
And who wants to be one of the few survivors of a true Armageddon?
I do.
I have great genes. A little seeding action would strength the gene pool tremendously.
You're exactly the kind of person we don't want around, and lucky for us people like you won't last long anyone.
Maybe we'll engrave all of your names on a plaque to memorialize your sacrificial stupidity (once we can get bronze smelting going again) and stick it next to the loo or something.
Jenny, there are many types all lumped under one category. because there is no real definition or meaning to the different types of people who are involved in these issues, one man's prepper is another man's militia, and one man's malitia is another man's survivalist, and one mans survilavist is another man's prepper..... I have a good friend I;ve known for years who's involved in this issue and even he keeps his distance in discussing items using what we may think are common terminology or items but can run the gamout of meanings to so many different people. Like I pointed out above, a person may see themself as a "prepper" while others may see a "wacko militia man". and I have met some wacko survivaliist malitia who do not consider people prepping for events as being real like them if they don't own 4,000 guns and 384,896 round of amuunition (even those those wackos have no food or water in storage). Likewise I know some preppers who stop short of dealing with the all out life ending events since to them the odds are too small you will survive so they put the effort in what they think is survivable.
basically, yes there are many weirdos running around playing survivalist who are doing it just to PLAY survivalist. They are not the same as people who are preparing for survival who have a well developed plan. And they may or may not be preparing for the life ending events based on their own personal beliefs. So when you see someone digging a whole inthe back yard filling it with Spam and guns and duct-tape and plastic, don;t automatically assume that the person down the block who also is prepearing are the same types.
Now, I am not a prepper or a survivalist or a militia man, or a doomsdayer, or (insert latest phrase here). But I have taken my friends advice to heart. besides the end of world scenerio, there are huindreds of more likely local to regional to country scenerios that may make you want to think about the basics. My friend said that the odds are that at somepoint in your life an event will occur that forces you to scramble for everyday living. It could be a tronado, a wildfire, a hurricane, a tusnami. Even a derailedtrain with toxic chemicalss can distrupt some basic everyday function. I have lived ON hawaii and in other places in the rim of fire, and I have lived through tusanmis and earthquakes and a volcanic erruption. None were the tragic events you see on TV, but they all disrupted some form of basic services for hours and weeks. Now ask yourself, if there was an event, and the supply chain was disrupted, how do you think things will go as food and basic needs dissapear off the shelves? If you did not have to worry about that, wouldn;t hat make life during those times just a bit less worrisome?
I will be the first to admit that yes, there are lots of wackjobs running around declaring themselves preppers or survivalist or whatever even though they have about a 10% of of surviving a day cause its all a fanstay play date game. They are playing a game and engaging in role playing. Yes some of them have appeared on shows and had their stuff showcased even though true professionals give them little chance of surviving. They are doing it for the planning and the feeling of power, but reality is most will be the frist to get bonked because its just a "fashion accessory" in their life. Don;t let those wack jobs and false preparrers be seen as reality.
Great post, thank you. It is also an example of how to respond without hostility.
No hostility intended...the people who post on this forum have a right to believe as they wish. Many of us have contacts that you do not have. Many of us take the time to seek out news items that are not on the TV stations. Most of us are not "whack jobs". Most of us believe that we are in an unsustainable indebtedness that will cause a financial meltdown within a few years (if not sooner) and the gov't will not be there or have the funds to save us (even if we were of a mind to take gov't money, which most of us are not). This financial situation is the direct or indirect cause of many of the worrisome political events that are playing out now. To ignore all this is, in our opinion, a fool-hardy thing to do. But that's just our opinion.
Now you are entitled to your opinion as well. Nobody is going over to the forums where you spend your time posting, and telling you that you're all wrong, that your opinion is crazy, that you have no right to live the life you do, or whatever. We would never dream of doing that. I guess the question in everyone's mind here goes something like, "why is she coming here to argue a point of view that we quite obviously don't share???". Y'know, like going to the DNC and claiming that Romney is the best man for the job! You'd quickly become persona non grata!
Like Pacific said, much is in the eye of the beholder. I consider myself an independent person rather than a prepper or a doomer.
I am a retired federal employee. (To some here I am considered a parasite and they are welcome to their opinion) Over my years of working for the fed I was witness to many continuing resolutions to keep the government working and several actual shutdowns where most of the people that make normal life run smoothly for all of us were furloughed for a time. Being an essential services employee, I was never part of that, but like Nor'Eastah I soon saw that what was happening will be unsustainable in the future. I realized that my retirement check may not come in the future (just like social security, disability, military pay and others) due to the debt load and new priorities. If one stops to consider how many people are dependent in some way on the federal, state or local government for all or part of their livelihoods and the current debt scenarios, the specter is concerning at the very least. All is well if our debt holders continue to play the game that they are also caught up in but it could all go south quicker and much more devastatingly than we can presently imagine. Think the depression of the 1930s on steroids because so very few of us are actually on the family farm as compared to that time.
I have a plan to at least be able to provide my family the basics in case of many emergencies, whether economic, weather/natural disaster related, supply line problems, etc. You can't plan for everything but I do my best to have the basics covered with Plan B and C waiting in the wings. I consider being a prepared person to be a socially responsible or patriotic act. I feel pride and great joy in the work that I do to provide for myself and in my everyday life. No emotion lability looming here. And as a side note: After eating our fresh food (that lasts eons with refrigeration) it's hard to eat the old and often tasteless produce that many groceries carry, so that alone has sold me.
You do what you like and what you feel is important to you and I won't criticize you. Like Nor'Eastah said, you can't expect to be heartily welcomed here after stereotyping the entire Preparedness board as doom and gloomers. FWIW.
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Some of us were Boy Scouts...
