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I have this argument with some good friends all of the time; they say that the government can't confiscate gold and never will again, I say that it can and will if it chooses. Had this same argument with other friends in the early 80's, as they were hoarding krugerrands. My gold collecting friends think that the price of gold will continue to rise, I say that the bottom will fall out just as it did in the 80's. It's all hype and emotional hyperbole. If you have a krugerrand and I have chickens, I will eat eggs and produce more chickens for meat. You can only trade that krugerrand for one chicken, or maybe just one egg - the seller sets the price, not the buyer, based on the buyer's need. There is a huge and potentially deadly difference between wealth and survival.
The American people are sheeple and easily led; all it took was for the media to say that the Weavers in ID or the Whackos in Waco were criminals and the public believed (and many still do) that the FBI and Federal Marshals were completely justified in their actions. In the mid-80's, when Social Services was demanding more money by saying, "Child abuse reports are up 10%!" and building their bureaucracy, people were in an outcry and an uproar - until it turned out that the SS agencies were illegally prosecuting those who were accused falsely without investigation. All of these incidents were trial runs to see how easily people would swallow "We'll protect you! It's for your own good!" - and many still believe that their government can and will protect them from anything, be it the 'evils' of Mormon children raised in multi-parent homes, or the 'evil' terrorists whom the government not only permits into our borders, but puts in high positions in the military.
Guns, gold, it doesn't matter - what the government wants from you it will take from you, and it will encourage your neighbors and friends and family to 'turn you in' so that everyone feels self-righteous and justified about it. Play your Wii and watch reruns of Survivor til your brains atrophy. The gubbermint will perteckt you from yourself as well as everyone around you. Sleep. Sleeeeeep.
Just for fun - hope this link works fo you - 1948 Cartoon
The goobermint will confiscate more than gold, trust me.
Some anit-gun zealots are proposing armories for hunting lovers. It's scary because it's not so far fetched. Basically, we'd store our huntin' rifles in our local armory and retrieve them when deer season comes around. Then return our firearms when the season closes.
I doubt there will be a door to door search for pistolas, but a "Cash for Glocks" program could be mainstream. It's already been done in some communities. Of course, it's under the guise of "Cash for Saturday Night Specials".
The goobermint can always ration ammo too. Never underestimate the power of the Liberal Elite.
Take a look at the various shooting supply businesses. See if you can find any bulk .22 ammo like the Remington 550 round bulk paks Or Winchester 500 round white boxes. There just isn't any .22 ammo out there. Forget WalMart. Their supply chain is empty.
Then think about what happened in Australia. Their government virtually eliminated civil rights overnight and the people said, "OK".
My gut feel is that its not a simple question ('could the Gov confiscate gold again if the dollar collapses') - and here's why:
My take is that if/when the dollar does collapse, people are making the assumption that all the structures of Gov and the infrastructures of 'society' will chug along just like before - allowing the Gov to turn to its lists of gold-owners and leisurely and systematically alert local state forces to go to each local PM stacker (precious metal hoarder) residence...
My take - is that when the dollar goes - it'll be like those cartoons of Wile E Coyote running off a cliff onto air, doing it for a few steps, before realizing there's nothing underneath, and then beginning to fall. Thereafter - the safe and orderly America of the present day, will cease to exist.
If the dollar collapses - how long do you think your local supermarket will have food? How long do you think the trucking companies which brought that food along the highway to the local area where you are, will continue to run and deliver food? (when Joe Smith the driver can't get his credit card to work, or buy food along the way)
If the dollar collapses - how long do you think the workers at the post office, the local power plant, water treatment; the police force - all of these people - how long will they continue to do their jobs when their paycheck doesnt arrive. Or when the local banks all abruptly shut?
If the dollar collapses, how long do you think the electrical supply will last? How long do you think local gas stations will stay open when the transporters of gas supplies (just like food) aren't bringing in new supplies?
The idea of things staying the same when the dollar collapses, is highly unlikely. I think for every day of a dollar collapse - and subsequent 'missed' paycheck - the chances of the society restarting are minimal at best. Once the local electricity goes, and the supporting infrastructure around each aspect of so-called modern society begins to shred and fall apart.
Now picture yourself without electricity, with a dwindling cellphone battery, no bank account, no usable 'money' - no access to any gas, or TV or internet. Now you're back in around 1920 era living. In a few weeks time this will have regressed to roughly 1850 conditions. Worst case scenario, you better have dry food supplies to last months, a method of 'making' new food when these run out - and a method of protecting yourself from others who will try to kill you for your food.
Most citizens barely know how to cook, let alone deal with an abrupt descent of intense isolation - which is how a disintegration of central government will present itself to them. Suddenly there won't be any news - followed by a gradual removal of each and all the routines and comforts of modern living. If/when the dollar collapses, I think it'll be too catastrophic for any concerns over a central government even being able to reach out to local state levels to find people's gold. (Unless they're able to do it incredibly fast - like within literally a day or two, a week at most. The first missed paychecks and removal of one or another of the supports maintaining the society's food transport systems in place, will trigger catastrophe. Ditto local water treatment and a host of other rungs in the ladder... Thereafter, society will exponentially disintegrate.)
If the dollar collapses - my guess is 'modernity' will go away real fast. That said - small fractional quantities of gold are useful for bartering, more than the larger 1 ounce pieces.
I think the last thing I'd be concerned about, if the dollar collapsed, was whether or not the Gov might come looking for bits of gold. You're assuming a central authority will be able to still exist long enough to make the call to local forces (who themselves are struggling with the problem of not being able to buy food/feed families/gas vehicles etc)... perhaps a dollar collapse will trigger instant martial law and local Army takeover - which would be about the only way to prevent a rapid slip into barbarism.
/2 cents mode off
Last edited by MrFrankenstein; 02-19-2010 at 06:57 AM..
My gut feel is that its not a simple question ('could the Gov confiscate gold again if the dollar collapses') - and here's why:
Good post, I agree with you except that I doubt that many if any people are going to be swapping food, potable water, vegetable seeds, shovels, rakes, hoes, etc. for any amount of gold!
Should the economy suddenly and uncontrollably collapse, I think food and emergency supplies will quickly become the new currency. The survivors and 'nouveau riche' will be those who had the foresight to store food and emergency supplies, and the means and will to defend their supply.
I think the hype to buy gold is just that, it might work for a very few weeks while there are still surplus hoarded essentials for sale/swap or taking, but soon I think gold will become about as valuable as any other metal, which may be not at all.
I think it prudent for every family to store at least a six month supply of food and water and to have a plan on how to share it safely with neighbors if they have a surplus, or defend it from desperate others.
Well in shtf I will be willing to take gold and silver and lots of other metals. Metals will still retain value. They are no good for swimming with which I agree with.
If the poster on page 2 is still reading this after the silver certs deep 6ed there was a Fedral Reserve Note which came before the current worthless note.
For those under 40 there is a good chance they never had a real dollar in their lives before. The last real money was phased out in 1964, which was 1/2 dollars, 25 cent pieces and dimes of 90% silver.
I worry about the Feds in shtf, but not so much the Army since that is against the CONS. The Military swears an oath to up hold and defend the CONS, not the gov.
The government can and will confiscate gold. It will be practically useless when stuff hits the fan anyway. You should stock up on tangible items you will be able to USE -- food, ammunition, supplies, vehicles, clothing, etc. Work on getting your house off the grid as much as possible too. Only after you do all these things would I recommend getting any gold.
You can't eat gold, you can't use it very effectively for self defense either!
And yes, the government has been buying up ammunition left and right for several years now.
Much of the present military ground force is composed of foreign nationals gaining their citizenship for fighting, former felons, and others more than willing to follow unconstitutional orders. Every soldier who has deployed to Afghanistan or Iraq has ALREADY violated their oath!
Last edited by ozlo; 02-23-2010 at 08:12 AM..
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