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After reading that article, i don't think I ever want to go into space...
I read where the tempurature of the solar wind, which is charged particles from the sun, can be as high as a million degrees...not sure what the cooling rate is though...
But i'd hate to be hit with a million degree invisible wind...you'd be vaporized...
Also learned that the earths magnetic field is what protects our surface from these bombardments...and oddly enough the article mentioned the 'Van Alen' belts as storeing much of this energy...
It also said these solar winds, charged particles, can or have or could strip whole atmospheres from planets...
I also learned that the sun looses about 6.7 billions tons per hour do to this phenomina...
And they were wondering how these particles could reach velosity speed to escape suns gravitational pull...
Bottom line...space is a very hostile place...
Which now has me thinking about other planets...
They said Venus has a atmosphere 100 times denser than earths...
Let's just say if you did just shove or skoot or thrust the shuttle towards the moon....it would be like going there in a Motorhome...vs a out house....
I'm not saying your wrong OK...but I need to know why you couldn't just fly a shuttle to the moon...
And then land it on the surface like a Harriar jump jet....
Why could we not build or modify the old shuttles to do that?
We already went through this subect. The space shuttle was not designed to go to the Moon. The amount of fuel required would be staggering. How would you miodify it so it would be both efficient and cost-effective? It takes 500,000 (half a million) gallons of fuel (hydrogen and oxygen) on each flight. Further, that's enough to get the shuttle to orbit the Earth at 17,000 mph. To be able to launch a craft to the Mars or the Moon, you'd need reach a speed of at least 25,000 mph. That's a difference of at least 8,000 mph. That might not sound link much, but we're talking THOUSANDS of miles per hour, not a few hundred.
Keep in mind that the space shuttle is very large and very heavy, that's not including the weight of the fuel, nor does it consider the need for a much larger propulsion system which would also add more weight. All this weight has to be taken into account in order to launch it.
NASA's Q & A
NASA responded to such questions from the public explaining the problem.
- Aaron from Sydney asks:
"Is it possible for the shuttle to make a return trip to Mars? If not, what are the limiting factors?"
NASA replies:
"No, it is not possible for the orbiter to go to Mars. It is not possible for the orbiter even to go back to the moon. The reason being we don't have enough of a propulsion system to allow them to get that extra bit of miles per hour that they need. When they're orbiting the Earth they're going about 17,000 miles per hour. If you're going to go to the moon, or even on to Mars, you've got to get to at least 25,000 miles per hour, and the Orbital Maneuvering System engines are designed to do only a job in low Earth orbit, to boost us a tiny bit or to slow us down enough to reenter the Earth's atmosphere there is no way that we could get enough fuel on board to get us enough "oomph" to get us out to the moon or Mars. I'm sorry, because I would love to go to Mars in the space shuttle, it would be a lot of fun."
- Douglas from Elizabeth City asks:
"How much fuel does the space shuttle use per flight?"
NASA replies:
"The space shuttle uses, believe it or not, half a million gallons of hydrogen and oxygen on every flight. During the initial part of the liftoff, it's using a thousand gallons per second. Now if we were to take the pumps on board the orbiter that are pumping the hydrogen and the oxygen, and we were to pump water instead, we could drain an average-sized swimming pool in about 25 seconds. So that gives you some idea of how much fuel and oxidizer we're using here at NASA."
Let's just say if you did just shove or skoot or thrust the shuttle towards the moon....it would be like going there in a Motorhome...vs a out house....
I'm not saying your wrong OK...but I need to know why you couldn't just fly a shuttle to the moon...
And then land it on the surface like a Harriar jump jet....
Why could we not build or modify the old shuttles to do that?
Also, form what you know...is there 'wind' in space...
I saw a Star Wars episode, where some of the crafts had 'sails'...they were either sails or solar sails or both.
Since there's so much raw radiation in space, is solar energy more efficient in space?
And I'll find some American rockets here in a bit...
Fly Me To The Moon
If you could send the shuttle to the Moon, you'd need to be able to reduce the speed in order to land on the Moon. While it all might seem like a simple thing to do, it's not. There's no atmosphere on the Moon like we have on Earth. The shuttle isn't like an ordinary airplane. It's a glider. Further, an aircraft like a Boeing 747 is highly complex in design, but that's peanuts in comparison to something like the space shuttle. Maybe some day we'll have spacecrafts that are much more efficient, but we're far from anything like the sci-fi Star Wars crafts. For now, it's more efficient to use space cspsules. The next generation space capsules aren't as roomy as the space shuttle, but they're also not as cramped as the earlier Mercury, Gemini and Apollo capsules, at least for travel to the Moon. It's also being considered for use in reaching asteroids that are much farther away than the Moon, but still relatively close to the Earth.
Solar Sails
The use of solar sails is one way to build up speed in space. The downside is that it builds up slowly. In addition, the size of the solar sails to handle something as large as the space shuttle would be enormous. It's not quite the same thing as a small instrument craft. The Japanese did a test using a solar sail. Thw speed wasn't boosted much, but it did show it can work.
"Wind" in Space
There is no actual "wind" in space. What's called "wind" are energetic particles moving at very high speed. It's not like wind we experience here on Earth. These particles can have an effect on the atmosphere, but if you yourself were just floating around in space, it probably wouldn't push you around with any noticable difference. That doesn't mean there's no push at all though. The idea behind solar sails is that photons hitting a reflector (the solar sail) can gradually increase speed. The photons hit the reflector and bounce off which results in a slight boost. Over enough time, and enough boosting, speed can build up. That's fine for long distance travel to the outer planets or to the stars, but would be far too slow to use to get to the Moon.
After reading that article, i don't think I ever want to go into space...
I read where the tempurature of the solar wind, which is charged particles from the sun, can be as high as a million degrees...not sure what the cooling rate is though...
But i'd hate to be hit with a million degree invisible wind...you'd be vaporized...
Also learned that the earths magnetic field is what protects our surface from these bombardments...and oddly enough the article mentioned the 'Van Alen' belts as storeing much of this energy...
It also said these solar winds, charged particles, can or have or could strip whole atmospheres from planets...
I also learned that the sun looses about 6.7 billions tons per hour do to this phenomina...
And they were wondering how these particles could reach velosity speed to escape suns gravitational pull...
Bottom line...space is a very hostile place...
Which now has me thinking about other planets...
They said Venus has a atmosphere 100 times denser than earths...
One needs to pull back the covers, throw off the herd mentality, open one's mind to the endless possibilities.
Here's a few things I found out...and will leave behind links for future reference...
I read where this planet called Earth has a smaller planet called "the moon" which circles it.
I've also learned that the Earth revolves around the sun, but will have to do more research into it.
It is said that there are other "planets" that revolve around the sun.
They say that one of these "planets" has rings, additional research will be required to confirm this fact.
These observations I've made are not for people without imaginations.
I've also read that outer space can be dangerous but again, need to research it more.
So what I'm saying knowing what we know about how Governments operate it could be all the items above that I read about are false, again I have seen the light, know "The Truth" and have an open mind.
We already went through this subect. The space shuttle was not designed to go to the Moon. The amount of fuel required would be staggering. How would you miodify it so it would be both efficient and cost-effective? It takes 500,000 (half a million) gallons of fuel (hydrogen and oxygen) on each flight. Further, that's enough to get the shuttle to orbit the Earth at 17,000 mph. To be able to launch a craft to the Mars or the Moon, you'd need reach a speed of at least 25,000 mph. That's a difference of at least 8,000 mph. That might not sound link much, but we're talking THOUSANDS of miles per hour, not a few hundred.
Keep in mind that the space shuttle is very large and very heavy, that's not including the weight of the fuel, nor does it consider the need for a much larger propulsion system which would also add more weight. All this weight has to be taken into account in order to launch it.
NASA's Q & A
NASA responded to such questions from the public explaining the problem.
- Aaron from Sydney asks:
"Is it possible for the shuttle to make a return trip to Mars? If not, what are the limiting factors?"
NASA replies:
"No, it is not possible for the orbiter to go to Mars. It is not possible for the orbiter even to go back to the moon. The reason being we don't have enough of a propulsion system to allow them to get that extra bit of miles per hour that they need. When they're orbiting the Earth they're going about 17,000 miles per hour. If you're going to go to the moon, or even on to Mars, you've got to get to at least 25,000 miles per hour, and the Orbital Maneuvering System engines are designed to do only a job in low Earth orbit, to boost us a tiny bit or to slow us down enough to reenter the Earth's atmosphere there is no way that we could get enough fuel on board to get us enough "oomph" to get us out to the moon or Mars. I'm sorry, because I would love to go to Mars in the space shuttle, it would be a lot of fun."
- Douglas from Elizabeth City asks:
"How much fuel does the space shuttle use per flight?"
NASA replies:
"The space shuttle uses, believe it or not, half a million gallons of hydrogen and oxygen on every flight. During the initial part of the liftoff, it's using a thousand gallons per second. Now if we were to take the pumps on board the orbiter that are pumping the hydrogen and the oxygen, and we were to pump water instead, we could drain an average-sized swimming pool in about 25 seconds. So that gives you some idea of how much fuel and oxidizer we're using here at NASA."
Fly Me To The Moon
If you could send the shuttle to the Moon, you'd need to be able to reduce the speed in order to land on the Moon. While it all might seem like a simple thing to do, it's not. There's no atmosphere on the Moon like we have on Earth. The shuttle isn't like an ordinary airplane. It's a glider. Further, an aircraft like a Boeing 747 is highly complex in design, but that's peanuts in comparison to something like the space shuttle. Maybe some day we'll have spacecrafts that are much more efficient, but we're far from anything like the sci-fi Star Wars crafts. For now, it's more efficient to use space cspsules. The next generation space capsules aren't as roomy as the space shuttle, but they're also not as cramped as the earlier Mercury, Gemini and Apollo capsules, at least for travel to the Moon. It's also being considered for use in reaching asteroids that are much farther away than the Moon, but still relatively close to the Earth.
Solar Sails
The use of solar sails is one way to build up speed in space. The downside is that it builds up slowly. In addition, the size of the solar sails to handle something as large as the space shuttle would be enormous. It's not quite the same thing as a small instrument craft. The Japanese did a test using a solar sail. Thw speed wasn't boosted much, but it did show it can work.
"Wind" in Space
There is no actual "wind" in space. What's called "wind" are energetic particles moving at very high speed. It's not like wind we experience here on Earth. These particles can have an effect on the atmosphere, but if you yourself were just floating around in space, it probably wouldn't push you around with any noticable difference. That doesn't mean there's no push at all though. The idea behind solar sails is that photons hitting a reflector (the solar sail) can gradually increase speed. The photons hit the reflector and bounce off which results in a slight boost. Over enough time, and enough boosting, speed can build up. That's fine for long distance travel to the outer planets or to the stars, but would be far too slow to use to get to the Moon.
I'm glad your not 'intimidated' by my questions...
What's obvious to some, may not be so to others, and questions answered correctly help others to learn...
So I thank you for your patients...
And with that...
What i have deducted from your post is the main issue preventing the space shuttle from going to the moon is fuel...
Not shape, but fuel...
 
Last edited by Time and Space; 01-06-2012 at 09:42 AM..
Since we seemed to have had better space technology back in the 60's...if only Kennedy would have said...
'Let's go to Mars'....
No doubt we would of gone there and built a base....
It just seems back in the 50's and 60's...when some militaries still utilized mules and horses in their armies, that and flew bi-planes, that are space technology was much better...
Seems computers and advancements in other areas, have slowed the space program down...
This Bi-plane was still being used as a trainer, in the US Navy until 1961...
From Bi-planes to the moon...
But now it's a daunting task...yet men who designed bi-planes, could go to the moon...
I commend our Astronauts and Space Program...very brave wonderful men and women...
They should be commended for what they did...
Their going into space has brought us tremendious advancements in our daily lives...including toothpaste...or the tubes it's contained in...
As well as many medical advancements and many other things we now use in our daily lives...
Regardless of what happened, these brave souls risked their lives for us...and for that, they should forever be commended...
I commend our Astronauts and Space Program...very brave wonderful men and women...
They should be commended for what they did...
Their going into space has brought us tremendious advancements in our daily lives...including toothpaste...or the tubes it's contained in...
As well as many medical advancements and many other things we now use in our daily lives...
Regardless of what happened, these brave souls risked their lives for us...and for that, they should forever be commended...
You have nothing but my respect...
You don't know they actually went into space.
You need to have an open mind, it could all be faked.
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I just want to say...
