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And I just couldn't disagree with your opinion any more strongly. McEnroe is clearly an expert and as he stated he's seen Navratilova, Graf, Seles, Evert & BJK play...up close and personal. So if he feels that Serena is or is on her way to being the GOAT, how is that ridiculous and how is that hype? What could it possibly benefit McEnroe to make such a statement?
A truly fallacious argument if ever there were one. So what you're also saying is that neither Navratilova nor Graf can be better than Margaret Court. Unfortunately, Court's playing days are a bit before my time, but I doubt that many historians of the game would make that claim. And while talking accomplishments, let us not forget Serena's 15 GS doubles & mixed doubles championships either.
You wanna talk about ridiculous hyperbole...This "argument" is rather silly in my opinion yet invariably comes up in sports discussions when someone feels the need to disparage a certain team or athlete. Nobody controls when they're born just as nobody controls their opponents. If we're to play that game though, as BajanYankee pointed out, the field wasn't exactly stellar when Steffi Graf was dominating, so what? Serena's career isn't over yet, but it's hard to argue that she isn't already in the top 5 of all time. Though you may not like it, by the time her career is over her name will most certainly be in the debate about the G.O.A.T.
Her game doesn't impress me. She relies on her offense and when she can't dictate the flow the match she doesn't win. I don't like pure counterpunchers but to be great you have to be able to rely on your defense when your offense falters. However Serena has little counterpunching ability. Her defense is average and her movement around the court is slightly above average. Look at what happened at the USO last year when she went up against Stosur. When Stosur took over that match with offense Serena had zero answer. Her defense is just isn't good, I'm just not impressed.
You may disagree but Serena's dominance is a testament to the weakness of this era. This is an era of counterpunchers dominating the women's landscape and Serena's lucky for that. If someone can step up with a strong serve and consistent offense they can routine Williams.
As for J-Mc he tends to get prisoner of the moment and hyperbolic after Grand Slams. He always talks up the winners and is full of hype and hyperbole. I guess watching the Finals just gets him fired up. But after Roger Federer won on Sunday he said that "no one loves the game as much Federer" and said that Fed loves the game more than anyone else in history. Look I love Fed and he's my favorite athlete but come on that's a tad ridiculous. McEnroe's opinion at the time (we'll see if it still is during the US Open) was that Serena's the GOAT. That's an opinion, and it's one I disagree with strongly.
I think she has to go down as one of the best. As a black woman, she has endured and overcome more adversity than all the other tennis greats combined. Overcoming this to attain her level of achievement is astounding, and has to be recognized. The same goes for her sister Venus.
I'd place them 1 and 2, interchangeably, as the best in history.
As a black woman? Why? Do they call foot fault more often on black women? Do they require black women to use cheaper quality racket only? Or do they not allow black women to wear shoes while playing at grand slams?
As a black woman? Why? Do they call foot fault more often on black women? Do they require black women to use cheaper quality racket only? Or do they not allow black women to wear shoes while playing at grand slams?
Haha I thought about that as well when I read it. Also I think Arthur Ashe would probably disagree that Serena has had to overcome more than anyone else but hey everyone has their own thoughts.
Her game doesn't impress me. She relies on her offense and when she can't dictate the flow the match she doesn't win. I don't like pure counterpunchers but to be great you have to be able to rely on your defense when your offense falters. However Serena has little counterpunching ability. Her defense is average and her movement around the court is slightly above average. Look at what happened at the USO last year when she went up against Stosur. When Stosur took over that match with offense Serena had zero answer. Her defense is just isn't good, I'm just not impressed.
I'd disagree with that. Serena's offense is so explosive that her defense tends to get overlooked. If anything, it's underrated. At any rate, give Samantha Stosur some credit. It was her second GS final. She didn't get there by accident. Let's not underestimate her hard work, will and desire to win. Sometimes players just step up for a day, for a match, for a tournament. Given enough time and tape and/or Youtube footage, a person can pick apart the weaknesses of any player's game because none of them have played the game perfectly and no player ever will. They're human after all. What makes these people multiple champions is their ability to minimize whatever flaws may exist in their game while imposing their strengths on the match. If 14 GS singles titles (and counting) isn't enough to impress you, then I don't know what will because at this point what you're essentially saying is that it's not enough for Serena to win; she has to win in a manner that you find acceptable and you have to realize that is neither a fair nor realistic expectation.
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You may disagree but Serena's dominance is a testament to the weakness of this era. This is an era of counterpunchers dominating the women's landscape and Serena's lucky for that. If someone can step up with a strong serve and consistent offense they can routine Williams.
You make it sound so easy, yet no one has been able to do it on a regular basis. You may call it weakness of the era, I say that it's because Serena isn't nearly as easy to beat as you claim. Moreover, you want to say that Serena's dominance reflects an alleged weakness of her era. It's just as easy to say that Steffi's dominance is a product of the weakness of her era. She didn't come on until Chris Evert was on her way out of the door. Navratilova was still around, but she was clearly in the twilight of her career. The one consistent threat to her dominance was Monica Seles. Once Seles' ability and talent had surpassed Graf's, one of her crazed fans took her out. Now as I said earlier, a player can't control their opponents and they certainly can't control their lunatic fans. However, it's not a stretch to say that Graf owes at least some of her greatness and place in history to a madman.
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McEnroe's opinion at the time (we'll see if it still is during the US Open) was that Serena's the GOAT. That's an opinion, and it's one I disagree with strongly.
Yes, we shall indeed see. For the record, I think that Martina Navratilova is the G.O.A.T. on the women's side, perhaps the greatest overall, and I think that will probably still be the case even after Serena retires. However, that Serena will definitely be mentioned in that inevitable discussion isn't anywhere near as preposterous as you seem to want to make it out to be. Put another way, if one were to set up a round-robin with Serena, Graf, Navratilova, Evert, Court and Billie Jean King all in their respective primes, Serena would have to be the odds-on favorite to come out such a mythical tournament on top.
As a black woman? Why? Do they call foot fault more often on black women? Do they require black women to use cheaper quality racket only? Or do they not allow black women to wear shoes while playing at grand slams?
No, none of that. They're just apparently not as pretty inside and outside as they need to be in order to be popular.
Federer, for what it's worth, is not a "power player." His technique and fundamentals are some of the soundest in the game.
He's not a power player per se, but doesn't he have a faster serve than most of the guys 20-30 years ago?
I was reading on another site, the serve speed in womens tennis has gone up 20 mph? since the Chris Evert era. From 80-90 to 100-110 now. With williams getting up to 120.
He's not a power player per se, but doesn't he have a faster serve than most of the guys 20-30 years ago?
Velocity-wise, I think he's getting around the same speed Sampras did( who is generally regarded as the best server ever yeah?). I think what sets Pistol Pete apart was his placement and how potent his second serve was. There wasn't a whole lot of different between his first and second serve, so breaking him was especially difficult.
Serena Williams is clearly an all-time great player and the best player of her era. Because of her injuries, her inconsistent play at times, and the fact she only won Roland Garros once (i.e. isn't a multiple slam winner at all the Grand Slam events), I wouldn't quite put her at the level of Martina Navratilova, Chris Evert, or Steffi Graf, but she isn't too far behind that trio. She is probably the most physical women's tennis player in history.
Her little "in your face" victory dance and primal screaming at the olympics was the most obnoxious display of arrogance ever.
She is a disgrace to tennis, and America.
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