St. Louis Questions (Chesterfield, University City, Kirkwood: university, areas, cities)

[FrankMiller]

Originally Posted by MUTGR

I thought most of the highways (270/40/44) that I drive most often in the metro have a 60 MPH limit.

I think it's mainly within the city limits where you see a speed limit of 55 on the interstates, probably due to the roads being smaller and more winding.

[ryanfze55]

Originally Posted by mjtinmemphis

As a Black male, I don't find the racial tensions any worse here then they are in many other places.

There are many options for you to live in a truly integrated neighborhood and socialize with different races from different places if you choose to.

Segregation is an issue especially in south county and parts beyond 270. Many areas are 90%+ White and it is that way because people like it that way.

I live work and play in the central corridor and dont think about racism in my daily life.

Disclosure: I'm probably a bit of an apologist, as I've never lived inside 270. But statistically speaking, Kirkwood, Webster Groves, Brentwood, Clayton, Ladue, basically all the "desirable areas" inside of 270, are no more racially diverse than South County, St. Charles County or places in West County like Ballwin, Wildwood, and Chesterfield. All of these places have a white population between 85-90%. The inner rings may have a slightly higher percentage of African Americans, but the outer suburbs have higher percentages of Hispanics and Asians. Chesterfield and Creve Coeur in particular have a large population of Asians while Maryland Heights has a larger percentage of blacks than the beloved central corridor. Idk, I'm probably rambling at this point, but basically just trying to say that you're spreading misinformation. Live in rural Missouri, and you might have a diversity problem. But anywhere in the STL metro area is fine.

[mjtinmemphis]

Originally Posted by ryanfze55

Maryland Heights has a larger percentage of blacks than the beloved central corridor.

I'm done after that statement

[ryanfze55]

Originally Posted by mjtinmemphis

I'm done after that statement

Because it's a correct statement. Look at the stats. Perhaps our definition of central corridor is different.

[glamatomic]

Originally Posted by ryanfze55

Because it's a correct statement. Look at the stats. Perhaps our definition of central corridor is different.

What's your definition of the central corridor?

[Someboyelse]

The county is more diverse than it first appears.

People forget a huge chunk of the County is unincorporated, and the population numbers there are only reported in County-wide Census data. St. Louis County is ~ 1 million people, and about 66% are White/Non-Hispanic. That leaves ~340,000 non-Whites to account for. For reference, Florissant, the largest city in the whole county and itself in North County, has only about 17,000 non-White residents as of the last Census. Just take a glance at the racial composition and population of the municipalities in St. Louis County and it is immediately obvious a WHOLE BUNCH of people are not showing up.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munici...unty,_Missouri


I'm not making direct claims about where populations are, only that the easy-to-find data leaves out a whole lot that can be deceiving. You can get a better idea of who actually lives where by looking at school district compositions, though that has problems too because of average number of children, age of average family by race, and busing.

E.G. Kirkwood is listed as being "96% White". Anyone familiar with the area knows there is a subdivision touching the South border (near Meramec Community College and the railroad tracks) that is nearly 100% Black, but it is technically in an unincorporated area, so it doesn't show up in the Census numbers. Their school district shows only 91% White. Some of this is "private" schooling, some the reasons mentioned above, but a lot is actually the unincorporated areas.

https://statisticalatlas.com/school-...-and-Ethnicity



For whatever it's worth, this is MUCH bigger factor in St. Charles County than in St. Louis. Take a look at how the city lines are drawn ... with the giant holes in the middle cities for no apparent reason ... then consider how the official numbers can impact real-estate values ...

Now guess where the large apartment complexes that most of the black-folk of St. Charles live are? Where is St. Andrews? Where is Time Center? Where is Heritage? Where is Ashwood? There are a ton more Black folks in St. Charles than it looks like from an internet search.

https://map.sccmo.org/Main/viewers/desktop/

[ryanfze55]

Originally Posted by glamatomic

What's your definition of the central corridor?

Broadly, the cities nestled between 40/64 and 44 inside of 270... Kirkwood, Webster Groves, Frontenac, Ladue, Clayton, Brentwood, Richmond Heights, Maplewood... Maplewood being the only one with any diversity at all. I guess this definition could extend to University City.

[1764]

Too me the dividing line in St.Louis is interstate 64, Delmar may be the official start however 64 is the beginning. All you have to do is drive on any north south artillery road such as Jefferson Grand Vandeventer Kingshighway Hampton although it cuts off at FP McCausland/Skinker Big Bend Hanley and then 170. Im not sure why this all matters people should be able to be free to roam wherever instead not only in St.Louis but this country continues to create this divide amongst each other..

I agree with the post about CWE is the most diverse area in St.Louis region thats why theres so much happening there.

I don't know what the 2016 census were for both areas regarding AA population but heres a tidbit of 2010 if thats still a bit of relevance

Maryland heights had a 11.9% AA population as of 2010 census

Central West End had a 28.0% AA population as of 2010 census

[1grin_g0]

Originally Posted by Someboyelse

The county is more diverse than it first appears.

People forget a huge chunk of the County is unincorporated, and the population numbers there are only reported in County-wide Census data. St. Louis County is ~ 1 million people, and about 66% are White/Non-Hispanic. That leaves ~340,000 non-Whites to account for. For reference, Florissant, the largest city in the whole county and itself in North County, has only about 17,000 non-White residents as of the last Census. Just take a glance at the racial composition and population of the municipalities in St. Louis County and it is immediately obvious a WHOLE BUNCH of people are not showing up.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munici...unty,_Missouri


I'm not making direct claims about where populations are, only that the easy-to-find data leaves out a whole lot that can be deceiving. You can get a better idea of who actually lives where by looking at school district compositions, though that has problems too because of average number of children, age of average family by race, and busing.

E.G. Kirkwood is listed as being "96% White". Anyone familiar with the area knows there is a subdivision touching the South border (near Meramec Community College and the railroad tracks) that is nearly 100% Black, but it is technically in an unincorporated area, so it doesn't show up in the Census numbers. Their school district shows only 91% White. Some of this is "private" schooling, some the reasons mentioned above, but a lot is actually the unincorporated areas.

https://statisticalatlas.com/school-...-and-Ethnicity



For whatever it's worth, this is MUCH bigger factor in St. Charles County than in St. Louis. Take a look at how the city lines are drawn ... with the giant holes in the middle cities for no apparent reason ... then consider how the official numbers can impact real-estate values ...

Now guess where the large apartment complexes that most of the black-folk of St. Charles live are? Where is St. Andrews? Where is Time Center? Where is Heritage? Where is Ashwood? There are a ton more Black folks in St. Charles than it looks like from an internet search.

https://map.sccmo.org/Main/viewers/desktop/

I understand your point and I agree to an extent about the unincorporated areas in STL County, but St. Charles County is 87% White and less than 5% Black. I think you went too far in claiming that it's a "MUCH bigger factor".

https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fa...ouri/PST120216

[MUTGR]

Originally Posted by Someboyelse

The county is more diverse than it first appears.

People forget a huge chunk of the County is unincorporated, and the population numbers there are only reported in County-wide Census data. St. Louis County is ~ 1 million people, and about 66% are White/Non-Hispanic. That leaves ~340,000 non-Whites to account for. For reference, Florissant, the largest city in the whole county and itself in North County, has only about 17,000 non-White residents as of the last Census. Just take a glance at the racial composition and population of the municipalities in St. Louis County and it is immediately obvious a WHOLE BUNCH of people are not showing up.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munici...unty,_Missouri


I'm not making direct claims about where populations are, only that the easy-to-find data leaves out a whole lot that can be deceiving. You can get a better idea of who actually lives where by looking at school district compositions, though that has problems too because of average number of children, age of average family by race, and busing.

E.G. Kirkwood is listed as being "96% White". Anyone familiar with the area knows there is a subdivision touching the South border (near Meramec Community College and the railroad tracks) that is nearly 100% Black, but it is technically in an unincorporated area, so it doesn't show up in the Census numbers. Their school district shows only 91% White. Some of this is "private" schooling, some the reasons mentioned above, but a lot is actually the unincorporated areas.

https://statisticalatlas.com/school-...-and-Ethnicity



For whatever it's worth, this is MUCH bigger factor in St. Charles County than in St. Louis. Take a look at how the city lines are drawn ... with the giant holes in the middle cities for no apparent reason ... then consider how the official numbers can impact real-estate values ...

Now guess where the large apartment complexes that most of the black-folk of St. Charles live are? Where is St. Andrews? Where is Time Center? Where is Heritage? Where is Ashwood? There are a ton more Black folks in St. Charles than it looks like from an internet search.

https://map.sccmo.org/Main/viewers/desktop/

I'm not disagreeing with your overall point but a couple of your facts need to be corrected. Meacham Prk was annexed by Kirkwood in 1991.

Meacham Park - WikiLou

So those numbers should show up in the census data.

According to the most recent census estimates I've seen it's 89.4% white, 7.2% black.

https://factfinder.census.gov/faces/...w.xhtml?src=CF

And the school demographics I've seen are different too. I've seen figures of 20% to 25% black for the student demographics in Kirkwood.