This is good news - if not just playing with (housing) numbers (Tampa: days on market, for sale)

[lavender]

Home prices back to '03 levels - Sep. 25, 2012

[gulfer]

Case-Shiller Shows More Improvement for July 2012 | The Big Picture

Actually Tampa is part of the 20.

Are all homes at there 2003 value, of course not. It's a statistic and it's information. Why not just read it and if you don't like it, move on to something else?

Thank you for the DATA lavender! It is very much appreciated. If people like you don't keep posting this wouldn't be worth reading. Seems like a large portion of people have just want to argue. Starting to really think about leaving this all together or maybe just turning into a reader and not even post. Too bad actually. Used to have some good discussions.

[stpeteguy]

Yesterday on the way home from work, I seen a sign on the side of the road that said "2/1 home, $40K , call XXX-XXXX". I see these signs all the time. Sometimes it will be a "3/1 for $45K or 3/2 for $50K".

Back in the boom days, i'd see the same type of signs and they were all over $100K.

I don't think we've moved too far off the bottom, if any.

[Sunscape]

Good link, Lavender.

Personal attacks will be deleted. Discuss ideas but do not attack the poster.

[the awesomee]

This is based off a Home Pricing Index, like OP said in the subject line, possibly playing with numbers. It doesn't tell you which index as there are many. I know in high desirable areas that those homes over 500k definately up, but realtors love stories like this because it will get the passive homebuyer to drop in and say "I must get one before they go to high". Seems like another pump and dump to me. I would not want to get caught in a (second) bubble. If you have listingbook, you can tell in the "nicer areas of towns" houses get scooped up fast and for near (or at) listing value, but look in the east and central tampa areas, there are thousands of houses for sale for 50, 60 or 70k. There is a huge gap between the super nice homes and the dirt poor areas.

[cupper3]

When industry proponents use statistics that only show one side of the story, or in particular, a very diluted side of the story, one wonders whether that information is not being used in a somewhat disingenuous manner. The real estate industry does have the reputation of being 'good news' bearers, which is understandable, as investors profit that way, and brokers/agents improve their commissions.

Especially when one is talking national averages.

Statistics that can be used in a manner that is does not give full disclosure. We all know that real estate like politics is local. Some sub-sets have stabilized, but to project the performance on that sub-set as a reflection of the whole is not accurate at all.

A more complete discussion would include a dissection of Case/Shiller as it applies to the Tampa Bay area.

That would be informative.

[the awesomee]

Originally Posted by Un Poquito Mas

Most economic news use the Case-shiller index. There is no such thing as "many indexes". It is clearly said on both links the Case-shiller index is being used. They don't "play" with numbers. In fact both of them, Case and Shiller have a gloomy picture of the US economy, especially Shiller.

You are contradictiing yourself on this. Are you an economist? There ARE MANY home pricing indexes; most firms use Case/Shiller however, but that does not necessarily mean the data is not convoluted.

Thats like saying Moodys is THE ONLY credit rating agency. In fact, FHFA has data out right now contradicting this entire article. LOL

To say that this data is not favorable to a certain market (i.e potential homebuyers) is naive.



FYI

"The S&P/Case-Shiller Home Price Indices are the leading measures for the US residential housing market, tracking changes in the value of residential real estate both nationally as well as in 20 metropolitan regions."

[gulfer]

Thank you all for turning this into a discussion. It makes for a much better read and actually stays with the Original Posters Thread intended.

I agree with your comment avb3 regarding 'Realtors being good news bearers' for housing information. But I would also counter with, I personally feel that it doesn't do the Real Estate Market any good to have prices go up or down significantly or not knowing which direction it is moving.

The Greater Tampa Association of Realtors (GTAR) has some nice graphs by cities for home prices. Again, like was mentioned, things become very local. One 4 bed/2 bath 2200 square foot home may have sold for 185K. That doesn't mean that every home of the same size and specs within 2 miles will sell for the same.

Land O’Lakes

Thanks again for making this one a running discussion. Nice to see.

[Pragmaticus]

Originally Posted by gulfer

Thank you all for turning this into a discussion. It makes for a much better read and actually stays with the Original Posters Thread intended.

I agree with your comment avb3 regarding 'Realtors being good news bearers' for housing information. But I would also counter with, I personally feel that it doesn't do the Real Estate Market any good to have prices go up or down significantly or not knowing which direction it is moving.

The Greater Tampa Association of Realtors (GTAR) has some nice graphs by cities for home prices. Again, like was mentioned, things become very local. One 4 bed/2 bath 2200 square foot home may have sold for 185K. That doesn't mean that every home of the same size and specs within 2 miles will sell for the same.

Land O’Lakes

Thanks again for making this one a running discussion. Nice to see.

Your link shows way high values for midian price in Land O Lake than what city data has here(//www.city-data.com/city/Land-O-Lakes-Florida.html). Is the data you referenced for a specific sub division or what?

I am just curious why such a big differene .

Edit: Or may be city data is for both condo and SFH together (I probably answered my question)

[chi_tino]

Originally Posted by the awesomee

FYI

"The S&P/Case-Shiller Home Price Indices are the leading measures for the US residential housing market, tracking changes in the value of residential real estate both nationally as well as in 20 metropolitan regions."

Yep, and S&P/Case's 3% or so gain in the past year for Tampa Bay real estate seems about right. NAR, on the other hand, continues to quote massive double digit gains on an annual basis, which makes no sense to anyone who looks at these figures on a regular basis.

Price "indices" from the National Association of Realtors have repeatedly been shown to be false, misleading and have been retracted on numerous occasions. While the methodologies for the S&P/Case-Shiller indices are publicly known, NAR openly admits that they subjectively pick and choose which properties to include in their statistical groups to get the results they want. They have also been known to double count home sales to boost sales volume numbers. And I won't even start on the completely fictional "days on market" number...

One of these groups has the respect of the financial markets and those who actually put their money where their mouth is. The other is merely a one-sided propaganda machine that is considered a laughingstock by pretty much everyone who doesn't pay dues to the organization.

To call these two different indices "comparable" is a very naive view.