BUILDING A HOME... Do our problems warrant legal action? (Palm Beach: sales, real estate)

[tutoradvance]

We are having a home built and we have 2 issues that we are debating on whether or not we could benefit from legal action.
Issue #1
During our initial meetings with the builder, we extended one of the bedroom walls out 4ft. They charged us almost $7k for this extension. The plans say "vaulted ceiling". We asked the builder what vaulted meant. He explained it like this, "The ceiling will start at 8ft at the wall and vault up from 8ft." We were happy with that and agreed to the price change. When they ordered the trusses, they did not re-engineer them for the extension. So the ceiling starts at 8ft and comes in 4ft flat (NOT vaulted) and then the vault starts 4ft in from the wall. We are asking them to credit us the 7k because we feel that it looks like an aftermarket addition and it was not done as agreed to in the contract. Other than the plans we signed simply saying "vaulted ceiling". There is nothing in regards to the construction of the ceiling in the contract.


Issue #2
Our septic is located 10ft from the house on the plans and is only 5ft from the house when they put it in. Also the drainfield was on the plans as to be located on the other side of the septic (so the septic was 10ft and the drainfield would have been just farther than that), but when they put it in, they ran the drainfield along the side of the house. Also 5ft from the house, the entire length.
Our roof is a giant pitch that runs parrallel to the septic and drainfield now because they weren't placed in the same place as on the plans. We asked the builder to move the drainfield to where it was on the plans, or install gutters on that side of the house to prevent over saturation of the drainfield from roof runoff.

We have asked the builder about these two issues for about a month now and have gotten no response. The house is scheduled to be completed in less than a month now. Do you think we have a leg to stand on for legal action or what should we do?

[Buckeye Joe]

Can't say one way or the other about issue 1

Issue 2 can be easily resolved by checking with the county health dept, or whomever issues permits and does inspections. Everything must be right to get a Certificate of Occupancy. Find the right agency and ask what the rules and regulations are for the septic system, then you know which side of the law you are on. Good luck.

[tutoradvance]

Originally Posted by Buckeye Joe

Can't say one way or the other about issue 1

Issue 2 can be easily resolved by checking with the county health dept, or whomever issues permits and does inspections. Everything must be right to get a Certificate of Occupancy. Find the right agency and ask what the rules and regulations are for the septic system, then you know which side of the law you are on. Good luck.

Well the Florida law states minimum of 5ft from the foundation. It meets that requirement and passed inspection, but even the guy who put in the septic told us because of the location, he would strongly recommend gutters to prevent it from backing up.

Is there any weight in the fact that it is not in the place it was presented in the plans?

[tutoradvance]

Also the florida department of health wesbite says not to put a drainfield in a place where it would receive a lot of roof runoff....but it's not a requirement to pass inspection. :/

[bentlebee]

If you only have paid a down payment than I would dispute all the items you have stated and tell them you will beack out and want your deposit refunded and otherwise will get a lawyer involved.

This sounds so bad and buying a home should be a good positive experience not like you have now.

Do you have a realtor or someone else represent you? I assume not and my suggestion would have been to have a person represent you that has more experience so you would have more professional advise.

Keep in mind the sales rep. for the builder is there for the builder not for you. The realtor would be paid by the builer not by you bu guide you through the entire process.

To keep up with building requirements is something different then what a builder and you have discussed and agreed upon. Otherwise a builder should have answered to you that they work according to building requirements and if they didn't tell you that then this will be a breach but it will be hard to proof since the tricky part is in the small print and the sales person may have sid something else then could be in the small print and the small print is what they can proof and you will only have "hearsay" and that will not help you much.

[tutoradvance]

We have a realtor and she is baffled by the situation. Her advice was to seek legal advice...I think she is mostly CYA for herself and she is getting a % of the sale, but we brought her with us, she is not affiliated with the builder.

We did our homework and this builder is pretty reputable in the tampa area, but I think we have a questionable superintendant.
So frustrated. We don't want to have an attorney take our money and then basically not be able to get any further either. That's why we are bouncing this off this community to get others' opinions.

[gregm]

Question? Do you have well or city water. I'm going to assume well here so this is how it is in Palm Beach County.

The drain field cannot be any closer than 75 feet from the nearest well.(yours or your neighbor.)

[MortonR]

On item #1 I would want to see the addendum to the contract or plans that describe it. If there was a modification and an add-on to the contract there has got to be something in the specs describing the work to be done and the changes.

If not, you don't have a lot to stand on, unfortunately. If the changes aren't spelled out clearly it's a matter of interpretation, and you''re going to lose on that one.

I'm not familiar with Florida or local codes regarding septic systems, but it doesn't sound like a well engineered arrangement.

Having built a number of homes, some as my own general contractor and others with builders, this is what I would suggest:

1.) Send the builder a registered letter describing your concerns and asking for a written response within a fixed time, like a week. Be direct and to the point - you're not griping, you have to spell out exactly what you expected and what the perceived deficiencies are. You might even suggest resolutions, but you should probably let them respond first and see how amenable they are to working something out.

2.) Find a reputable local septic system contractor and pay them to inspect the property based on what the builder is proposing. Have them provide a written report with their recommendations in detail as to how the system should be installed, and what, if any, problems they would expect based on the builder's proposed plan. This is your leverage in requesting a change in their proposed design.

3.) As an alternative to #2, hire a home inspection service to do the same.

If you have a construction loan, immediately notify your lender that there are deficiencies and ask them to not allow any additional draws until you approve it. They will want to know why, so be prepared to show or give them a copy of the letter you send the builder. Let the builder know in your letter to them that you are requesting the lender to withhold funds until the matter is resolved to your satisfaction.

To be honest, the cow is out of the barn on the ceiling issue. I would be surprised if the builder would re-engineer trusses to change this, so you'll probably be faced with a credit of some sort. Do understand that since they did "vault" the ceiling somewhat you're not going to get all of your money credited back. Attempting to do so is going to be a losing proposition in my opinion.

I think you have a better chance of getting the septic system issue sorted out, albeit with some guttering and that's about it.

Let this be a lesson to all who read this - if you alter plans or ask for modifications, they need to be spelled out in detail BEFORE construction begins. As in this situation, the ceiling issue could be considered a matter of interpretation, so without detailed plans and drawings depicting what the buyer envisioned you are pretty much at the mercy of the builder's interpretation.

And last but not least, find a good real estate attorney. You should have done this before you ever signed a contract. It's amazing how quickly things get resolved after a phone call or letter from your attorney. It never ceases to amaze me that people go into the largest transaction in their life without legal representation. A real estate attorney might cost you $500. A small price to pay, considering the total cost of your investment....

RM

[gulfer]

Do you live local? I would take (or have your agent) the drawings down to the property and find person in charge of building the home. Find out why they deviated. Was there an Easement there? Is there a conservation area? I would think there has to be a reason why they would deviate from a plan.

Your lender is more than likely going to do an inspection. You can find that out.

You can't file a lawsuit against someone when you don't even own the property yet. Demand the changes or find out why. Have your Agent call the builder and tell him YOU WILL NOT BUY THIS HOUSE if things aren't fixed or explained to you right now. Have her send a cancellation to the contract. Just don't sign it so it is not a valid document, but you will darn sure get the attention you are looking for.

[tutoradvance]

Oh those are good ideas. Never thought about the certified letter. We did have a real estate attorney view our contract prior to signing and all was ok. These two issues aren't really with the contract, but work that has been done that is not the same as the plans say (in the case of the septic) yet still meets minimum requirements...or work that was not done as described, although not in writing. The builder even said after the ceiling was put in that he overlooked the fact that the extension would not have a vault at the wall.
It is a good point to anyone who is building, things have come up that were never even thought of, so be sure and get EVERYTHING in writing.