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So, as a principal I was allotted a certain number of staff positions for my school. If you want me to hire more ISS teachers, then I will have to fire some content teachers.
Our school system's admin much preferred ISS over OSS.
What do you think a student thinks about a teacher when a teacher can't control him/her and has to have someone control them?
To your first point it goes back to being hand tied by the school system and state.
However you might can simply put them all in the auditorium or some large area and still keep one ISS teacher. Hard but hey what can you do lol
All admin will prefer ISS over OSS . Less paper work and red tape.
I don't know what they think. What they think doesn't matter. Only thing that matters is the teacher having rules and punishments for breaking said rules. Only so much a teacher can do. In the real world if you can't follow the rules you get thrown out / removed of what ever thing you are in.
None of this is working for middle and high school. Usually
These kids have zero parental guidance and upbringing.
Zero respect for adults and zero appreciation for education and learning.
Absentee parents. Single mother homes. No discipline.
I don't know. I think going over the classroom procedures just does not get done in high school or middle school because we are so rushed about getting into the curriculum. If we took the time to do the discipline right before starting content, we would actually get through more curriculum, imo.
While I agree that the things you mention are problems, I think we can overcome some of this if we do slow down. You cannot teach content if you are concentrating on discipline. So, you have to do the discipline and create a good classroom atmosphere first.
I don't know. I think going over the classroom procedures just does not get done in high school or middle school because we are so rushed about getting into the curriculum. If we took the time to do the discipline right before starting content, we would actually get through more curriculum, imo.
While I agree that the things you mention are problems, I think we can overcome some of this if we do slow down. You cannot teach content if you are concentrating on discipline. So, you have to do the discipline and create a good classroom atmosphere first.
This program was actually started when Dr. Marshall was teaching high school and only later adapted for elementary schools.
You can only create a good classroom atmosphere when students care about the rules and punishments.
If I didn't have any respect for other people nor cared about my grades and also didn't care about getting in trouble nor didn't care about anything my parents would do I have zero incintive to follow the rules.
To your first point it goes back to being hand tied by the school system and state.
However you might can simply put them all in the auditorium or some large area and still keep one ISS teacher. Hard but hey what can you do lol
All admin will prefer ISS over OSS . Less paper work and red tape.
I don't know what they think. What they think doesn't matter. Only thing that matters is the teacher having rules and punishments for breaking said rules. Only so much a teacher can do. In the real world if you can't follow the rules you get thrown out / removed of what ever thing you are in.
Well, do you think schools have unlimited funding? There was never a time I had more money than I needed to run my school. In fact, I never had enough money to run my school.
LOL doesn't cut it. That offers no solution.
Less paperwork? I can't speak for all systems, but in mine the paperwork was exactly equal -- an OSS or ISS letter to the parent and a Scantron sheet at the end of the month.
Oh, what students think about a teacher matters very much. I have never forgotten my student teaching experience. We were on a team at that middle school, and I was the student teacher in science, and we had another student teacher in English. The kids literally drove the English student teacher right of the school and out of education forever. Meanwhile, I had exactly the same kids and was having no significant problems. What was the one factor that was different? The teacher (or in this case student teacher).
You can only create a good classroom atmosphere when students care about the rules and punishments.
If I didn't have any respect for other people nor cared about my grades and also didn't care about getting in trouble nor didn't care about anything my parents would do I have zero incintive to follow the rules.
Bingo. Earlier you said it didn't matter what the student thought about the teacher. It matters very much.
Well, do you think schools have unlimited funding? There was never a time I had more money than I needed to run my school. In fact, I never had enough money to run my school.
LOL doesn't cut it. That offers no solution.
Less paperwork? I can't speak for all systems, but in mine the paperwork was exactly equal -- an OSS or ISS letter to the parent and a Scantron sheet at the end of the month.
Oh, what students think about a teacher matters very much. I have never forgotten my student teaching experience. We were on a team at that middle school, and I was the student teacher in science, and we had another student teacher in English. The kids literally drove the English student teacher right of the school and out of education forever. Meanwhile, I had exactly the same kids and was having no significant problems. What was the one factor that was different? The teacher (or in this case student teacher).
School is the real world, too.
As I said If all the teachers refused to work in those environments the school system would have to come up with some solutions.
Lol was a solution. Ie lol at putting all the kids in the auditorium or gym. That's a wild funny solution to the lack of ISS classrooms or teachers.
You missed my point on the what students think. You can be a great teacher and do everything right and a student could think you are trash and have zero respect for you. Another student could love you. At the end of the day both kids have to or should follow the rules. Like my job, don't really matter what I think about my boss. I still gotta do what he says.
Now that doesn't mean the teacher should not do their part to be a good teacher. No. Teachers should strive to be the best they can. But that ain't no guarantee kids will respect you or follow your rules.
School is not the real world. You can't follow rules in the real world you get removed or thrown out or put in jail.
As I said If all the teachers refused to work in those environments the school system would have to come up with some solutions.
Lol was a solution. Ie lol at putting all the kids in the auditorium or gym. That's a wild funny solution to the lack of ISS classrooms or teachers.
You missed my point on the what students think. You can be a great teacher and do everything right and a student could think you are trash and have zero respect for you. Another student could love you. At the end of the day both kids have to or should follow the rules. Like my job, don't really matter what I think about my boss. I still gotta do what he says.
Now that doesn't mean the teacher should not do their part to be a good teacher. No. Teachers should strive to be the best they can. But that ain't no guarantee kids will respect you or follow your rules.
School is not the real world. You can't follow rules in the real world you get removed or thrown out or put in jail.
Again I ask, how long have you been a teacher?
And let me ask an added question -- how many different schools or school systems have you taught in?
What I just described is the exact situation at the school I was at .
Admin didn't want to put many kids in ISS. They told the teachers to fix and deal with the problems themselves.
Now what you said about ISS is correct. Obviously it's more preferred and easier than OSS.
But that doesn't change or dismiss what I said either.
There is usually only one ISS room and teacher. In these type of schools hell only bad kids from two classes could fill the one ISS class.
Easily one third of the class I dealt with needed to be removed from the room.
Then you had lazy administrators or an ISS program that was full up for the day.
You've not been real specific about what issues teachers are expected to handle on their own. Typically it's everything up to gross misconduct (which is defined differently by every system).
Then you had lazy administrators or an ISS program that was full up for the day.
You've not been real specific about what issues teachers are expected to handle on their own. Typically it's everything up to gross misconduct (which is defined differently by every system).
It could be a number of things.
School system looking down on ISS and OSS causing lack of support for the teachers.
Lazy admins
Lack of ISS classrooms and teachers
Yes teachers are expected to handle everything up until gross misconduct. Which is stupid and subjective and varies from school to school
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