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The information I cited is from the school system, it is the ratio on the state level. Some classes will have less than 20 some may have more than 20. Suggesting that "most" have 30+ students is wrong according to the actual data.
Right as a figured you are taking your experience in one district and making generalizations about the whole state from it. Now, not to offend you, but the Inland Empire is an economic wasteland. It is only natural to see higher student ratios in that area because there is little money.
Yes you are fabricating it, there has yet to be mass teacher lay offs in the state. Now, there is likely to be a lot of lay offs in the near future. But even if you laid off 20,000 elementary teachers (~13% of current elementary teachers) the ratio would be 23.5 on the state level.
The rest of what you said is just trying to put blame on the state, administrators etc. Yes, teachers can't do anything they want, but they spend most of their days with nobody watching them. So long as the kids do well on the stupid tests the administrators etc are happy. The teachers do not necessarily have freedom in what they teach, but they have quite a bit of freedom in how they teach.
Anyhow, I don't necessarily think you are being dishonest here, rather you trying to extend your experience in an economical deprived area and extend it to the state (or nation) as a whole. You can't do that. Improving the education in economically deprived areas is a hard problem, but again the teachers are part of the problem. I've seen the teachers in these areas and many of them are horrible, but what do you expect? Often they were educated by the very communities they are now teaching in.... Even with increased pay its hard to get "outsiders" to come in, the environment is just very alien to them. Sometimes you get folks that grew up in these communities that do very well and decide to come back and teach in them, but its not that common.
Let me ask you this, when was the last time you were even in an elementary classroom? You answer either way would prove my point.
Let me ask you this, when was the last time you were even in an elementary classroom? You answer either way would prove my point.
How about you make an actual argument? I will answer this, but only because you'll use it as an excuse if I don't. Last time I was involved with elementary education was last year.
It's obvious by reading these posts that the people who are knocking the teaching profession have little understanding of what they are talking about. I guess a bad experience can really leave a person with less than positive feelings about the educational system. But that doesn't mean every teacher is bad.
True, the entire system is completely and totally outdated and needs to be revamped from the top down. Unfortunately, this process is hindered by school board administrators and state legislators who sit in their glass towers earning $100,000 per year or more and haven't been in a classroom in 20 years, by union regulations, by federal intrusion, by parents who think they know as much about teaching as people with years of experience and advanced degrees in education, and by a plethora of other individuals and organizations with varying agendas. It will not change until the child is put first.
In ten years of teaching, I truly only saw less than five very bad teachers who probably should not have been teaching. More often, I saw new teachers buckling under the stress and looking for a way out, to the point where they were unable to do their job as well as they might have under better conditions. I agree that unions can be a hindrance to getting rid of bad teachers but most teachers I know join the union for the legal protection if offers if you are attacked by a student and through some natural human reflex you attempt to defend yourself. Have you seen a fifth grader lately? They don't make 'em like they used to.
I don't know why anyone continues to think that teachers get to teach what they want. In my state, we have a state mandated curriculum and teachers have to teach what is prescribed in two week chunks. The kids are benchmarked every two weeks to make sure they learned and the teacher taught those skills. I think it is pretty much this way everywhere now. We are legally held responsible for this and are also now legally responsible if a child is not reading on level by third grade. I don't have a problem with this but I do have a problem with uninformed people who say we are not held responsible.
Teachers spend lots of money on things for their students and classrooms and most don't even keep track of it, they do it because it has to be done and no one else gives a damn. Just today, I spent $8 on batteries, used two of my own stamps for postage (for free materials I was applying for for our school), and chipped in $5 to help pay the cost of the field trip that some of the students couldn't pay. (We have to pay for the gas in the bus, too, AND provide lunch for the bus driver). I could have put in requisition for the batteries, something I would have had to start 2 weeks ago, when I didn't know I'd need batteries. This is the silly inane stuff we put up with.
Since Monday, one very experienced and tough teacher in my building dealt with the following: One student punched another causing a nose bleed. The puncher called teacher names I won't type when teacher intervened, spat at teacher and other students, puncher was suspended. One girl came in late with a black eye. Admitted stepdad gave it to her, DHS called and came, girl sent home to grandma.
Another boy became very emotional and was continually crying. His mother had been released from prison last week and he and his siblings were back with mom at aunt's house. Kids admitted a year of abuse at the hands of exstepdad who they had been living with. DHS called, came, and removed the kids. Don't ask where dad was, he died in a knife fight last year. All this while teacher should have been giving various state mandated tests. And it's only fifth grade. And there are two more days in the week.
This is what teachers deal with, and is actually a fairly normal week at this particular school.
In most areas its a complete myth that teachers get "paid so poorly". Its teachers way of trying to extract more money from the tax payers. In California the average teacher pay was $64,000/year. But that is for 8 months of work, they are getting on average $8,000 a month! If they got paid 12 months at of the year they would get paid $96,000. That is not being paid "so poorly". Most areas I know of pay their teachers the same in relation to the cost of living.
Tax payers should not be paying teachers to play in the summer sun. On a monthly basis they get paid plenty, if they want more then can work in the summer.
The primary problem with teacher pay is it that pay is not associated with labor market conditions and talent. Just how long you've been on the job. Why should a physics teacher and an English teacher get paid the same when the market for physics teachers is much smaller?
I don't know one teacher who spends summer 'playing in the summer sun' any more than any other employee. My teacher friends spend many, many hours getting their continuing education work done over the summer.
If I did not truly want to teach I wouldn't. I hate the assumption that people only teach because they can do nothing else. Teachers are very under appreciated. Of course we ask for more money. Everyone asks for more money. Who doesn't want to get a raise? We've already been told there will be no pay increase for next year. Could I go out and get a job doing something else making more, yes. However I choose not to because I love my job, and I love knowing I make a difference. So tell me what am I choosing not to do as a special educator?
What specific private sector job does your Special Education degree prepare you for in addition to being a teacher? What is the salary range for the positions you are qualified for?
I hate the assumption that teachers are very under appreciated. I don't think anybody would argue that "those who can do/those who can't teach" applies to every single teacher, rather that perhaps its usually the case.
Regarding teachers asking for money, yeah its only natural. But when teachers are on TV complaining about not getting a raise and wanting better benefits when the rest of the nation (you know the tax payers) are getting pay cuts, benefit cuts or losing their jobs....it becomes a bit outrageous. I really do hope the tax payers put a sock in the teachers and unions mouth.
One of the problems is teachers are asking for collective raises and many tax payers have to articulate why they as individuals are worthy of a raise.
I don't know one teacher who spends summer 'playing in the summer sun' any more than any other employee. My teacher friends spend many, many hours getting their continuing education work done over the summer.
Yes, and many districts are no longer out all that long in the summer. We are only out about six weeks.
Please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. Isn't $64,000 low income for CA, especially areas like San Fransico? This number is an average, right? So their are many new and newer teachers making less, right? Also, are you sure they are working only 8 months?
I always took this expression to mean that those who, for whatever reason, cannot pursue their passion teach. For example, a brilliant singer with debilitating stage-fright chooses, instead, to lead the school choir. A permanantly injured athlete coaches the team. An anthropologist with a fear of flying gets his PHD and teaches college. Never did I connect this expression with the teaching profession in general and I certainly never thought it was meant to imply that teachers choose their profession because they are too unskilled or unintelligent to do anything else!
Teaching in itself is a skill, something that individuals either can or can't do. Acquiring and retaining a teaching certificate (at least in NY, where I am) takes work, dedication, and a lot of education -- and we certainly study more than pedagogy. Obviously, teachers become experts in their subject, but they also take classes on the historical, philosophical, and social foundations of education, along with the required psychology classes. Teachers receive a well-rounded education and can do many things; they choose to become teachers.
It saddens me when people knock my profession. We teachers seem to be such an easy target these days.
What are the many jobs that one can do with a Bachelors degree in:
Elementary Ed
Middle School Ed
English
History
Psychology
Sociology
Art
Physical Education
Earth Science(shortage field)
Business Education
Vocal Music
Instrumental Music
Special Education(shortage field)
What is the salary range for those private sector positions with a bachelors degree? Might be that when compared with the private sector teachers are overpaid. The fields where teachers can find equal pay or greater are those that there are shortages in.
Math
Physics
Chemistry
Yes, and many districts are no longer out all that long in the summer. We are only out about six weeks.
How many actual contract days are you contracted for? Probably about 190-192. That when divided by 5 work days a week=38.4 weeks which leaves how many weeks not worked? All of those days off spread out through the year add up. Is the six weeks off year round school? With multiple weeks off after each 9 on?
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