Best Texas Downtown (Houston, Dallas, San Antonio: condominium, crime, luxury)

[RonnieinDallas]

Originally Posted by TexasTallest

as if city-data has never been wrong.. heh.

i noticed all downtowns mapped give a "little" more area than just the CBD, but downtown Houston only gets one square mile added to its CBD, while "downtown Dallas" gets THREE square miles added to its CBD..? clearly the information is skewed. downtown is the CBD. the REAL downtown Dallas' population is a bit over 6,000 people. downtown Houstons population is apparently a bit under 6,000 people (assuming your jail population counts were correct). practically identical, and with the 5,000 residential units being built/planned for downtown Houston, we should overtake downtown Dallas and downtown Austin in the next 3-5 years as the "best downtown in Texas".. or at least by your logic.

Your last 2 posts are just pulling numbers out of a hat. Face it, downtown Houston's population is tiny considering it's overall population

[homeinatx]

Originally Posted by RonnieinDallas

This is City-data, so we use City-data numbers. Wikipedia is a horrible source for information

FYI, all the downtowns mapped give a little more area than just the CBD. I'll go with City-data's boundaries over your made up boundaries all day evey day

Even using those city data numbers and boundaries, which are highly contestable, downtown Austin has close to DOUBLE the population density of downtown Dallas, and downtown Dallas has a lower population density than the city of Dallas as a whole! Small wonder that it feels so empty...

[jbarn]

Originally Posted by PeopleAreStrange

I probably should have voted for San Antonio, but voted for Fort Worth since it has less votes than Houston or Dallas even though our DT is far better.

I don't get why Galveston is on the poll. It has a decent downtown, but is far smaller than the other choices and doesn't anchor a metro area like the other options (it's not a CBD).

People rave about downtown Ft. Worth, but it is not a real downtown per se. It is sort of like a Disneyworld version of a downtown - clean, sterile, touristy stuff, family friendly, not diverse...., but not many people living there, not many basic services, clears out after the visitors leave. I don't quite get the fascination folks have with downtown Fort Worth.

[JJG]

Originally Posted by jbarn

People rave about downtown Ft. Worth, but it is not a real downtown per se. It is sort of like a Disneyworld version of a downtown - clean, sterile, touristy stuff, family friendly, not diverse...., but not many people living there, not many basic services, clears out after the visitors leave. I don't quite get the fascination folks have with downtown Fort Worth.

Yet another person who thinks that DTFW ONLY consists of Sundance Square....

[jbarn]

Originally Posted by TexasTallest

How many high rises are U/C in downtown Dallas? One?

And how many "walled fortresses" that have no retail or housing, or connectivity to the street does Houston have under construction? Quite a lot it seems. I don't exactly think this should be something to be boasting about. Highrises make a downtown look good from a distance, but as both Houston and Dallas know quite well, highrises do not a vibrant downtown make. I would much rather have low or midrises, or reconfigured buildings with restaurants, retail, restaurants, than highrises any day. This is where Dallas is excelling much more than Houston. Look at the "vibrant" downtowns in Texas....Fort Worth, San Antonio, Austin... their downtowns are not full of walled skyscrapers that look good from afar. Their downtowns actually don't look like much from afar, but once you get to street level there you are quite surprised, in a good way. Houston's downtown is now, and seems to be heading even moreso in the direction of being a financial district full of skyscrapers,.... beautiful from afar, but terribly dissapointing once you get in the middle of it.
One other area where Dallas's downtown is really ahead of Houston's is in the number of things that you can actually do in our downtown, or within walking distance of downtown. We have the museum of art, science museum, county museum, kennedy museum, sculpture garden, Dallas World Aquarium, Klyde Warren Park, main street garden, symphony center, opera house, theatre center, performing arts center, observation tower, west end historical district, original Neimans. Houston has a bunch of pretty tall buildings, and......... you get my drift.

[jbarn]

Originally Posted by RMFW

Why build any major new buildings in downtown Dallas when you've got all of those incredible circa 1987 skyline-defining skyscrapers all sitting there at 50% occupancy? I guess we're still all just waiting for the market to catch up, huh.

Luckily, many of those buildings are now being reconfigured to include housing, hotels, restaurants, and retail. In the last month, three vacant skyscrapers have announced massive rehabilitation plans. We are actually running out of buildings that are candidates for rehabilitation. We are creating a real, sustainable downtown that will have some remaining character.

[jbarn]

Originally Posted by Justified.

A detailed description of my OVERALL combined (present & future) top 5 downtown areas in Texas:

Dallas - One word connectivity. Downtown Dallas is surrounded by burgeoning neighborhoods; Uptown, CityPlace, Deep Ellum, Farmers Market, West Dallas (Trinity Groves), all connected by a variety of pedestrian friendly transit options. Developers have taken notice of the potential of DT becoming a residential and retail mecca. Massive mixed-use developments are on the horizon (including several supertalls). Dallas isn't struggling to attract downtown residents but office growth. Dallas only receives the nod over Austin because it's part of a major metropolitan area with a vast contingent of diverse domestic and international companies. Dallas' economy is a beast. What exactly is the main industry here?

Austin - Love the potential of this place. Downtown Austin is inherently blessed beyond that of the other major Texas cities. As if, a large university and state government base for anchors weren't enough, Austin is also a major high-tech hub with a dose of the entertainment industry mixed in. Youth, brains and vast incomes are everywhere and the majority of these types want to be right smack downtown. Oh, and Austin has some absolutely beautiful in-town greenspace. The biggest issues right now are growing pains, and the lack of maturity that cities like Houston and Dallas offer. A slow down is needed to allow the city to take a breath, look around and catch up. Not going to happen anytime soon though.

Houston - A few words, can build at will. This is Texas' most dynamic city (construction-wise) right now and a high-rise holy place. The O&G industry is home in Houston and this industry requires A LOT of space. Attitudes here have changed and more and more people want to reside inside of the loop. The problem for downtown is, the main areas of activity are 8-15 miles to the west. The financially able and willing city dwellers are having to decide between being pioneers in downtown or to take the road already paved and live in Midtown or Uptown. In DT, office growth is not a problem, like it is in Dallas; getting people to choose DT living is the challenge. To the Houstonians reading this, sorry, your city receives an automatic downgrade for no zoning. It was a factor in the rankings. I do worry about an economic slowdown in Houston more than the other Texas metros. The impact here could be much greater.

Fort Worth - The biggest benefit for this city is the same as for Dallas. It's part of a major metro area. Unfortunately, for Fort Worth, it's also the biggest challenge. While FW's problem isn't it's DT area (vibrant & active from a pedestrian perspective). The issue is, that once you're outside of the CBD things go downhill fairly quickly. Also, FW is not only in a death match in attracting attention from perspective residents and companies from Dallas, now, cities like Irving and Plano are big players. Lack of corporate attention and high-rise development stunt this city's growth potential. Being part of DFW is a blessing and a curse. Sometimes, I'm a little concerned that Fort Worth has been tight cast into Dallas' blue collar neighbor to the west with a cute downtown.

San Antonio - I'll keep my San Antonio synopsis short and sweet. This is Texas' playground. It's where Texans who want to stay in Texas to vacation, vacation. Downtown is mainly what we know about SA. Problem is, there's not much corporate or young professional presence in this city overall. The corporations that are here mainly choose suburban campuses. Downtown is corporate and young professional starved. Can a vibrant residential scene even exist in San Antonio alongside massive amounts of tourists? Hopefully, we'll find out the answer to this question soon. Like Fort Worth though, lack of corporate attention and high-rise development, stunt SA's growth potential.

Great post, spot on.

[jbarn]

Originally Posted by RonnieinDallas

I have a really hard time believing any of this, unless you were there early in the morning. The Arts District is right next to Klyde Warren Park, and it's always busy on the weekends. Plus, there are pretty big church crowds nearby. Main street is packed with brunch spots and there's always a big brunch/lunch/happy hour crowd. Main Street Park also stays busy on the weekends.

Here's what downtown actually looks like on an average day:

DOWNTOWN DALLAS, INC.: MAIN STREET DISTRICT - YouTube


Nothing like what was described above

I am with you on this. I am calling BS on this one.

[Campeador]

Originally Posted by jbarn

Great post, spot on.

Seriously? The comma splices and poor diction were driving me mad. The content was poor too!

[Campeador]

Originally Posted by jbarn

People rave about downtown Ft. Worth, but it is not a real downtown per se. It is sort of like a Disneyworld version of a downtown - clean, sterile, touristy stuff, family friendly, not diverse...., but not many people living there, not many basic services, clears out after the visitors leave. I don't quite get the fascination folks have with downtown Fort Worth.

Spend some time there before you opine; it would help you have a more accurate take.