Texas Forum Ideology Poll (Commerce, Point: house, taxes, living)

[Bo]

Originally Posted by Dopo

Somebody explain to me wtf is "Fiscal liberal"?
Is that a person that is against corporate subsidies, sending foreign aid to other countries and closing US military bases in other countries?

Free-spender. Someone who believes that the main obstacle to curing society's ills is insufficient government spending.

Has nothing to do with what those ills are.

[UTHORNS96]

Fiscally Liberal/Socially Conservative moderate

I am big on government funds used to build up infrastructure and for social programs to help those less fortunate (and NO I'm not talking about lazy people).

Socially, for the most part I'm on more of the conservative side due to my Christian beliefs, however, I didn't pot full on conservative because I believe a lot of social conservatives are mouth breathers that don't really know what the heck they're talking about.

[thenewtexan]

By Texas standards, fiscally moderate, socially very liberal. On a national scale, fiscally conservative, socially moderate.

[jerbear30]

I think people who are fiscally liberal tend to not see "government" or use the term "government" in the same way as fiscal conservatives. We probably don't even see ourselves as "fiscally liberal" since we don't fundamentally make the same kinds of assumptions as people who do see themselves as "fiscal conservatives."

The main difference is that "fiscal liberals" put a higher priority on society as such. Like John Stuart Mill, we are more apt to gauge the quality of a society by how well most of its members are doing as people, rather than by how well its businesses are doing.

Following from that, we tend to see corporate entities in a very different light than fiscal conservatives. To a "fiscal liberal" a corporation is falsely called a "citizen," and actually is more like what conservatives would call "government" in terms of its influence on a society. We don't assume that a profitable corporation is evil, but we also don't assume that a profitable corporation is always indication of something working right, as so many fiscal conservatives do.

[TexasReb]

Originally Posted by thenewtexan

By Texas standards, fiscally moderate, socially very liberal. On a national scale, fiscally conservative, socially moderate.

This is a very good broad point! It has been more than once that I have talked with people from the NE or West Coast who have said they considered themselves "conservative" where they came from, but found themselves labeled a "liberal" here in Texas. That is why, naturally, polls like this are very subjective. Hell, even among Texans they probably are. After all, a young native Texan from Austin might think his/her self conservative...then find out that they are considered "radical left" in Waxahatchie! LOL

[TexasReb]

Originally Posted by jerbear30

I think people who are fiscally liberal tend to not see "government" or use the term "government" in the same way as fiscal conservatives. We probably don't even see ourselves as "fiscally liberal" since we don't fundamentally make the same kinds of assumptions as people who do see themselves as "fiscal conservatives."

The main difference is that "fiscal liberals" put a higher priority on society as such. Like John Stuart Mill, we are more apt to gauge the quality of a society by how well most of its members are doing as people, rather than by how well its businesses are doing.

Following from that, we tend to see corporate entities in a very different light than fiscal conservatives. To a "fiscal liberal" a corporation is falsely called a "citizen," and actually is more like what conservatives would call "government" in terms of its influence on a society. We don't assume that a profitable corporation is evil, but we also don't assume that a profitable corporation is always indication of something working right, as so many fiscal conservatives do.

This is a great post and with very good points, but I have to quibble in that most of us true fiscal conservatives are not only not at all supportive of "corporate subsidies", but consider it just as much welfare as "welfare queens" living in subsidized apartment complexes getting paid by tax dollars to have more illegitimate children. Both are anathema to fiscal conservatives.

[TX75007]

Everyone is a liberal until they get mugged.

[War Beagle]

Originally Posted by Dopo

Somebody explain to me wtf is "Fiscal liberal"?
Is that a person that is against corporate subsidies, sending foreign aid to other countries and closing US military bases in other countries?

Fiscal liberals are the people who want to take money from the productive people in society to give to the people who want to live off of section 8, EBT cards, TANF payments, government-paid cell phones, Medicaid, etc.

[UTHORNS96]

Originally Posted by War Beagle

Fiscal liberals are the people who want to take money from the productive people in society to give to the people who want to live off of section 8, EBT cards, TANF payments, government-paid cell phones, Medicaid, etc.

Nope, don't see any political bias in this answer at all

[jerbear30]

Originally Posted by War Beagle

Fiscal liberals are the people who want to take money from the productive people in society to give to the people who want to live off of section 8, EBT cards, TANF payments, government-paid cell phones, Medicaid, etc.

Come on, War Beagle, you do understand that things aren't that simple. For one, you have absolutely no coherent definition of the term "productive," which could mean a whole host of things. My best friend's dad has worked as a farm hand his whole life. He's been more physically "productive" of the movement of goods and services than many small business owners, working his fingers to the bone. He had a heart attack a few years ago with no insurance. (BTW I know this story sounds made-up but I can assure you it's not). Now he's going to be paying the hospital bill for the rest of his life. Oh, golly gee, I guess he should've been more industrious or something. I'd rather pay 20 or even 30% more in taxes and have a national single payer health care system. Instead, my best friend's dad goes without while my wife and I await our second baby with bookoo pharmaceutical samples floating around our house and a room reserved at the Memorial Hermann. This disparity is morally repugnant and needs to be changed. That is the sentiment that defines a fiscal liberal. And btw, I can accept the thinking behind a fair amount of fiscal conservatism, so long as the society as a whole is considered. I don't feel the need to simplify the logic behind fiscal conservative thinking like you do mine.