Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I currently work at a Golf Course in Dallas and my main job is herbicidal spraying. Ive only been doing it for the last 2 years or so but I want to get deeper into it. Im currently 23 and while I have a very stable job, its just not enough money. I want to start a family and ive decided to try to make this my career, I graduated HS but really became a slacker after that and never tried college and at this point my bills wont allow me to.
I guess what im really looking for is just info or a mentor I can speak to that has put in time and is currently working in the profession.
I can't speak for the present state of the pesticide industry but it used to be a good career especially if you had your own business. Are you State-certified or do you work under someone elses certification? That would be one aspect of going it on your own.
I used to have a friend who came to the Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service (APHIS) of the USDA from the golf courses of North Carolina. He's probably retired now but when I last saw him in the 1990s he was a GS15 on the APHIS staff in Maryland (+-$130,000). Before me joining the APHIS staff as a wildlife biologist, as a field agricultural officer in Louisiana and Texas I had a Federal pesticide certification and worked with numerous Federal and State pesticides programs. In doing so I also got to know a few successful businessmen who owned their own pesticide businesses. I especially recall one in Lubbock in the 1980s who was very successful because he had the licensing and (certs?) to do fumigations which most of the licensed applicators could not do. I sort of doubt this fellow had any college but he was definitely an intelligent guy.
I'm sorry but I don't know any of these guys anymore and since retirement I have not stayed in touch with the industry. Mostly I just wanted to encourage you in your career choice and wish you luck. Just be careful with pesticides. Even nowadays some can be pretty dangerous if misused.
I currently work under someone elses certification but I have been looking into getting my own. I consider myself to be a pretty intelligent guy, I just got really into the party scene in highschool and have been catching up a bit every since. I just want to be able to take care of my family and herbicides seems like something I could easily make a career of if the industry still pays. Thank you very much for your encouragement, I really have no one to talk to about this and even if I want to research it I dont even know where to start.
I'm really not sure what all is involved in Texas state pesticide certification but I would think a minimal knowledge of the State pesticide regulations (maybe some Federal) would be a significant part of it. I'm sure most of these are online. You also may want to pick the brains of the person whose certification you are working under for a start. Try to see how they got their certification and go from there. And too, if you can speak to someone personally involved with the Texas Department of Agriculture (TDA) pesticide programs, that would probably be helpful.
It been a lot of years since my Federal certification but I was given much of my training by the USDA, APHIS. Much of it involved a working knowledge of the Federal Insecticide, Fungicide, Rodenticide Act (FIFRA) and other Federal environmental protection laws. Other parts that I recall was a small amount of entomological training and SCBA training. I had to supervise and monitor fumigations as a field officer.
I hope something here is helpful. It's not as intimidating as it may appear. My career eventually worked into preparing risk analyses and environmental documents for large scale pesticide applications so I had to work with environmental laws every day. You just need to get past the tests for certification.
You sound like someone I would have enjoyed mentoring. Best of luck. Go for it!
Thanks again for the help you could give, ill take your advise and try to just put my big boy pants on and get to work. Maybe someone else will stumble on this forum and toss in some more info, untill then ill work on looking up what is needed to get the license. Thank you again.
I would be glad to try and answer some questions for you, but I need more information from you first
1. what is it that you are looking to continue......do you want to continue in golf course management specifically or do you want to be more involved in pesticide/chemical application and are you looking to be involved in landscape and residential/commercial landscape chemical application or in agricultural chemical application
2. are you looking to stay in the DFW area or are you willing to move where needed
3. are you looking to further classroom education or just try and work up through industry experience
lets try and cover the basics
if you are trying to be involved in landscape (residential and commercial landscapes like apartments and office complexes) then you will either be looking at working for a landscape company or with truegreen chemlawn
if you get with truegreen chemlawn the only people that make a real livable wage are those that are in sales.....this is true for most of the landscape/horticulture business at this point......being a field applicator is an entry level job for the most part and with a landscape company to be a field foreman that makes a decent living you will need more knowledge than chemical application things like irrigation, hardscapes, plants and where to properly place them and on and on and you will probably need some cost estimating experience as well even if you are not really selling......with just chemical applications it is truegreen chemlawn for the most part and you make a living selling for them not applying
if you are looking at agricultural application (large scale sprayers made by Deere and IH) then you will need to be in the Valley or in west Texas where you can live cheaper, where there is large scale agriculture and where you can get a job riding a spray rig and applying chemicals
if you are looking to remain in the golf industry then you need to start learning about turf, turf diseases, soils, fertilizers, small engines and equipment maintenance, irrigation and not just herbicides, but all pesticides (insecticides, fungicides, herbicides (kill weeds), algicides and nematicides) with emphasis on the first three especially
in Texas it is a bit screwed up still, but they are working to straighten out the licensing at this time....in the past it was the Texas Structural Pest Control Board that covered things like termite control for homes and offices, roach control, insect and rodent control and the like in restaurants and schools ect and it was the Texas Department of Agriculture that controlled licenses for grains, grain storage, farms greenhouse operations and the like, but the one area that was messed up was turn and ornamental you could get a license to apply to landscapes and lawns through either of them basically
now the Texas structural Pest Control Board is gone and part of the TDA, but you can still get a license for turf and ornamental through either area
I believe most landscapers still get theirs through the TDA part of it
Lawn and ornamental - Inspection and/or control of pests of ornamental plants, shade trees and lawns. in a park or adjacent to a residence, business establishment, industrial plant, institutional building or street.
as you are now working for a golf course where you make applications strictly for the golf course and on golf course property you would be a non-commercial applicator because you are not going out onto others property and doing for hire applications
if you were to go to work for chemlawn, terminex, west Texas agri-plex or the like where you were going to peoples homes, businesses, farms or other locations and making applications for others for a fee/profit then you would be a commercial applicator and it would really be just as easy (and probably better liability wise) for you to apply under their license since a licenses applicator (commercial or non-commercial) can have someone do applications for them as long as they are able to be in constant contact (phone call away or business band radio contact away or walk around the corner and get them in person) of there is any issue
that is how you are able to make applications now for your employer.....someone where you work has a (most likely non-commercial) license and you make applications under their "supervision", but part of "moving up" and proving yourself might be to discuss with them getting your own turf and ornamental non-commercial license because it shows you are able to apply yourself and you are looking to learn and advance
the test are EXTREMELY easy IMO (I do have a horticulture degree though and have worked in the greenhouse industry in the past as well as other areas of ag) and you can get the study materials on line or from your county extension office and really you have to just memorize them and ass with a 70%
I would say get the one for turf and the one for ornamental since the course probably has landscaping that is not turf as well and the questions are very similar as are most of the chemicals (many are the same chemicals)
as far as gold and moving up it is my belief and personal opinion that the #1 factor to moving up is moving on......you need to switch jobs as openings happen and with each job switch you need to attempt to get more pay, more of a "title" and more responsibility and more ability to gain knowledge.....I personally HATE to tell people to job jump, but as far as I have ever seen that is how people do it in the golf industry even those with a degree......the vast majority of schools that still offer a "turf" horticulture degree also have an associated university golf course where the students do their internship doing the exact jobs you are doing for about the same pay and then when they graduate they usually move on for $1-2 more dollars per hour IF THEY CAN and then they continue that pattern
in Texas it is Texas A&M and Texas Tech that have this and Stephen F. Austin has turf classes (taught by a former turf professor at Texas Tech), but SFA does not have an affiliated golf course while A&M and Tech do (SFA is more arboretum and plant materials focused where they are actually very strong).......you also need to remember sports fields as well.....The Ballpark at Arlington, High School Stadiums, City Parks and on and on......as long as you are "turf" and moving up in pay and responsibility you are making "progress" and while I would say that the further you get away from "golf" the harder it might be to get back to golf specifically sports fields are probably not that far away and city parks ir probably just close enough if you get a good "title" and experience to go with that jump and responsibility and rate of pay
I cannot emphasis enough for golf especially the ability to maintain and do small repairs on equipment will be HUGE....if you can weld, sharpen blades, small engine maintenance done PROPERLY and generally taking very good care of the equipment is a MUST HAVE skill.....I am not saying necessarily to go take a small engine class, but if overtime is available or if there is downtime and the equipment guy needs a hand YOU need to be in there proving yourself to the point where whoever is your supervisor understands that you are gaining knowledge
the other thing for golf is turf diseases and insects and fertilizer and irrigation......you need to be readily able to see the difference between poor irrigation coverage because of a damaged head VS dollar spot (a fungus) VS chinch bugs VS grass that is just burning up from the heat and should not have been planted or grass that was scalped or cut too low or maybe even too strong of a fertilizer application because the spreader had an issue
I would strongly suggest you work towards getting an instigators license
I do not remember the steps off hand, but at some point to move up (to install) I believe you need to have worked under someone else or you need to have had the lower level license (to repair) for a period of time......it should all be on the above links and someone where you work should have any type of license to be able to have you as an "apprentice" (if there is any apprentice time needed).....if someone where you work is unwilling to help/assist you in that fashion (if needed) then start looking for a new job at some other golf course and tell them it is because you wanted to further yourself and you were refused that opportunity
again I am not sure all that is required, but if there is any apprenticeship needed to become a full installer than your work place should be willing to have someone assist you with that if they value you as an employee if not they are idiots......DO NOT LEAVE UNTIL YOU HAVE SECURED A NEW BETTER JOB OF COURSE
for repairs I believe you simply pass the test after taking the 40 hour course......for the irrigators course and the pesticide course I would inquire with your employer if they would be willing to cover some or all of the cost of obtaining the license...they might say no they might say here is $50 dollars they might ask why you want that
in the past Richland College (DCCCD) had some turf and hort classes, but they have canceled those and now it looks like TCC is the only one in the area with those courses
soil fertility and pest control are the ones I see that would be the most beneficial....I would first talk with your employer to see if they would place any value in you taking any of those types of courses, if they would be willing to help with any cost or if they feel there is someone there that can work with you to teach you what you need to know on the job and help you advance.....if they show no interest in any of it I would secure gainful employment FIRST and then tell them hasta la vista baby and let your new employer know that you are looking to advance your education
I would be asking your current employer if equipment maintenance and upkeep, stronger chemical and fertilizer knowledge, turf disease and insect knowledge or irrigation knowledge would help you move up the fastest or be the most valuable
it is my opinion that if you are motivated you should be able to have a non-commercial applicators license in 3-4 months for turf and ornamental and within 6 months (from now) also have the beginning irrigators license ALSO
I would look into ALL industry and associated industry associations
all of the above have jobs sections you need to peruse those jobs from time to time and see what the requirements are for those jobs and be thinking how you are moving yourself towards taking the next step for one of those jobs or a similar type job and you need to be thinking about who it is at your club that holds a similar position and how you can work closer with them to gain their knowledge and to gain their recommendation if you are looking to apply for a more advance position somewhere else and also so you can talk with them and ask them where they feel you would best serve yourself and your current employer by advancing your knowledge and skills......fert, irrigation, disease/pest, mechanical or any and all of them and what they feel would be the best use of your time to meet those goals
I would try and spend as little money as possible on formal education (even community college) until someone above you with decision making authority has clearly said yes if you took a small engine class to better your skills that would go a long ways towards moving up here AND ELSEWHERE (you are not looking to pigeon hole yourself to the single employer) so make it clear you are looking at the best LONG TERM SKILLS not what gets you a buck an hour more for a position your current employer can never fill, but moves you away from the longer term goals you have for yourself.....I believe the licenses for pest and irrigation would be beneficial either way and they are a nominal cost......college courses on the other hand make sure there is LONG TERM value there before moving ahead......as you can see some of those listed positions on the above association sites have no formal degree requirements, but more experience requirements
I have laid out mostly associated with golf/turf if you are actually more interested in agriculture applications on veg farms or cotton farms or grain farms or truegreen/landscape type employment well the truegreen is simple learn how to measure a lawn and how to sell the landscape is learn how to measure square feet of flower beds, estimate plant spacing, lawn spacing, irrigation needs and some sales and pricing if you want to ever do more than hard labor for even a major company
any further questions I would be glad to try and answer good luck
PS a few other things.....you need to start paying attention to what you are spraying each time, when you are spraying it, why you are spraying it, where you are spraying it, what the condition of what you are spraying it on is
this is how you yourself can gain knowledge about what it is you are doing other than what I call "flinging chemicals"
you need to start looking up golf turf disease websites and weed websites and turf pest websites and looking at what those issues look like in the photos and how they are described in the text and then looking at what is going on with your course where you work
you specifically said you sprayed herbicides (for killing weeds) I would imagine you are spraying fungicides and pesticides as well......you need to become familiar with the chemicals you are using, what they are treating, when those issues arise, what it looks like in real life and also the rotation of "chemistry" which is chemicals doing the same job, but with a different method or mode of action.......you rotate chemicals since insects and diseases have very short life spans and if you were to use the same chemical over and over resistance builds up and the chemical stops working......so for instance in greenhouse insect control you usually make three scheduled sprays of the same mode of action chemical and then you switch to a different mode of action chemical for the next three sprays and then hopefully to a third mode of action for three more sprays until you switch back to the first chemical again (that would be a lot of spraying, but it happens)......same with fungus and disease......this can change from chemical/mode of action and disease/pest, but that is the general idea......if you are going in with one thing one time and another thing the next time you will find yourself where nothing works (especially if you have poor conditions overall)
so you need to be reading about what you are spraying and why and what leads to the conditions you are treating and then you should be on the course spotting things as they happen even before you are sent to treat them and you should know that spot is from chinch bugs and here is why VS that is dollar spot and here is why VS that is just a divot that was not replaced properly VS that is where grubs are eating my roots and over time it will be second nature to you and you will know what chemicals you are going for or to be sent out with before you are even told
Last edited by TexasVines; 08-15-2013 at 04:52 PM..
Thats a ton to read over, ill get back to you tomorrow and im GREATLY appreciate you taking the time to type that up and ill try to have some responses soon. Thank you so much.
Sorry it took so long, had some internet issues and health issues but im fine now so ill jump into your questions and add some of my own if you dont mind.
1. Right now I work at Dallas Athletic Club and while I do drive many other tractors, my main job is to spray. My rig is a 300 Gallon Toro Sprayer we got last year so its basically brand new. I wouldnt mind going away from the golf course management as in spraying windmills but jumping into another field that has higher pay is also an option for me. Agricultural Chemical Application sounds like a better place for me to be honest though, I enjoy the open fields to residential but then again, I go where the money leads me.
2. Preferably I dont want to go more then an hour or two away from the DFW area but for the right money I wouldnt mind moving.
3. Id like to further my education while working up, ive always been book smart so learning in classrooms isnt an issue.
I know a bit about turf but im only in the beginning stages as far as the diseases, soil and fertilizer goes, kind of on a need to know basis at work. Im allowed free range with things like Trimac and any MSMA but fertilizers im given, told where to spray, do it and im usually done with it.
I actually have an uncle, not close to him, on my wife's side that sprays out in West Texas around pipelines and windmills I believe so I know just a little about that. As far as engines, I know only very very little, like when its time to take it to our shop we have on the course but I think it might be smart to brush up on it a bit atleast.
Being kind of a "jack of all trades" at DAC I have done a bit or fertilizing, some pesticide spraying and irrigation though Id say most of my knowledge is in the herbicide section. I know just a little about all the rest but I do have some knowledge. Ive put in pipes and sprinklers, just not planned out where they are suppose to go. Ive helped fix irrigation leaks and breaks, it was just never my job to find them or figure out why it happened. Ive also laid sod on bad grass but, again, since it wasnt my job, I dont always know what caused it. So as you can see, while ive been involved with a lot of things you listed, I only know a little.
That being said, Id have to say what most interests me is probably the agriculture application, seems like something I would be more comfortable in and ill do a bit of research on it, see just what kind of jobs there are in Texas for that.
At this point I do know what main chemicals I have to spray and Im required to fill out paperwork for every tank I spray including name, rate, total used, ect. So as far as the herbicides I use, I have a decent amount of knowledge.
Id like to thank you for taking your time to type this out, its been a great help to me and I hope it will kick me in the butt and get me motivated to start moving towards a career. I was told by my boss, who is also my father in Law, that I had to be patient when I asked about a license of my own, I will do research for the license and go back to him and make it more professional this time. Again, thank you.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
