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Lived and worked in Houston for 30 years. Dallas never came up in my circle. Irving did not Dallas. London did. Singapore and Saudia did bit not Dallas. Global oil is a different animal where little ole cities didn't matter. LOL.
But this I can somewhat agree with. A large part of the aesthetics of those cities come from creative mindset, which seems better fostered in those areas than in much of Texas.
Same way that TreasureValley's "Houston is the least physically attractive city of any size in Texas" is also a subjective opinion. But to think the rest of Texas is any more attractive is completely incorrect. The Hill Country and Big Bend don't attract as much outdoor tourism dollars as California.
During the 2016 elections, Kane County, IL voted for a tax increase to rehabilitate the county's portion of the Chicagoland forest system--something that would never happen here in Texas. Neighboring DuPage County does not hesitate to vote for tax increases to keep the public school system competitive.
Civic pride is a virtue of the North; something missing in Texas. The Southern anti-tax mindset does not realize that maintenance of the public goods keeps communities attractive for new comers. Southerners are more concerned about the short-term gain in their checkbook rather than the long-term appreciation in real estate values.
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Originally Posted by kwr
I would add that Houston visibly has more trees than Dallas. One of the things I missed living in Dallas was not seeing mature trees. Maybe it was because I relocated from Atlanta to Dallas, and trees were in an abundance in Atlanta.
Forgot to mention add your quote in my last post.
I've always admired L.A. in satellite photos. It's easy to figure out the boundaries of the urban/suburban areas.
Looking at Houston in Google Maps satellite view requires me to turn on the labels to figure out what part of town I'm in since almost the entire metro is covered in trees/greenery. Even with the few trees left on yards and other landscaped areas, Houston still looks green on the satellite photos. It's time to cut more down! haha
The OP and Overdog need to get a room if they keep talking about Houston vs. Dallas summer weather. There are posters on another thread in the L.A. forum complaining about 72 degree summer highs:
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Originally Posted by JonathanLB
Give me 90 over 70 any day. I guess if I worked all day in an office, didn’t have a pool, and had limited free time maybe 70 isn’t the worst because you’re walking around and you’re comfortable enough. Like it’s great for hiking, way better than 90. But I want the maximum number of hot days - I love swimming and anything below 80 and arguably 85 isn’t swimming weather. Large swaths of LA rarely ever get that warm except the middle of summer maybe and that’s true everywhere else in the US too.
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Originally Posted by JonathanLB
Look at today, another miserable day in LA. It was 88 today in Portland and gorgeous, it was 101 in Las Vegas, and it was... 72 in Los Angeles. Absolutely pathetic. If you want that year around, well ok, but I certainly don't. That's way too cold for summer. It's 80+ almost everywhere by now, even miserable Portland, and it seriously shouldn't be 16 degrees warmer in Portland 1,000 miles to the North. I think LA weather is great for people who want very moderate temperatures and hate the cold but also hate the heat.
BTW, my pool is now ruined by seabreeze fronts and the non-stop rain from last month! It's definitely hard to maintain a pool in Houston outside of a drought.
The OP and Overdog need to get a room if they keep talking about Houston vs. Dallas summer weather. There are posters on another thread in the L.A. forum complaining about 72 degree summer highs:
Whatever man, sorry I hurt you so.
The summer nights are much more pleasant are much more pleasant in Dallas just as the winters are much more pleasant in Houston. Pick your poison.
However, heat index does not account for cooling sea-breeze/rainfall (which Houston has more of) and hotter solar radiation (which Dallas has more of). Hence the comfort factor of Houston in summer compared to Dallas.
I still have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to "Sea-Breeze" in Houston, though Dallas is windier.
-People in Houston place a greater emphasis on their culinary and fine arts scene. People in Dallas place a greater emphasis on shopping and nightlife.
-Dallas has a far more consumerist mindset. People in Houston are far more laid back.
-Both Dallas and Houston have a massive number of immigrants but the flavor and feel Houston is certainly more international. Ive always said "Dallas is an American city with international residents, Houston is an international city with international residents".
And an opinion is not truth, no matter how widely held it is.
Plus, make sure also that you're not conflating your own bias with what people truly believe.
Again, nothing you've said is really compelling in the context of your argument ("that Houston is ugliest city of any size in Texas"). You're free to your belief, and I'm free to expose any faultiness behind it.
"Ugliest city of any size" is more hyperbole than anything else, but based on just about every poll ever, Houston ranks poorly in aesthetics.
On maters of Aesthetics, which at the least have a very large element of subjectivity to them, It's hard to say, probably impossible to say if one place is prettier than another. However, I think that broad consensus is useful for these sorts of things, and in that realm, Houston gets creamed, over and over.
Now you might say "That isn't fair, I like Houston!" ok fine, but 99% of people walking down an average street in Chicago are going to say that Chicago's street is nicer. A smaller majority will agree that the Average Dallas street has better aesthetics.
There isn't anything wrong with saying, "hey, Houston has some really pretty parts and I like the vegetation."
Fine, that doesn't change that Houston has more parking lots than any other city in the US, probably the world, and most people don't find parking lots very attractive. No really, they actually don't.
Add to that the irregular and big setbacks, generic strip-mall architecture and flat landscape.
There are tons of studies on what makes a street attractive to walk or drive down. Ratios, setbacks, etc. Based on those ratios you can determine with scientific accuracy which streets in Paris will be popular.
There is some science to this stuff, it isn't all pure opinion. Thats how people design things they know other people will on a whole, like.
Now its fine to say "Ok, well no place is perfect, Houston might have alot of ugly street layouts, but I like the vegetation, so that more or less makes up for that, for me and if you combine that with how dynamic the city is and all the interesting and nice people who live here, I think it's an awesome place to live."
You are free to have your feelings hurt and go: "Yeah man, well that is like, just your opinion, man." but like it or not, it's a pretty commonly held opinion.
"Ugliest city of any size" is more hyperbole than anything else, but based on just about every poll ever, Houston ranks poorly in aesthetics.
On maters of Aesthetics, which at the least have a very large element of subjectivity to them, It's hard to say, probably impossible to say if one place is prettier than another. However, I think that broad consensus is useful for these sorts of things, and in that realm, Houston gets creamed, over and over.
Now you might say "That isn't fair, I like Houston!" ok fine, but 99% of people walking down an average street in Chicago are going to say that Chicago's street is nicer. A smaller majority will agree that the Average Dallas street has better aesthetics.
There isn't anything wrong with saying, "hey, Houston has some really pretty parts and I like the vegetation."
Fine, that doesn't change that Houston has more parking lots than any other city in the US, probably the world, and most people don't find parking lots very attractive. No really, they actually don't.
Add to that the irregular and big setbacks, generic strip-mall architecture and flat landscape.
There are tons of studies on what makes a street attractive to walk or drive down. Ratios, setbacks, etc. Based on those ratios you can determine with scientific accuracy which streets in Paris will be popular.
There is some science to this stuff, it isn't all pure opinion. Thats how people design things they know other people will on a whole, like.
Now its fine to say "Ok, well no place is perfect, Houston might have alot of ugly street layouts, but I like the vegetation, so that more or less makes up for that, for me and if you combine that with how dynamic the city is and all the interesting and nice people who live here, I think it's an awesome place to live."
You are free to have your feelings hurt and go: "Yeah man, well that is like, just your opinion, man." but like it or not, it's a pretty commonly held opinion.
That's an interesting perspective. I don't really agree. There are lots of factors that comprise civic aesthetics, such as landscaping, foliage, maintenance of infrastructure, natural setting, and architectural design. Houston and Dallas are pretty good at some, not so good at others. You're focusing purely on the street, talking about things like building setbacks and FA ratios that most people don't care about or understand.
I don't think either Houston or Dallas is particularly beautiful or particularly ugly, but they both have specific strengths in terms of what comprises the beauty in their cities. Dallas has generally strong streetscaping and a focus on unique and cutting edge architecture. Houston has great natural foliage, as well as a focus on aesthetically pleasing and functional public spaces and parks. People do have preferences in terms of what they find aesthetically important.
I can think of a variety of large cities I personally consider uglier than both - Detroit, Hartford, Newark, Cleveland, Toledo, Phoenix, Las Vegas, Oklahoma City and San Antonio all come to mind. Houston and Dallas aren't the best or the worst here imo.
The funny thing is that I started this thread hoping to hear from more people who have lived in both. While a number of people who have lived in both chimed in, so have a bunch of clueless homers for some reason.
That's an interesting perspective. I don't really agree. There are lots of factors that comprise civic aesthetics, such as landscaping, foliage, maintenance of infrastructure, natural setting, and architectural design. Houston and Dallas are pretty good at some, not so good at others. You're focusing purely on the street, talking about things like building setbacks and FA ratios that most people don't care about or understand.
I don't think either Houston or Dallas is particularly beautiful or particularly ugly, but they both have specific strengths in terms of what comprises the beauty in their cities. Dallas has generally strong streetscaping and a focus on unique and cutting edge architecture. Houston has great natural foliage, as well as a focus on aesthetically pleasing and functional public spaces and parks. People do have preferences in terms of what they find aesthetically important.
I can think of a variety of large cities I personally consider uglier than both - Detroit, Hartford, Newark, Cleveland, Toledo, Phoenix, Las Vegas, Oklahoma City and San Antonio all come to mind. Houston and Dallas aren't the best or the worst here imo.
Thats a fair opinion.
I do think that the street is incredibly important to aesthetics because it makes up the vast majority of the public realm and is where people either driving or walking, will spend most of their time not spend in the office or at home. People spend more time on the street than in parks, for better or worse.
I agree with you, most people don't care about setbacks or FA ratios, but neither do most people care about what makes their car run, or how the sausage is made, they do care how the sausage tastes though and thats why millions of people visit Paris every year, even if they don't want to be told why they like a street.
Alot of what makes a city street makes you feel has to do with the way it is framed. Not unlike how the way a film is shot can make you feel certain ways. Dunkir was shot with lots of close ups which makes it feel claustrophobic and creates a sense of urgency and anxiety, even when the beaches of northern France are pretty wide open.
I'm far from an expert on this sort of thing, only an armature whos read perhaps half a dozen books on it out of interest, but its actually somewhat predictable based on the geometry what streets people will tend to really enjoy. I think a big part of the appeal of Paris isn't the museums at all, I think what alot of people like is just the way it feels to walk around the place. It isn't magic, it's science, or a pseudo science, rather.
Foliage can play a big part in framing a road too, it isn't just the buildings I agree. This is something Houston really has going for it and should be taking better advantage of.
Anyway, I don't think Houston or Dallas is particularly strong in this regard and I'm ok with that, but some people were really offended by my remarks about Houston not being particularly beautiful on the whole, so I felt like I owed a more complete explanation as to why I think that, as well as an explanation as to why, people on a while generally think that.
I don't disagree with your "worse than list" San Antonio aside, but at least Phoenix and Vegas offer vista view of the mountains which distract from their own awful street aesthetics Houston is flat, so you don't have mountains to look at to help you ignore the walmart parking lot in front of you.
Again, these are just my opinions.
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