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Like I said earlier, as more slave owning Anglos moved in and gained more power, the more they could push this issue. This continued to happen throughout the entire rebellion and into Texas' Republic and into its early statehood years.
All I said was that slavery was a reason (hence the Texas constitution sections about it).
I see you first start out with the words "Texas wanted independence from Mexico because Mexico outlawed slavery". From there you went from saying slavery was one of the main reasons for Texas independence (from Mexico) to it being an issue, on down to it being a factor and now it looks like you're just saying it's a reason. All of the ado and back to what someone said at the beginning of your little tirade, it was a reason, not one of the main reasons.
Such a pity you weren't taught "that many of the whites who moved in from slave states didn't like that they couldn't have their slaves in the United States of Mexico" and you only learned about it when in college. All those years wasted that you could have been feeding the grudge for injustices that occurred almost 200 years ago. All I know is, it has to be hard carrying this anger and resentment on a daily basis.
No one is dismissing slavery and it is agreed it did play it's part in history which is why most reasonable people are able to acknowledge it and move forward. Geez, a simple thread started only to say Happy Birthday, Texas and it turns into this.
You made the remark in post 24 "Moving on..." which I realize is intended to mean from the thread, but I have to say it would serve as good advice in life.
I don’t really care much about the reasons for Texas siding with the states over Mexico, so much as the reality that Texas is much better for it. I’ve been to Mexico 7 times and have zero inclination to move there despite the natural beauty and some really nice people that reside there. I came to Texas twenty years ago for a job that didn’t exist in Mexico at that time and have since done really well. I did not grow up in Texas and don’t have that deep-seeded affinity for the lore and culture that many natives have, yet I have come to appreciate the opportunities here and have no desire to move back east. Happy Birthday Texas!
No one is dismissing slavery and it is agreed it did play it's part in history which is why most reasonable people are able to acknowledge it and move forward. Geez, a simple thread started only to say Happy Birthday, Texas and it turns into this.
Good, I'm glad you agree that it played a part. Don't see how I was being unreasonable. I never dismissed other factors for independence and just brought up one of the others not mentioned. Why does that make you so angry and why project that anger onto me? Where do you see other people acknowledging it besides one poster (who I agree is reasonable)?
Good, I'm glad you agree that it played a part. Don't see how I was being unreasonable. I never dismissed other factors for independence and just brought up one of the others not mentioned. Why does that make you so angry and why project that anger onto me? Where do you see other people acknowledging it besides one poster (who I agree is reasonable)?
Listing slavery in your original post and nothing else for Texas seceding, with the support of many of the non-slave holding Hispanic population, does make it sound like you are making slavery the main or foremost reason when it wasn't. You're just backtracking and moving the goal post to falsely make it appear like you were correct the whole time.
Good, I'm glad you agree that it played a part. Don't see how I was being unreasonable. I never dismissed other factors for independence and just brought up one of the others not mentioned. Why does that make you so angry?
If you don't know the answer to your first question, it's beyond my reach to explain it to you.
Second question is such an obvious ploy to turn the tables away from yourself and onto me that it's laughable, but for entertainment's sake I'll try to answer it anyway in a simple, understandable form. I'm not the one who's angry and I'm not the one who tried to blow this thread up into another hate thread. You started off with a big bang and I assumed you thought you would have a boatload of people jumping in to champion your statements. That did not materialize and you were out in left field all by yourself and your argument that slavery was why Texas wanted her independence from Mexico went down from main reason to just a reason when you realized you weren't going to be able to take control of the thread and turn it into a completely different direction from what it was intended to be.
I would say sarcastically, better luck next time, but in light of today's trend of incessantly creating strife in everything I will not. It needs to just stop.
Listing slavery in your original post and nothing else for Texas seceding, with the support of many of the non-slave holding Hispanic population, does make it sound like you are making slavery the main or foremost reason when it wasn't. You're just backtracking and moving the goal post to falsely make it appear like you were correct the whole time.
Where did I move the goal posts? I've always stated slavery was a reason and never said it was the THE MAIN or ONLY reason. I literally clarified that in my second post. I'm just amazed that there's people who think it wasn't a factor at all. That's simply incredible.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lonestar2007
If you don't know the answer to your first question, it's beyond my reach to explain it to you.
Because you have nothing. Did I discount other reasons? No. Did I say slavery was the main/only reason? No. I said it was a reason.
Quote:
Second question is such an obvious ploy to turn the tables away from yourself and onto me that it's laughable, but for entertainment's sake I'll try to answer it anyway in a simple, understandable form. I'm not the one who's angry and I'm not the one who tried to blow this thread up into another hate thread. You started off with a big bang and I assumed you thought you would have a boatload of people jumping in to champion your statements. That did not materialize and you were out in left field all by yourself and your argument that slavery was why Texas wanted her independence from Mexico went down from main reason to just a reason when you realized you weren't going to be able to take control of the thread and turn it into a completely different direction from what it was intended to be.
I would say sarcastically, better luck next time, but in light of today's trend of incessantly creating strife in everything I will not. It needs to just stop.
It went how I thought. A few people don't want to acknowledge, but all you need to do is read unbiased sources and you'll see how it was for sure a reason... You said "no one was dismissing slavery" but that isn't true. Reasonable people will acknowledge that it was a factor and not try to wash-over it.
I'm glad you agree with me that slavery played a factor because that's all I was saying. Why don't Texas history books talk about slaves being at the Alamo (and other battles) and ultimately released? Why aren't students being taught that slavery was a factor? I figure it's the same reason why the slave trade got a new name in Texas history books (where some teachers refused to teach it that way).
Where did I move the goal posts? I've always stated slavery was a reason and never said it was the THE MAIN or ONLY reason. I literally clarified that in my second post. I'm just amazed that there's people who think it wasn't a factor at all. That's simply incredible.
Because you have nothing. Did I discount other reasons? No. Did I say slavery was the main/only reason? No. I said it was a reason.
It went how I thought. A few people don't want to acknowledge, but all you need to do is read unbiased sources and you'll see how it was for sure a reason... You said "no one was dismissing slavery" but that isn't true. Reasonable people will acknowledge that it was a factor and not try to wash-over it.
I'm glad you agree with me that slavery played a factor because that's all I was saying. Why don't Texas history books talk about slaves being at the Alamo (and other battles) and ultimately released? Why aren't students being taught that slavery was a factor? I figure it's the same reason why the slave trade got a new name in Texas history books (where some teachers refused to teach it that way).
Let's get clear on this. I am not agreeing with you. You strike me as a disagreeable and argumentative person although I could be wrong since I don't know you and only going by what you are saying here.
I agreed that slavery has played a part in history. You say "Reasonable people will acknowledge that it was a factor and not try to wash-over it". So, what is it exactly you are saying here? Are you saying all the people who are celebrating the removal of statues, plaques , school names, street names, etc. are unreasonable people? Are they trying to wash over it (slavery) and do they think the removal of these things really does help with the healing process by promoting the 'out sight out of mind' theory'? Wow, it's really hard at times to keep up with the process here. One day something is good to promote and a big flack about how it isn't taught and talked about enough and the next day it's destroy or hide all evidence it ever happened so the shame will be forgotten and fade away.
History is history, good or bad. It is something we can learn from and that is why we record it and again, we learn from the bad and well as from the good. Reasonable people know this and no, they do not try to "wash it away" but by the same token, they do not spend their lives wallowing in self pity over history that happened almost two hundred years ago. They learn from it and move on.
I said you appeared to be an augmentative person and I'm going to stand by that and therefore I'm going to leave you to argue with yourself and anyone else who cares to argue with you, but it won't be me. I live in the present and look forward to the future and have so many better things to do with my time than this.
Happy Birthday to the great state of Texas and God bless her.
Let's get clear on this. I am not agreeing with you. You strike me as a disagreeable and argumentative person although I could be wrong since I don't know you and only going by what you are saying here.
I agreed that slavery has played a part in history. You say "Reasonable people will acknowledge that it was a factor and not try to wash-over it". So, what is it exactly you are saying here? Are you saying all the people who are celebrating the removal of statues, plaques , school names, street names, etc. are unreasonable people? Are they trying to wash over it (slavery) and do they think the removal of these things really does help with the healing process by promoting the 'out sight out of mind' theory'? Wow, it's really hard at times to keep up with the process here. One day something is good to promote and a big flack about how it isn't taught and talked about enough and the next day it's destroy or hide all evidence it ever happened so the shame will be forgotten and fade away.
History is history, good or bad. It is something we can learn from and that is why we record it and again, we learn from the bad and well as from the good. Reasonable people know this and no, they do not try to "wash it away" but by the same token, they do not spend their lives wallowing in self pity over history that happened almost two hundred years ago. They learn from it and move on.
I said you appeared to be an augmentative person and I'm going to stand by that and therefore I'm going to leave you to argue with yourself and anyone else who cares to argue with you, but it won't be me. I live in the present and look forward to the future and have so many better things to do with my time than this.
Happy Birthday to the great state of Texas and God bless her.
LOL! How is renaming schools, etc., the same thing as teaching parts of history that weren't taught as often? Those old street names named after confederate generals will still be mentioned in the history books. No need to have monuments, etc., after scum who wanted slavery legal. Renaming Dowling Street to Emancipation isn't washing over history. Taking down the statue of someone who wanted to keep people in chains is not washing over history. Washing over history is not mentioned all sides to a story.
The bolded parts of your post show a lot. I'm glad you're done because you'll expose yourself more.
Where did I move the goal posts? I've always stated slavery was a reason and never said it was the THE MAIN or ONLY reason. I literally clarified that in my second post. I'm just amazed that there's people who think it wasn't a factor at all. That's simply incredible.
Because you have nothing. Did I discount other reasons? No. Did I say slavery was the main/only reason? No. I said it was a reason.
It went how I thought. A few people don't want to acknowledge, but all you need to do is read unbiased sources and you'll see how it was for sure a reason... You said "no one was dismissing slavery" but that isn't true. Reasonable people will acknowledge that it was a factor and not try to wash-over it.
I'm glad you agree with me that slavery played a factor because that's all I was saying. Why don't Texas history books talk about slaves being at the Alamo (and other battles) and ultimately released? Why aren't students being taught that slavery was a factor? I figure it's the same reason why the slave trade got a new name in Texas history books (where some teachers refused to teach it that way).
Other than them allowing slavery when they seceded, do you have any actual proof that it was a factor? Surely there must be dozens and dozens of statements made by Texans that this is why they were fighting. Not the change in the Mexican constitution, but slavery. If you can't find this perhaps you are just wrong.
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