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Old 03-26-2020, 12:33 PM
 
Location: I don't know these days
7,055 posts, read 4,815,049 times
Reputation: 4547

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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPatel304 View Post
A (healthy) economy benefits us all. You make it sound like a good economy is only for the rich/priviledged.



It was a bit blunt of him to say, but we all agree with him (to some extent), which is why we don't shut the economy down during flu season.



This is why I support the current lock down.

Me a PRO-LIFE person it was not good to hear, he should resign IMO.



Many people who have relatives/acquaintances of that age group wouldn't be liking him much if at all right now.


We need an economy (which many do agree with) which is why Trump is "hoping" he can reactivate certain areas of the country on/by Easter Sunday - doesn't mean it'll happen though after seeing data and speaking with his professionals. We need to see after the 15 day wait to see what is what.
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Old 03-26-2020, 12:39 PM
 
510 posts, read 250,787 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atgss View Post
Me a PRO-LIFE person it was not good to hear, he should resign IMO.

Many people who have relatives/acquaintances of that age group wouldn't be liking him much if at all right now.
Those same people shouldn't like the fact that we keep the economy open during flu season either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by atgss View Post
We need an economy (which many do agree with) which is why Trump is "hoping" he can reactivate certain areas of the country on/by Easter Sunday - doesn't mean it'll happen though after seeing data and speaking with his professionals. We need to see after the 15 day wait to see what is what.
That's how I perceivd his message as well. It seems like he 'hopes' to have certain parts open by Easter, but that he is listening to the experts on this one and taking it day by day.

He makes a good point about the fact that a lot of the country is very rural and desolate and, if those areas are not being affected, then it doesn't make sense to lock them down. I guess we really just need more information and time to determine the best course of action.
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Old 03-26-2020, 01:02 PM
 
Location: I don't know these days
7,055 posts, read 4,815,049 times
Reputation: 4547
Quote:
Originally Posted by DPatel304 View Post
Those same people shouldn't like the fact that we keep the economy open during flu season either.



That's how I perceivd his message as well. It seems like he 'hopes' to have certain parts open by Easter, but that he is listening to the experts on this one and taking it day by day.

He makes a good point about the fact that a lot of the country is very rural and desolate and, if those areas are not being affected, then it doesn't make sense to lock them down. I guess we really just need more information and time to determine the best course of action.
The leftists love to twist his words, I understood like you the same. Can't live with fear either - just not healthy! Trump also makes a good point that if the economy doesn't open up soon enough more people will die from depression or suicide than the virus could ever kill - at least to what he and we know of this virus now anyway. Things can change, GOD could potentially make this virus go away quickly as it almost came IMO. I believe in Matthew 19:26.

I wonder even with a potential vaccine could become "the new normal" when it comes to either keeping the economy open or not.

Not everyone will want the vaccine as they don't want to chance potential future health implications.
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Old 03-26-2020, 01:16 PM
 
770 posts, read 398,314 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPatel304 View Post
A (healthy) economy benefits us all. You make it sound like a good economy is only for the rich/priviledged.
A healthy capitalistic society does benefit it's society the most when its economy is doing good. It is most detrimental to its members of society when the economy is not. It is important to keep in mind though that capitalism/profit do not exclusively go hand in hand with either happiness, safety or benefits to society. Other non capitalist societies benefit from these things as well. It is not that capitalism is bad (or good) as it is just a way of governance and of an economy, just that it does not have exclusive rights to those things.

A capitalist society benefits the rich/privileged the most and it is those groups (those with enough resources to invest in it to grow their resources) that have to most to lose when things negatively affect it. Similar to any organism, inadequately regulated capitalism will fight for its survival at any cost, even if it is detrimental to the majority.

What we see unfold before us because of Covid-19 is a couple of things.
1. Our economy is more fragile then a lot of us thought
2. The detrimental aspects of our capitalistic society is now in a spotlight and amplified
3. Some of those who have the most to lose from our economy doing poorly are advocating putting people in harms way to return to normal

With those things being said, I want people reasonably safe and I want the economy to do well (as I have a 401k also). Its not all or nothing thing for me. For me though, keeping people safe is more important then 401ks and the stock market doing well, so reasonable safety is higher on the priority scale. Once we get this situation (more) reasonably safe, (more) reasonably under control, then we can send people back to work. My hope is not until then. Doing so before then is selfish, unethical and wrong. I get that some people are ok with having their grandparents (and family members) die for the sake of the 401k, economy and stock market but I am not. It seems a significant portion of people feel the same way I do and this is encouraging to hear.
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Old 03-26-2020, 01:21 PM
 
510 posts, read 250,787 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txbullsfan View Post
I get that some people are ok with having their grandparents (and family members) die for the sake of the 401k, economy and stock market but I am not. It seems a significant portion of people feel the same way I do and this is encouraging to hear.
Do you support shutting down the economy during flu season? If not, then you are also okay having your family members die for the sake of the 401k, economy, and stock market.

People die during flu season and those deaths can be prevented with a similar lock down, but, as far as I can tell, nobody wants to lock down the country every flu season to save lives. We would rather have some people die for the sake of our economy.
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Old 03-26-2020, 02:26 PM
 
770 posts, read 398,314 times
Reputation: 1151
Quote:
Originally Posted by DPatel304 View Post
Do you support shutting down the economy during flu season? If not, then you are also okay having your family members die for the sake of the 401k, economy, and stock market.
If with Influenza/Flu there was no way to reasonably minimize risk with a vaccine, not enough hospital beds when it does reach fever pitch (requiring death panel triaging) and there is no innate immunity in the population, yes. Absolutely. Shut that Shi ite down.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DPatel304 View Post
People die during flu season and those deaths can be prevented with a similar lock down, but, as far as I can tell, nobody wants to lock down the country every flu season to save lives. We would rather have some people die for the sake of our economy.
Ahhh man.... This topic of the severity of the flu virus versus Covid-19 / SARS has been debated with you ad nauseum by multiple forum members on how Covid-19 / SARS is much different and much more severe then the influenza virus. Similar to how both a strong Thunderstorm (the Flu) and a storm with a CAT 4 hurricane (Coronaviruses) each require respect and steps to mitigate but the steps needed to deal with it and ultimately save lives is different depending on the severity of the storm. Do you understand there are different steps between preparing for an innate severe thunderstorm and preparing for a CAT 4 hurricane? Or should the steps / evacuation orders and severity of the steps be "blanket" across the board / the same?
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Old 03-26-2020, 02:29 PM
 
510 posts, read 250,787 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txbullsfan View Post
If with Influenza/Flu there was no way to reasonably minimize risk with a vaccine, not enough hospital beds when it does reach fever pitch (requiring death panel triaging) and there is no innate immunity in the population, yes. Absolutely. Shut that Shi ite down.
People do die during flu season and some of those deaths could be prevented with a lockdown, but everyone (including you and myself) choose the economy over saving lives.

Quote:
Originally Posted by txbullsfan View Post
Ahhh man.... This topic of the severity of the flu virus versus Covid-19 / SARS has been debated with you ad nauseum by multiple forum members on how Covid-19 / SARS is much different and much more severe then the influenza virus. Similar to how both a strong Thunderstorm (the Flu) and a storm with a CAT 4 hurricane (Coronaviruses) each require respect and steps to mitigate but the steps needed to deal with it and ultimately save lives is different depending on the severity of the storm. Do you understand there are different steps between preparing for an innate severe thunderstorm and preparing for a CAT 4 hurricane? Or should the steps and severity of the steps be "blanket" across the board / the same?
I'm not sure why people keep debating this with me, because I absolutely agree the COVID-19 is significantly worse than the flu. I've said it numerous times, and I've never said otherwise.
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Old 03-26-2020, 02:55 PM
 
Location: Denver via Austin
3,651 posts, read 6,957,511 times
Reputation: 4673
Quote:
Originally Posted by DPatel304 View Post
A (healthy) economy benefits us all. You make it sound like a good economy is only for the rich/priviledged.
It mostly is if you look at who received the wealth that has been generated since the last recession. The goal of the national economic paradigm that’s been around since the 1980s hasn’t been to increase the public’s standard of living or necessarily even maintain it. It’s been to increase production rates through automation and reduce overhead through globalization so that the gains can go to shareholders, most of whom are either playing the economy like a monopoly game or supplementing income.

The economic output of an average worker today is 2-3x higher than the average worker in the 80s, yet the ability for the average worker to buy a home near where their wages are earned, send a kid to higher education, or pay for medical procedures has decreased and continues to do so. With increased automation comes an expectation for the workers not losing their jobs to multi-task, so technology hasn’t improved the average worker’s living standards so much as increased the stress of both jobs and home life.

There’s more than enough wealth to go around to maintain the current standard of living without the machines running full steam ahead. This pandemic will either cause millions of deaths in America or call the elites’ 40 years of bluffing.
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Old 03-26-2020, 07:00 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX
11,753 posts, read 10,517,600 times
Reputation: 6953
My parents are elderly and they don't want to die. I don't want them to die.

Maybe they need to drop Lt. Gov Dan Patrick in the middle of Milan, Italy for a few days.
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Old 03-26-2020, 07:19 PM
 
510 posts, read 250,787 times
Reputation: 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by cBach View Post
My parents are elderly and they don't want to die. I don't want them to die.
Nobody wants anyone to die, but sometimes we have to make a tough choice to keep the economy going even if it means risking lives.
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